I respectfully ask

[PrestigeousYT]

I did find a thread a few days ago that the OP had asked a question, and advice had been given by quite a few.
I did mention that it was getting rude and I really thought it was and still do think it was and I will never mention that word again on here if it gets out of hand someone else can deal with it, but I did feel bad for the OP and I spoke up. I really love to see breeders give each other advice and help. But when it gets to the point where someone won't leave it at I gave advice and the person knows what my opinion is and go on. You feel like the person who asked for advice is being slammed.
With that said I am off to groom my babies.
And I hope if anyone ever feels like they have a question for me they are always more than welcome to email or PM me. I remember how hard it was when I was learning and hey I still learn each day. Life is a journey of learning.
And a lot of threads I haven't even posted on since the other thread because I can see the drama coming so I just won't go there.

Deana
Prestigeous Yorkies and 2 Maltese

[Brooklynn]

I am a show breeder and have always tried to answer questions "ONLY" and be helpful and some of what I've said was taken that I was being rude, crass or nasty and I've been personally attacked and I have NEVER attacked anyone and from what I have read so far I'm ashamed at some of you here on YT for telling someone that they can't have an opinion just because they don't breed? I for one value Myfairlacy's opinions and to be honest I personally have learned something from her!!! We can all learn something from someone and to make this a thread for just professional breeders is just plain stupid! Sorry I really don't mean to offend anyone but if you don't care for anyone on this fourm then don't answer them just ignore them! Good Grief most of us are adults and the one person that is getting slammed for her age you all are acting way younger than her and she's being the adult about this!
I don't have to defend my breeding program and never have and never will but seems to me there are some on here that seems to feel the need to defend their program and if that's the case well you know where I'm going with that! I stand by Myfairlacy 100%, my breeding program and my beliefs plain and simple and if you don't like my advice or opinion by all means ignore it and move on...I won't argue with anyone because there is no need. I'm not gonna beat my head against a wall for nothing....
And as far as BYB's I stand by what I think they are and no one will change my mind!
Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

[Judy in Waco]

I read and learn. I do not breed, but I hold a special place in my heart for those who do. I am however, a mom, so I am going to use an analogy here that might hopefully explain some of the feelings here.

There is always new research that says, "Good moms do this." or "Good moms do that." and then 20 or so years down the road we find out that it was wrong.

When I had my first child 24 years ago, it was the 'correct' thing to not circumcise baby boys. The research was showing it as unnecessary. Now we find all sorts of issues with little boys who were not circumcised.

We were also told not to start babies on solid food too soon. To introduce food slowly and in isolation. To buy prepared baby food instead of homemade because it was less likely to be contaminated. T

he vaccination schedule is different now. I even had a doctor prescribe peragoric drops for a baby with 'colic' only to find out it had opium in it!

I believe that blanket statements such as...Good moms do this.... or Good breeders do that... is overly simplistic and counterproductive.

Every child is different and every yorkie and yorkie litter is different.

Sometimes we know the current research, but choose to go with our instincts instead. Can that really be justified? No. Does it happen? Yes. Should we always go with what the research says? I don't think so. I think each of us should do what we think is best in our heart of hearts, and we should NOT be judged for that.

[BakersDozen]

Originally Posted by katelin

Maybe I missed something here... is this forum only for say professional breeders? If you are differentiating between breeders and non-breeders what is the criteria. And don't you want people who are considering breeding to be able to participate too? I'm just unclear as to whether there is a bright line on this somewhere that I don't know about yet.

I may be wrong, but I think those on this thread who are differentiating (as far as the suggestion for a closed forum) are differentiating between those who have whelped a litter of Yorkies, and those who have not. In its broadest terms, a breeder is one who has bred (and implied, whelped) a litter. I don't think anyone would discourage someone seriously considering breeding from participating--what many object to is the constant advice, sometimes in a disrespectful manner, from those who are not breeders in any sense of the word.

I think it is interesting to review past "heated" threads. While many of us have been involved in some, there are one or two usernames that are nearly ALWAYS there. Food for thought....perhaps some who feel they do not instigate debate are doing so unknowingly, simply by their manner. Either way, this discussion, as all the rest like it, has again proven unproductive.

[chattiesmom]

Originally Posted by MyFairLacy

Hmm...I have a thought. YT is supposed to be a positive place correct? Rudeness of course is not at all positive and I think we can all agree on that. But I believe calling others rude is just as negative. Maybe if everyone would make an effort to just read the words as they are written and not assume a rude tone, everyone would have a different attitude. Why don't we all try to assume that everyone is trying to be nice and helpful by what they write and not rude? Only the poster truly knows their tone, and from what I've seen it often gets interpreted wrongly. If we all truly want to make this forum a positive place, let's all imagine a positive tone behind each post instead of just assuming it is negative. You know what they say about assuming

That is a fantastic idea. I believe it was you who stated that, "Most backyard breeders do not health screen." Just as you have challenged breeders in the past to talk about their health screening, I challenge you to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that this statement is true. Particularly when referring to YT breeders. From where you sit on the other side of that computer screen, how do you KNOW if someone is ethical or does proper health screening? Presenting opinion as fact is very damaging to a multitude of people and needs to be stopped. The Breeder's Forum of all places should be a place of FACT backed up by credible documentation. Unethical and unreputable is also a term that you use to describe unnamed YT breeders.... I would ask you to do your research on individuals, prepare your cases and then take the facts to the Breeder Review section, and do a proper Breeder Review that is fact rather than opinion.

[BakersDozen]

Originally Posted by Judy in Waco

I read and learn. I do not breed, but I hold a special place in my heart for those who do. I am however, a mom, so I am going to use an analogy here that might hopefully explain some of the feelings here.

There is always new research that says, "Good moms do this." or "Good moms do that." and then 20 or so years down the road we find out that it was wrong.

When I had my first child 24 years ago, it was the 'correct' thing to not circumcise baby boys. The research was showing it as unnecessary. Now we find all sorts of issues with little boys who were not circumcised.

We were also told not to start babies on solid food too soon. To introduce food slowly and in isolation. To buy prepared baby food instead of homemade because it was less likely to be contaminated. T

he vaccination schedule is different now. I even had a doctor prescribe peragoric drops for a baby with 'colic' only to find out it had opium in it!

I believe that blanket statements such as...Good moms do this.... or Good breeders do that... is overly simplistic and counterproductive.

Every child is different and every yorkie and yorkie litter is different.

Sometimes we know the current research, but choose to go with our instincts instead. Can that really be justified? No. Does it happen? Yes. Should we always go with what the research says? I don't think so. I think each of us should do what we think is best in our heart of hearts, and we should NOT be judged for that.

What a great post!

[tjdmom]

Originally Posted by MyFairLacy

I tell people all the time that I certainly don't know it all. I've had someone tell me I had a "know it all attitude" which I think is more their problem than mine...like you said, you can not read tone and if someone believes I think I know it all, they came up with that one their own. I'm never afraid to say I don't know...but I try to help when I can. I will NEVER know it all...no one can. Also, no one is right 100% of the time and no one is wrong 100% of the time. I read, I research, I ask questions...I'm always learning, just as everyone is

I really wasn't thinking of anyone in particular when I said this but just in general from what I have sometimes read in posts. I hope you didn't take it that I was implying this about you.

[tjdmom]

Originally Posted by Judy in Waco

I read and learn. I do not breed, but I hold a special place in my heart for those who do. I am however, a mom, so I am going to use an analogy here that might hopefully explain some of the feelings here.

There is always new research that says, "Good moms do this." or "Good moms do that." and then 20 or so years down the road we find out that it was wrong.

When I had my first child 24 years ago, it was the 'correct' thing to not circumcise baby boys. The research was showing it as unnecessary. Now we find all sorts of issues with little boys who were not circumcised.

We were also told not to start babies on solid food too soon. To introduce food slowly and in isolation. To buy prepared baby food instead of homemade because it was less likely to be contaminated. T

he vaccination schedule is different now. I even had a doctor prescribe peragoric drops for a baby with 'colic' only to find out it had opium in it!

I believe that blanket statements such as...Good moms do this.... or Good breeders do that... is overly simplistic and counterproductive.

Every child is different and every yorkie and yorkie litter is different.

Sometimes we know the current research, but choose to go with our instincts instead. Can that really be justified? No. Does it happen? Yes. Should we always go with what the research says? I don't think so. I think each of us should do what we think is best in our heart of hearts, and we should NOT be judged for that.

I so agree with this and you said it so well!!

[BakersDozen]

Originally Posted by Brooklynn

I am a show breeder and have always tried to answer questions "ONLY" and be helpful and some of what I've said was taken that I was being rude, crass or nasty and I've been personally attacked and I have NEVER attacked anyone and from what I have read so far I'm ashamed at some of you here on YT for telling someone that they can't have an opinion just because they don't breed? I for one value Myfairlacy's opinions and to be honest I personally have learned something from her!!! We can all learn something from someone and to make this a thread for just professional breeders is just plain stupid! Sorry I really don't mean to offend anyone but if you don't care for anyone on this fourm then don't answer them just ignore them! Good Grief most of us are adults and the one person that is getting slammed for her age you all are acting way younger than her and she's being the adult about this!
I don't have to defend my breeding program and never have and never will but seems to me there are some on here that seems to feel the need to defend their program and if that's the case well you know where I'm going with that! I stand by Myfairlacy 100%, my breeding program and my beliefs plain and simple and if you don't like my advice or opinion by all means ignore it and move on...I won't argue with anyone because there is no need. I'm not gonna beat my head against a wall for nothing....
And as far as BYB's I stand by what I think they are and no one will change my mind!
Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

Unless there have been pm's flying about or something, I haven't seen anyone on here tell someone they can't have an opinion because they don't breed. Nor have I seen anyone insulted. I am really confused about the attack on age that you mention.

People are just making the point that you can have all the knowledge in the world, but it doesn't mean experience. According to YT, the purpose of the forum is "for breeders (experienced and not) to share their experiences, learn from each other, help new members, and to have a place to talk about the lessons, joys, pain, heartache, and excitement of breeding yorkies! It is also for discussion on breeders and if you are not a breeder, you can also post questions for breeders here." This indicates that the purpose of the forum is to learn from breeders. Not that non-breeders don't have knowledge, but that is not the purpose of this forum. I don't breed, and I recognize that anything I could have learned in books does not prepare me fully for whelping. I do not consider it insulting or negative that others realize this, and don't see why a non-breeder would find a problem in that realization.

You have a perfect right to have and state your opinions about byb, breeding, or anything else for that matter. Just as everyone else does.

[Brooklynn]

Originally Posted by chattiesmom

That is a fantastic idea. I believe it was you who stated that, "Most backyard breeders do not health screen." Just as you have challenged breeders in the past to talk about their health screening, I challenge you to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that this statement is true. Particularly when referring to YT breeders. From where you sit on the other side of that computer screen, how do you KNOW if someone is ethical or does proper health screening? Presenting opinion as fact is very damaging to a multitude of people and needs to be stopped. The Breeder's Forum of all places should be a place of FACT backed up by credible documentation. Unethical and unreputable is also a term that you use to describe unnamed YT breeders.... I would ask you to do your research on individuals, prepare your cases and then take the facts to the Breeder Review section, and do a proper Breeder Review that is fact rather than opinion.

Not picking on your post purposely
Let's play nice You know, there are some breeders here I wouldn't t buy from personally, not to say they aren't reputable but the written word speaks just as loud as in person
So to me, the written word on a public forum speaks volumes and since this is a public forum and could be used against me in this sue happy country I and I'm sure others refrain from naming names in an open public forum

So with that said, maybe some should actually watch what they type

I like Myfairlacy and I love her knowledge and her williness to learn and educate herself and I've met her in person and I love her to death! I really do respect her opinions and as I stated before I as a breeder have actually learned a thing or two because I "have" an open mind

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

[Brooklynn]

Originally Posted by BakersDozen

Unless there have been pm's flying about or something, I haven't seen anyone on here tell someone they can't have an opinion because they don't breed. Nor have I seen anyone insulted. I am really confused about the attack on age that you mention.

People are just making the point that you can have all the knowledge in the world, but it doesn't mean experience. According to YT, the purpose of the forum is "for breeders (experienced and not) to share their experiences, learn from each other, help new members, and to have a place to talk about the lessons, joys, pain, heartache, and excitement of breeding yorkies! It is also for discussion on breeders and if you are not a breeder, you can also post questions for breeders here." This indicates that the purpose of the forum is to learn from breeders. Not that non-breeders don't have knowledge, but that is not the purpose of this forum. I don't breed, and I recognize that anything I could have learned in books does not prepare me fully for whelping. I do not consider it insulting or negative that others realize this, and don't see why a non-breeder would find a problem in that realization.

You have a perfect right to have and state your opinions about byb, breeding, or anything else for that matter. Just as everyone else does.

Myfairlacy's age has been brought up several times maybe not in this thread per se but it has....I'm very frustrated that some have chosen to think Myfairlacy shouldn't be on this thread or maybe I'm assuming too much...She's a great person and she's being slammed "in my opinion" only for giving her strong opinions which actually I share her same beliefs and opinions. So now will I be slammed for sharing her beliefs?

Just my humble opinion of course!

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

[simonandhallie]

Let me see if I can diffuse this a little bit (this thread is not about defending or slamming people). I am agreeing with BakersDozen that a breeder is someone who has whelped a litter. I am not saying if I agree with how or why, just that they have had a female who has had puppies.

Those are the people that have truly experienced it and those are the people that we need sharing their advice, support, encouragement (if they see fit), struggles, issues and opinions. I have never witnessed or been a part of breeding any animal so I cannot possibly have experience with that.

If all of you that have could help by posting your trials and tribulations, joys and heartbreaks, mistakes and success, what a great section this would be.

[MyFairLacy]

Originally Posted by chattiesmom

That is a fantastic idea. I believe it was you who stated that, "Most backyard breeders do not health screen." Just as you have challenged breeders in the past to talk about their health screening, I challenge you to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that this statement is true. Particularly when referring to YT breeders. From where you sit on the other side of that computer screen, how do you KNOW if someone is ethical or does proper health screening? Presenting opinion as fact is very damaging to a multitude of people and needs to be stopped. The Breeder's Forum of all places should be a place of FACT backed up by credible documentation. Unethical and unreputable is also a term that you use to describe unnamed YT breeders.... I would ask you to do your research on individuals, prepare your cases and then take the facts to the Breeder Review section, and do a proper Breeder Review that is fact rather than opinion.

As I said previously, I do not speak about any individual breeder or group of breeders when I post. I speak in general. So honestly, none of this makes any sense to me as I have already stated that I AM NOT REFERING TO ANY ONE BREEDER WHEN I POST

[MyFairLacy]

Originally Posted by tjdmom

I really wasn't thinking of anyone in particular when I said this but just in general from what I have sometimes read in posts. I hope you didn't take it that I was implying this about you.

No, I didn't. I was just commenting

[chattiesmom]

Originally Posted by Brooklynn

Not picking on your post purposely
Let's play nice You know, there are some breeders here I wouldn't t buy from personally, not to say they aren't reputable but the written word speaks just as loud as in person
So to me, the written word on a public forum speaks volumes and since this is a public forum and could be used against me in this sue happy country I and I'm sure others refrain from naming names in an open public forum

So with that said, maybe some should actually watch what they type

I like Myfairlacy and I love her knowledge and her williness to learn and educate herself and I've met her in person and I love her to death! I really do respect her opinions and as I stated before I as a breeder have actually learned a thing or two because I "have" an open mind

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

I do agree with playing nice and I agree in large part what you have posted. What I don't agree with is general blanket statements that are purely based upon opinion and cannot be proven - especially ones that throw around terms such as unethical and unreputable when they are directed at YT members and cannot be proven.

Either do the research and present facts or refrain from making blanket statements that can be harmful to numerous YT members.

Again, refer to the STATED purpose of the Breeder's Forum.