Limited Registration Concerns

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by mohawkmalli

then when this person started breeding how was it that they got their good name??? Did they not have to buy from a "perfect" breeder who was afraid of selling their breeding rights? And yes I think that some of it is about the money otherwise people would not be trying to sell the babies for thousands of dollars!!!!

As Lynn pointed out, they get to know the breeder as a mentor, work with them and learn from them FIRST. This benefits both parties--the breeder gets to know the new owner well enough to feel comfortable entrusting their lines with them on full registration and the new owner has been taught by an experienced breeder and has gained the experience and information they will need to begin breeding.

[scrapindee]

This has been a very interesting thread.

As some of you know, the half Yorkie half Biewer is called a splitter by many folks. While everyone may have their opinion of breeding to a splitter, I am appalled at how many people have called me interested in a Biewer and wanting to breed to their CKC or unregistered Yorkie. My opinion, is that if you were wanting to be breeding back to a Yorkie, you would want to be breeding to a champion Yorkie with an excellent pedigree-- Not your average pet Yorkie.

I attempt to screen people very thoroughly -- I have been told that I have been too nosy because I call the Humane Society, search and rescue's, all the vets in your town, animal control to see if they've heard of you. I will call your neighbors.

It is important to me that those who get to have one of my puppies continue to send me pictures and information about their puppy in the future. I sell on spay/neuter contracts. My contract says if you do not follow through with the spay neuter I can remove the puppy. I too rebate following receipt of proof of spay/neutering. I hold the IBC and US pedigrees/registrations until I receive the paperwork.

Most puppies are pet quality. Regardless of breed, there are too many breeders that will sell to anyone. I may be strange in that I feel a need to stay connected to my breedings. If the buyer is unhappy with that, there are other breeders out there.

[Dreamer74]

Originally Posted by Wigfur

It has my curiosity up, I mean I know people do a lot of research on the inet,and I know that when you find a breeder they may have a web page as well. It makes me wonder how many people would rather pay less on the inet then pay more at a breeder right there near them? Leo was purchased from a breeder two hours away. But I know a lot of others that have had their puppies shipped to them.

What is your preferred method? Do you ship your puppies at all? Or do you only sell to those that will drive up to get them? Many of the breeders I talked to when getting Scott's lab (had to be a good dog as it is his service dog) said they ship puppies a lot via plane!

Well I can tell you that Buddy was purchased locally and Bella was a 1600 mile round trip car ride to go get her. I opted to not have her shipped because the only option was for her to fly from Michigan to Houston Texas and back to Iowa or Minnesota. I would purchase both ways again, I think it all just depends what you are looking for. The internet does play a huge part I believe, and I feel you either need to be an established breeder with a waiting list or be willing to be available on the internet to get a top price for your dogs.

[Dreamer74]

I think all of this brings up a few big questions
1- Do you believe you should pay the same for a limited registration dog as you would for full registration?
2-Do you think you should pay the same price for a dog with Champion backgrounds as you would for one without?
3- What about pet quality vs show quality? Does a dog alway warrant a high price to get the best buyer? My personal opinion is sometimes a person who can only pay 500.00 is a better dog owner than the one who just paid you 2500.00.

[mohawkmalli]

Originally Posted by Dreamer74

I think all of this brings up a few big questions
1- Do you believe you should pay the same for a limited registration dog as you would for full registration?
2-Do you think you should pay the same price for a dog with Champion backgrounds as you would for one without?
3- What about pet quality vs show quality? Does a dog alway warrant a high price to get the best buyer? My personal opinion is sometimes a person who can only pay 500.00 is a better dog owner than the one who just paid you 2500.00.

Those are very good points to make...I would not want to pay the same amount for a limited registration as I would for full. The bloodline would depend on if the dog was being used for show or bred. I think that there should be a pet price and a show dog price. I know that yes I love my babies and I would do anything in the world for them (such as paying $4000.00 dollars to have whole walnuts removed from my boxers intestines) but there is no way I could ever afford to pay $2500.00 for a pup.

[Ladymom]

Originally Posted by Dreamer74

I think all of this brings up a few big questions
1- Do you believe you should pay the same for a limited registration dog as you would for full registration?

A reputable breeder sells her puppies with a spay/neuter contract and limited registration. I would expect to pay more for a puppy from a reputable breeder who cares about her lines and producing a healthy puppy close to the breed standard.

2-Do you think you should pay the same price for a dog with Champion backgrounds as you would for one without?

It depends on how far back the champions are. Anything further back than three generations doesn't mean much. You get what you pay for. A puppy with a good pedigree will grow up to look and act like a Yorkie is supposed to. I would certainly expect to pay more for a quality puppy.

3- What about pet quality vs show quality? Does a dog alway warrant a high price to get the best buyer? My personal opinion is sometimes a person who can only pay 500.00 is a better dog owner than the one who just paid you 2500.00.

There isn't much difference between pet and show quality puppies from a reputable breeder. "Pet quality" puppies from a backyard breeder or a pet store/puppy mill often grow up to be pretty far from the breed standard.

This article from Foxstone Maltese is an excellent explanation of pet quality vs. show quality.

Maltese Show Dog Versus Maltese Pet.....What is the difference?

[Jeri Cunningham]

Every single one of the puppies I have sold have been neutered or spayed. I am very careful to explain the reasons this needs to be done. I keep two of my puppies as pets and spayed Chelsey but not Kayla as I may decide to breed her but don't make that determination until they are two years old. Chelsey was to little after two so I spayed her.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Ladymom

There isn't much difference between pet and show quality puppies from a reputable breeder. "Pet quality" puppies from a backyard breeder or a pet store/puppy mill often grow up to be pretty far from the breed standard.

This article from Foxstone Maltese is an excellent explanation of pet quality vs. show quality.

Maltese Show Dog Versus Maltese Pet.....What is the difference?

Thanks for posting this, this is something that confuses so many people. They think if they are not going to show or breed there is no sense going to a show breeder.

[mohawkmalli]

I like to hear someone that does not breed them as soon as they are able. I don't think some people realize their little bodies can't handle it. Almost like breeding your teenager which no one would hopefully do LOL!!!

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by Jeri Cunningham

Every single one of the puppies I have sold have been neutered or spayed.

Same here...all of mine have been spayed or neutered with complete cooperation from the new owners. (yes, I consider myself very lucky in that aspect) Well, all but one...there is still one of my female pups that has not been spayed.

[Dreamer74]

Originally Posted by Ladymom

There isn't much difference between pet and show quality puppies from a reputable breeder. "Pet quality" puppies from a backyard breeder or a pet store/puppy mill often grow up to be pretty far from the breed standard.

This article from Foxstone Maltese is an excellent explanation of pet quality vs. show quality.

Maltese Show Dog Versus Maltese Pet.....What is the difference?

I agree you should pay more from a reputable breeder than a backyard breeder. But occasionally even those with the best breeding throw a large pup that does not meet standard, thus making it a pet not show quality. I would expect that this pup would cost me less.
Also many reputable breeders sell pups to other reputable breeders to add different lines to thier stock, I would expect that if they are getting full breeding rights they would pay more to that breeder than I would for a pup with limited registration.
I have also seen puppies with no champions in thier background selling for as much as those comming directly from championed parents. And these people have waiting lists just like the best breeders do. I can not really explain why it happens other than breeder personality can play as much of a role as dog quality.

[Ladymom]

Originally Posted by Dreamer74

I have also seen puppies with no champions in thier background selling for as much as those comming directly from championed parents.

You are absolutely right about that. You have to be very careful about screening a breeder. I think many people assume a puppy from a show breeder is really expensive, but often they are less than a puppy from a pet store or some of the internet websites that are brokers to puppy mills.

The point is not to be able to say that your dog has "champion lines", but the fact that if his parents, grandparents and great grandparents were champions, he will probably look pretty close to what a Yorkie supposed to.

[Dreamer74]

Originally Posted by Ladymom

You are absolutely right about that. You have to be very careful about screening a breeder. I think many people assume a puppy from a show breeder is really expensive, but often they are less than a puppy from a pet store or some of the internet websites that are brokers to puppy mills.

The point is not to be able to say that your dog has "champion lines", but the fact that if his parents, grandparents and great grandparents were champions, he will probably look pretty close to what a Yorkie supposed to.

I would love to show Buddy, but I am lacking in knowledge and time at the moment. His parents were shown but the breeder found she did not have the time to keep competing so they never earned a championship title.

[Wigfur]

1- Do you believe you should pay the same for a limited registration dog as you would for full registration? I think if you are purchasing the pet and they are "fixed" then they should be less then if you were to get one and be able to breed and make profit.
2-Do you think you should pay the same price for a dog with Champion backgrounds as you would for one without? No I do not, I think it's like anything else we purchase. If you are buying name brand clothing you will pay more then you would pay for the "plain" clothing.
3- What about pet quality vs show quality? Does a dog alway warrant a high price to get the best buyer? My personal opinion is sometimes a person who can only pay 500.00 is a better dog owner than the one who just paid you 2500.00. I agree with you. I think you do not have to have money or spend tons of money to be a good pet parent. Just as you do not have to be wealthy to be a good parent to your children. I often think a lot of people pay the higher amount just as they would for a flashy car or a huge ring, for others to say "wow you paid THAT much for your dog" and I"m not saying ALL that paid higher prices do this.. but I do know in my 31 yrs I've learned a lot about people and those that need to flash the money they have (or the credit they rack up lol) are empty on the inside.

[Baron]

Originally Posted by Wigfur

Okay I was kinda wondering this myself... how much is protecting the breed,and how much is fearing more competition.. I mean, with the inet now and so forth, people can buy a puppy from all over the world and have it shipped to them. So if there's a breeder in your town,but the one on the inet is cheaper even with shipment, which would you choose? I'm sure this makes it hard for the breeders to sell with so much competition and yes there are a lot of scary breeders out there I have to agree.

So I have a question for breeders here....
1. How has the ability to advertise on the Inet and ship puppies hurt you?

Leo will be fixed, I can't let him breed.. I would wan to keep all the puppies.

The internet has helped me, as people are learning that the dogs advertised on the internet are very often sickly, or bait and switch, or puppymillers trying to pose as reputable breeders. If people are willing to sell, and ship, puppies that are only 6, 7 or 8 weeks old, they (the purchaser) are taking a real chance on what they are getting, and have no idea if it will be healthy or not. I meet anyone that gets a puppy from me, and I insist that they keep in touch with me and send me pictures of them occasionally.

I also will not ship my puppies, too much can happen with them. If the person can not come and get them, or I can not take them to them, they do not go. No exceptions to that.