Question?

[CJxDanielle]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

Don't worry...we all learn something new everyday. And you're much younger than the rest of us, so you just have some catching up to do.

true!

[Brooklynn]

I have to totally agree with the GSD's. I wouldnt own one now because of the slope in the top line! I really loved GSD's back in the day when they were correct. I do believe the way their standard is now is detrimental to the breed as a working bred dog. They have more problems with hips and I just can't handle a dog with more issues than what we have to deal with in poorly bred yorkies.

Donna

[Brooklynn]

Originally Posted by Brooklynn

I have to totally agree with the GSD's. I wouldnt own one now because of the slope in the top line! I really loved GSD's back in the day when they were correct. I do believe the way their standard is now is detrimental to the breed as a working bred dog. They have more problems with hips and I just can't handle a dog with more issues than what we have to deal with in poorly bred yorkies.

Donna

And let me add to this...that is why I would LOVE to see health, structure and movement be a top priority in the yorkies and then keep the color true to the standard as well.

Donna

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Lily del Chiesa

And you won't here in the states especially since the AKC has recognized them. They are being bred here with too much emphasis on "cosmetics". One example is wrinkle. So much so, that quite a few end up having to get eye lifts so that they can see The breed should not have have excessive connective tissue from their skin to their muscles- it's supposed to be loose, but COME ON.

I've seen too many breeds over the years become recognized by the AKC then a bunch of BYB's jump on the band wagon thinking they're going to get rich quick and within a very short time, the breed changes so drastically, from one end of the spectrum to the other, and is a mere shadow what the dog was bred for in the first place. My grandparents raised GSDs for over 20 years and I completely agree with the OP- the majority are about useless as far as what they were bred for originally- still intelligent for the most part but health & structure-wise, they no where near what they were and should still be today. You see very few "correct" GSDs these days, which is sad as well as an outrage.

My Neos come from true working lines and are imported- all 4 of them (at the moment lol) and they WORK. They come from flock, estate and vineyard guardians (not from the past but currently working) as well as family members. I entrust my livestock to them- they lay down in the pastures and watch for predators or uninvited "guests". They have natural protective/guardian instincts without being "Crazy psycho dog" aggressive

These are just a few of the reasons as to why I refuse to register mine with AKC but stay with the parent registry. This is why when I decide to breed one of my females, I do so with temperament, working ability and "healthy" true confirmation as priorities. So what if I can't run obedience or agility through AKC for points and recognition (I could if I transferred over to the AKC)- They are excellent family dogs, love the tasks that are asked of them and put on quite a show whenever they are working in open agility or obedience (such hams at times lol) My guys and gals are healthy, happy, intelligent and true to the European standard from which they origited.


Please don't take this response as "having a tone" I'm just stating my opinion and have really enjoyed this thread

Your posts are very informative, and help educate what's happening with some of the other breeds. It really takes a strong breed club to resist on the latest fads and not succumb to temptation to change the standard just because that's what the pet buying public is into now. I know the YTCA gets bucketfuls of criticism for not changing the standard to accept alternative colors, and I'm glad that there are members who stand firm in their decision to protect and preserve the standard. A dog breed standard should never be "trendy." Changes in standard should only be done with extreme caution and with as much knowledge as possible on what type of impact this will have on the breed.

[Lily del Chiesa]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

Your posts are very informative, and help educate what's happening with some of the other breeds. It really takes a strong breed club to resist on the latest fads and not succumb to temptation to change the standard just because that's what the pet buying public is into now. I know the YTCA gets bucketfuls of criticism for not changing the standard to accept alternative colors, and I'm glad that there are members who stand firm in their decision to protect and preserve the standard. A dog breed standard should never be "trendy." Changes in standard should only be done with extreme caution and with as much knowledge as possible on what type of impact this will have on the breed.

Awwwww shucks LOL Thank you- I just wish more "breeders" would stop and think of the health and temperament aspects of the dog before dreaming of the bottom line or choosing to follow the latest trend.
Education- and I mean a good SOLID education, not a quick browse online or mentoring from one breeder alone is desperately needed in the majority of breeds today... just sayin'

[DvlshAngel985]

I find this thread very interesting, and have a question. Sorry if this makes me sound like a "noob" but what's the difference between "working breed" and "working bred." Does the first mean a category that the AKC has and the second a line of dogs that does a job and does it well so you breed from those lines?

I really want to understand the difference because someone on here has made the use the "working bred" term when referring to her yorkie, and the yorkie was far from standard. I have nothing against off standard yorkies (see avatar ) but I don't think a cutie like mine should be bred. He has nothing other than cuteness to offer the world, and that's simply not enough.

One last question, even our toy breed yorkies had some working function at some point in time, right? How many of your yorkies actually hunt rats and mice? How does a show coat affect the yorkies ability to do this job? Or is it that the yorkie has been transformed so much that they are just lap dogs and nothing more? Just curious!

[CJxDanielle]

Originally Posted by DvlshAngel985

I find this thread very interesting, and have a question. Sorry if this makes me sound like a "noob" but what's the difference between "working breed" and "working bred." Does the first mean a category that the AKC has and the second a line of dogs that does a job and does it well so you breed from those lines?

One last question, even our toy breed yorkies had some working function at some point in time, right? How many of your yorkies actually hunt rats and mice? How does a show coat affect the yorkies ability to do this job? Or is it that the yorkie has been transformed so much that they are just lap dogs and nothing more? Just curious!

Its no problem! I can see the confusion
A Working Breed (i consider) has two definitions. Now this is just for me, but the first definition is a breed in the Working Group of the AKC. The second definition could be a dog breed that was bred to work (very descriptive I know ). I use the first as a definition of the working breed.

Working bred (for me, now it could be different for someone else or someone else could explain it better) is when a specific dog breed is bred only to perform the task it was originally created to do. For example, a working bred border collie would be from a line of dog bred only to herd, guard flock, etc. The dogs aren't always standard (because as you have already read) the standard can affect the dogs ability to work. So sometimes working bred dogs aren't standard because they wouldn't be able to perform their task properly.

On the other hand, their are dogs bred strictly for conformation. Some breeds bred for conformation (although standard) can't do the job is good as a working bred dog because of said standard.

I hope all that made sense because I kind of feel like a rambled all over the place. So basically what you said you think it was is what I consider it to be.


And your last question is a good one! I think some yorkie breeders now might try and direct that purpose else where. We don't exactly have the rat problem we use to anymore so its kind of as if the purpose faded out (or people use cats to do it). I know a few toy breeders who then direct that "purpose" to a dog sport such as Agility, Obedience, etc.

I'm not yorkie breeder and probably haven't been alive as long as some of the great breeders we have one YT have been breeding. So they will probably be able to answer that last question better than I can.

[DvlshAngel985]

Originally Posted by CJxDanielle

Its no problem! I can see the confusion
A Working Breed (i consider) has two definitions. Now this is just for me, but the first definition is a breed in the Working Group of the AKC. The second definition could be a dog breed that was bred to work (very descriptive I know ). I use the first as a definition of the working breed.

Working bred (for me, now it could be different for someone else or someone else could explain it better) is when a specific dog breed is bred only to perform the task it was originally created to do. For example, a working bred border collie would be from a line of dog bred only to herd, guard flock, etc. The dogs aren't always standard (because as you have already read) the standard can affect the dogs ability to work. So sometimes working bred dogs aren't standard because they wouldn't be able to perform their task properly.

On the other hand, their are dogs bred strictly for conformation. Some breeds bred for conformation (although standard) can't do the job is good as a working bred dog because of said standard.

I hope all that made sense because I kind of feel like a rambled all over the place. So basically what you said you think it was is what I consider it to be.


And your last question is a good one! I think some yorkie breeders now might try and direct that purpose else where. We don't exactly have the rat problem we use to anymore so its kind of as if the purpose faded out (or people use cats to do it). I know a few toy breeders who then direct that "purpose" to a dog sport such as Agility, Obedience, etc.

I'm not yorkie breeder and probably haven't been alive as long as some of the great breeders we have one YT have been breeding. So they will probably be able to answer that last question better than I can.

You did good. Your rambling helped me understand this a bit better. It does make me wonder why that person used "working bred" for a yorkie. Herding dogs I understand, but a yorkie? Unless she has a really bad rat problem in her community or something else.

[CJxDanielle]

Originally Posted by DvlshAngel985

Unless she has a really bad rat problem in her community or something else.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by DvlshAngel985

I find this thread very interesting, and have a question. Sorry if this makes me sound like a "noob" but what's the difference between "working breed" and "working bred." Does the first mean a category that the AKC has and the second a line of dogs that does a job and does it well so you breed from those lines?

I really want to understand the difference because someone on here has made the use the "working bred" term when referring to her yorkie, and the yorkie was far from standard. I have nothing against off standard yorkies (see avatar ) but I don't think a cutie like mine should be bred. He has nothing other than cuteness to offer the world, and that's simply not enough.

One last question, even our toy breed yorkies had some working function at some point in time, right? How many of your yorkies actually hunt rats and mice? How does a show coat affect the yorkies ability to do this job? Or is it that the yorkie has been transformed so much that they are just lap dogs and nothing more? Just curious!

I don't think most yorkies would be considered just lap dogs, while they are beautiful, most still have that terrier attitude, and a better watch dog I don't think you can find. Joey may not be able to protect me if an intruder tries to enter the house, but he sure will alert me!

I don't think a yorkies long coat has been shown to be in any way detrimental to it's health, maybe those who have to grow up in mills and can't get regular grooming have a problem though. Some people seem to think that just because a yorkie is beautiful, this beauty is causing health problems, but there are no known health risks associated with our breed's standard. Most of the problems and illnesses you see in yorkies are more a result of its extreme popularity and breeders who breed not for a love of the breed, but for profit. Of course, profit motivated breeders will always take shortcuts.

[Brooklynn]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

I don't think most yorkies would be considered just lap dogs, while they are beautiful, most still have that terrier attitude, and a better watch dog I don't think you can find. Joey may not be able to protect me if an intruder tries to enter the house, but he sure will alert me!

I don't think a yorkies long coat has been shown to be in any way detrimental to it's health, maybe those who have to grow up in mills and can't get regular grooming have a problem though. Some people seem to think that just because a yorkie is beautiful, this beauty is causing health problems, but there are no known health risks associated with our breed's standard. Most of the problems and illnesses you see in yorkies are more a result of its extreme popularity and breeders who breed not for a love of the breed, but for profit. Of course, profit motivated breeders will always take shortcuts.

While mine love to lay in my lap but they are far from just being lap dogs LOL...they are always on alert even though you might think they are sleeping.
I just got an email from a lady that owns one of my puppies and she said if it wasn't for her barking at her at home and kept it up until she said what's wrong, the yorkie took her to her leaking A/C in the bedroom closet where water was all over the place...Coats aren't the problem, it's as Nancy just posted it's profit breeders movtivated by money and they always take shortcuts.
I believe our standard doesn't hurt our breed it's just poor breeders make the problem with health issues the big problem.

Donna

[DvlshAngel985]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

I don't think most yorkies would be considered just lap dogs, while they are beautiful, most still have that terrier attitude, and a better watch dog I don't think you can find. Joey may not be able to protect me if an intruder tries to enter the house, but he sure will alert me!

I don't think a yorkies long coat has been shown to be in any way detrimental to it's health, maybe those who have to grow up in mills and can't get regular grooming have a problem though. Some people seem to think that just because a yorkie is beautiful, this beauty is causing health problems, but there are no known health risks associated with our breed's standard. Most of the problems and illnesses you see in yorkies are more a result of its extreme popularity and breeders who breed not for a love of the breed, but for profit. Of course, profit motivated breeders will always take shortcuts.

I didn't mean health, I meant job. I know their hair can't be detrimental to their health, but like you said, these little guys are terriers and I wonder how much the long coat gets in the way of digging, burying, chasing, and all that good stuff I see Kaji do. I understand everything you said, and I'm sorry I didn't make my post clear. I just imagined in my head a beautiful long coated yorkie running around and being active like a dog should be. I just wonder how matted and uncomfortable that may be. I didn't mean to insinuate that the standard was hurting yorkies.

[Cha Cha]

I understand what CJxDanielle is saying too. I have a lot of friends with working Australian Shepards. They often talk about the differences between the "show" dog and the "working" dog. Sometimes, it is not that the "show" dog can't work because the standard has changed so much, but because it "won't" work. Herding is a natural instinct of these dogs, but the desire to work is also a trait strictly bred into working lines.

[Brooklynn]

Originally Posted by DvlshAngel985

I didn't mean health, I meant job. I know their hair can't be detrimental to their health, but like you said, these little guys are terriers and I wonder how much the long coat gets in the way of digging, burying, chasing, and all that good stuff I see Kaji do. I understand everything you said, and I'm sorry I didn't make my post clear. I just imagined in my head a beautiful long coated yorkie running around and being active like a dog should be. I just wonder how matted and uncomfortable that may be. I didn't mean to insinuate that the standard was hurting yorkies.

All my yorkies when finished are buzzed down, cut down And the show dogs are in wrappers and Radar who stays in wraps because of long hair is no different than the others, he gets to run out the doggie door, roll in the grass, digs, chases balls and throws his toys in the air and his coat is to the floor but in wrappers doesn't hinder his movement at all LOL...hubby calls them tea bags LOL

[DvlshAngel985]

Originally Posted by Brooklynn

All my yorkies when finished are buzzed down, cut down And the show dogs are in wrappers and Radar who stays in wraps because of long hair is no different than the others, he gets to run out the doggie door, roll in the grass, digs, chases balls and throws his toys in the air and his coat is to the floor but in wrappers doesn't hinder his movement at all LOL...hubby calls them tea bags LOL

How cute! Tea bags. I've always wondered what the extra care was for such long coats. I'm glad you allow your show dogs to be dogs too!