Originally Posted by MyFairLacy (Post 1791582)

Well...I have to say that I think you are wrong. You'll always have bad breeders only breeding to make money. Reputable breeders breed because they love this breed. I guess I'll try to describe how I feel (even though I don't breed)....I am so in love with the Yorkshire Terrier breed - the way a well-bred yorkie looks, the way they act, that long silky coat, everything that makes a Yorkshire Terrier what it is. These are just amazing little dogs...there is just something so special about them. Those that show and breed are in love with this breed too. They show to prove they have excellent examples of the breed. They breed to improve the breed and to breed the best examples possible. Most breed to get that next show quality puppy. They strive to breed healthy, quality puppies for the show ring and to be placed into pet homes. They want to preserve this wonderful breed. I bet making money is the furthest thing from reputable show breeders' minds....they spend a lot more money than they make. It's about a passion and love for the breed - NOT making money

Originally Posted by hha (Post 1791900)

Kathryn is NOT wrong..she could say the same thing to you..all she's doing is stating an opinion...everyone is entitled to their own opinion..you definintely have your own, and she's entitled to her own....

Originally Posted by kathrynS (Post 1791710)

And thats why I come to this board. Thank You Lacy. So Happy To Hear I'm Wrong. Exactly the answer I wanted. (FOR THE LOVE OF THE BREED) not the money. Great,Great,Great wording. Keep up the good work.

Originally Posted by iloveYorkiesFL (Post 1791727)

I agree with you that there are breeders on YT that breed unethically! There is actually a handful of breeders who breed females in the 2-4lbs range...and what's worse is that there are other breeders on YT that praise these breeders! These same breeders charge $5000 to $10000 for "tiny" pet puppies and claim that they can charge whatever they feel their baby is worth. Yes, we all like to think our babies are priceless, but $10000 for a pet yorkie? That is just "silly talk" (taking this from the debate last night, thanks Obama :)). My breeder is a retired show breeder and sold pet quality pups in the $800 to $1200 range. Another point, there are breeders on YT that shouldn't breed...Sires and Dams that don't BEST represent the Yorkie breed... there will always be people who shouldn't that do. Yes, it's sad. The truth is that EVERYONE Has to be careful when purchasing a puppy, even if your fellow YTer recommended a breeder...you just HAVE to do your homework. Period.

However, I don't agree that ANYONE should be creating a new Yorkie. There is a standard already in place. If they are looking to create a new standard, more power to them, but what they have created isn't a Yorkie...but something else.

Btw, i love this thread! I think the subject has been handled so maturely!

Originally Posted by Yorkie Luv of 3 (Post 1791177)

Originally Posted by NanaDtreasures (Post 1793531)

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: You go girl~!
Boy am I with ya.....
:::::::Sitting here shaking my head :::::::
I just love these kinda threads.....NOT!!!!! LOL!

Originally Posted by Yorkie Luv of 3 (Post 1793660)

Originally Posted by NanaDtreasures (Post 1793816)

I wish I could find a Yorkie that was bred from a champion....yet is just pet quality for 500.00....If anybody has one...let me know.

Originally Posted by NanaDtreasures (Post 1793816)

Its not just Yorkies,,,and its not just dogs
(horses or anything seems to be game),
And its not just prices....

There sure seems to be a lot of "reputable breeders" on different forums (not just Yorkie Talk) when they put their website link in their siggie.
Asking big money...go figure......
I wish I could find a Yorkie that was bred from a champion....yet is just pet quality for 500.00....If anybody has one...let me know.

And many sell "teacups"..not JUST one from a litter, but intentionally bred that way...yet frown on it in forums. Go figure.....

So many things I agree with the people who post here.
But some things I do not.
No "reputable breeders" makes money ......

I love Yorkie talk too....
But I like honesty...
Be it horses...goats...Yorkies or whatever.
First I hope we do it for the LOVE of the breed.
And...Just being honest here
We do make money.

Not everytime...no...c-sections, vets bills etc.play in to PROFIT
But if we all charge for additions...shows, fairs...hotel costs...equipment....food...vet bills etc.
I guess I'll never "make money" to pay off my farm.LOL!
Just like anything else we enjoy ,it costs money to have them..go figure......
We cant just deduct everything off and say...wow...I didn't even break even on that horse...goat...puppy etc.

I have had many animals that I did lose money.
But never make money? Come on ladies....
Now slice my throat....lol:)

Originally Posted by Brooklynn (Post 1793990)

I'm sure some show breeders make some money on occassion if they have more than a couple of bitches and have the space and help for it but since I'm a very very small show breeder/exhibitor I'll never make money because I only have one bitch, one litter a year and I show alot...so breaking even is even out of the question...and if I don't get a show prospect out of a litter then they are placed and the money I do get from that particular litter goes towards a show prospect so money in is money out for me...

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

Originally Posted by love_me_cody (Post 1793957)

So if a breeder do everything right and end up at the end with more money then they spend they are not reputable? (even if they save their money for emergencies or the next litter?)

They can go by the book, get the test done, shots, spay/neuter, etc. and Screen to their best ability and be able to get more than what they put out in the beggining because they charge what they believe their puppy is worth.

Having money at the end doesn't really make a difference in whether a breeder is reputable or not.

You can do the same steps as a breeder that ends up lucky breaking even (they are considered reputable) but since you charged a little more (and make money in the end) because you thought they were worth more, you end up not being reputable?

Originally Posted by NanaDtreasures (Post 1794046)

Donna I havent been here long, and tend to lurk and read alot to learn.
But I have SUPER SUPER SUPER respect for you.:thumbup:
But there are a others on here I am still getting a read on.
I doubt you make anything on what few puppies each litter you do sell to forever homes.
BUT..that just is not the case with most.
(me included) I do make some money.
Not much sometimes...but I do..Just being honest.:)
I'm just one of these people who hates when some hide behind computer screens and preach....BUT don't follow what they say themselves.

Originally Posted by NanaDtreasures (Post 1794046)

Donna I havent been here long, and tend to lurk and read alot to learn.
But I have SUPER SUPER SUPER respect for you.:thumbup:
But there are a others on here I am still getting a read on.
I doubt you make anything on what few puppies each litter you do sell to forever homes.
BUT..that just is not the case with most.
(me included) I do make some money.
Not much sometimes...but I do..Just being honest.:)
I'm just one of these people who hates when some hide behind computer screens and preach....BUT don't follow what they say themselves.

Originally Posted by bjh (Post 1794106)

I guess some dog breeders are like politicians......they just tell you what they think you want to hear. But on the other hand many puppy buyers are the same way.....they will lie about working all day, about having kids, etc. It is hard to know who to trust sometimes.

Originally Posted by Ladymom (Post 1793850)

You might be surprised how reasonable puppies from many show breeders are, especially if you want a male. Most breeders don't want to keep males after they reach sexual maturity so many are priced much less than females.

A puppy from a show breeder will very likely end up being cheaper in the long run even if you pay a bit more initially. Those $500 puppies are usually from backyard breeders who don't do health testing and are not doing any genetic screening for problems inherent to the breed. They can cost much more in vet bills over the course of their life.

Originally Posted by Brooklynn (Post 1794120)

This is another reason I don't have many litters because I don't trust alot of people whether they be breeders or puppy buyers! I always pre-screen my puppy buyers and so far I've been dead on...it's scarey to me sometimes when I just know with whom to place and not place a puppy with....but on the other hand that's a good thing! :)

Donna Bird

Originally Posted by bjh (Post 1794144)

It sounds like you have been pretty lucky. I have been fooled a few times but I am learning that if you ask them enough questions that sooner or later they will slip up. My husband gets so mad at me because a question the people so much and then tell them I just don't recommend a Yorkie for them. Most people are understanding but some get down right mad.

Originally Posted by kathrynS (Post 1794404)

Hmmmmmm, There goes my brain thinking again. I think I'm confused about something. Because I only spent 450.00 for my baby who is healthy and fine and weighs 6 pounds. And mind ya he did come with all his papers, pics, he will never be good enough to show, not that I ever will. It seems to me the people who pay the big bucks are having alot of problems. Just wanted to know WHY my pup is not as good as the expensive ones. Or is it because I paid so little for him there should be something wrong with him? OK my brain hurts now. LOL I'm just glad I got him and I love him so much. Please god let him stay healthy.

Originally Posted by MyFairLacy (Post 1794441)

When someone sets out to buy a puppy..they shouldn't decide on a breeder because they like the price or just because they like the puppy. They need to pick their breeder first and THEN decide on the puppy. There are plenty of yorkie puppies available for all prices so it's not hard to find one....but it's the breeder that is most important and hard to find

Originally Posted by love_me_cody (Post 1793957)

So if a breeder do everything right and end up at the end with more money then they spend they are not reputable? (even if they save their money for emergencies or the next litter?)

They can go by the book, get the test done, shots, spay/neuter, etc. and Screen to their best ability and be able to get more than what they put out in the beggining because they charge what they believe their puppy is worth.

Having money at the end doesn't really make a difference in whether a breeder is reputable or not.

You can do the same steps as a breeder that ends up lucky breaking even (they are considered reputable) but since you charged a little more (and make money in the end) because you thought they were worth more, you end up not being reputable?

Originally Posted by bjh (Post 1794530)

You are correct in that it should be that way but in reality most people that buy Yorkies are just looking for a sweet loving cheap Yorkie, they have not studied the Yorkie standard and they are not the least bit interested in showing and some of them even think they might want to breed and make a little extra money. The good breeders are not that hard to find but good breeders are not going to sell to people that want to breed or have small children, or work all day so those people go buy a cheap Yorkie from whoever and the cycle continues.

Originally Posted by MyFairLacy (Post 1794691)

Yes, unfortunately most people don't have a clue about the breed or how to find a good breeder when they decide to buy a puppy. Most people all of a sudden decide they want a puppy and they want it NOW! They buy the first puppy they find in their price range.

However, there are people that do their research first. I think it is difficult to find a good breeder. There are tons of breeders out there but only a very small percentage is actually reputable and breeding for the right reasons and doing the right things. And the more I learn, the more cautious I feel I need to be. It takes time to find a reputable breeder and feel comfortable buying from them..at least for me anyway. I plan to find the breeders I like first and then decide on a puppy.

Originally Posted by Ladyhawk (Post 1791346)

I think this cute little note sums it up quite well for show breeders:
Why Show People End up Broke

The Most Expensive Collar you ever bought?

Why of course ..that very first Show collar!

How it all began?

In the Beginning...
You got your dog, a real show dog, and quickly realized that you needed the
Correct collar to show him on. Which in turn led you to that wonderful
Buttery smooth three foot leather lead.

At your very first show, you noticed that you just HAD to have the proper
Grooming supplies also....
Slicker Brush $9.00
Comb $10.00
Spray Bottle $4.00
Good Conditioner $15.00
Water Bottle $4.00
Pin Brush $15.00
Bait $10.00
NEW Collar(your dog has now out grown that first one)$14.00 Chalk $9.00
Chalk Brush $15.00 Cholesterol $10.00

YOUR FIRST POINT.*****YOU'RE HOOKED****** ** Bait $10.00 Dog show calendar
$12.00-don't want to miss ANY s hows now.

By now you're beginning to realize the back seat isn't a proper way to
Transport your dog.
Dog Crate for the car $80.00

At your very next show you begin to feel a bit more confident and relaxed at
Dog shows.
Borrowing and waiting to use your friends grooming table is so
Inconvenient. ...
Grooming Table $95.00
Grooming Arm $50.00
Bait $10.00

You begin to start collecting dog show things, old towels, skirts with
Pockets, dresses with pockets, good comfortable shoes, rain gear, umbrellas,
Water jugs, etc $100.00

Now you have too many grooming supplies?...
Tack Box to store and hold the supplies $50.00

Good comfortable Camp Chairs $35.00-we seem to be spending much more time at
Shows lately.

Suddenly you realize all of these items AND your dog don't fit in the family
Car anymore....
Used Mini Van $15,000.

Somewhere around this point you get ! Tired of waiting to use your friends
Blow dryer....
New blow dryer $150.00
Extension Cord for Dryer $15.00
Five-way plug for sharing electricity with your new dog show friends $10.00
New and improved dog show collar and lead $40.00 New type of improved Coat
Conditioner $15.00 Bait $10.00 Your friends favorite Shampoo and Whitener
$35.00 New Comb and Slicker brush $25.00 (you lost the old ones at the last
Show) Scissors $30.00 (kitchen shears just don't trim those pads
Right)

Muddy Show grounds..Roll up mat for covering ground $45.00 YOUR DOG PICKED
UP HER NINTH SINGLE

The hunt for majors begins. After wasting much money on entries where majors
Didn't hold you begin to get frustrated and search out and find that new
Male show puppy and a perfect match for your female!....
Crate for new dog $80.00
Show collar and lead for new dog $50.00 (your tastes have been refined now)
Handling classes for new dog $40.00

The very if! First show teaches you, your Mini Van will not carry both crates
And all your equipment... .
Brand New Larger Mini Van $25,000.00

Now having two dogs to show and get ready quickly teaches you a generator is
Required!
Generator $325.00
Two Dog Kennels for outside $1,000.00

Just got to pick up one of those majors on your female so you hire a handler
For those major shows $200.00 (+/-) YOUR FEMALE FINISHES!

Your new male is too young to breed.....
Updating & Health Clearances on Female $200.00 Stud Fee $1,000.00
Progesterone Testing $200.00 Whelping box $250.00 Vet bills-x-rays,
Sonograms, well mother checks $400.00 Putting first aid whelping kit
Together $300.00 Vaccines for new litter $150.00 X-pen for puppies $80.00
Whelping pads, fleeces, toys for puppies, weaning supplies, etc $450.00 Baby
Scale $45.00 Well puppy and mother exams $150.00

Spectacular puppy in litter will be new show dog....
Immediately realize Mi! In Van will NOT hold three dogs and show equipment... .
Motor Home or Full size dog show van $30, 000 to $100,000.00! !!!!!!!!
You suddenly realize you are eating macaroni and cheese while your dogs are
Eating Human Grade Dog food at $55.00 a bag.

Congratulations!
You have now earned the title of "Dog Breeder!"
Aren't you glad you are finally making those big bucks breeding dogs? So far
you have invested $75,652.00 in showing your two dogs.

*This figure does NOT include dog food, the initial cost of your dogs, entry
fees, motel bills, general vet bills, toys and Many other ownership
incidentals.

Your litter of pups yielded six puppies, you kept one and sold the other
five for $500.00 each. Congratulations you just made $2,500.00 "Breeding
your dogs!"

Now if you can just breed 30 or more litters you MAY just break even with
your initial investment of over $75,000!

Author Unknown

Originally Posted by hha (Post 1794596)

I don't really think that's what she's saying? She is just saying, not all of them are being honest about NOT making money...Haven't you ever heard the saying, "I wasn't born yesterday"...she is just stating what a bunch of us already know...and all we want is honesty...I dont' mind seeing any yorkie breeder make money, that's fantastic if they do, but, for all breeders to say they don't make anything??? Very unbelievable, and she just stated what a lot of other people think...;)
And as far as the $500 yorkies being from byb?? WRONG again..There are good breeders down here, where you can find beautiful home raised pups for $500-on up..Their dogs are in the house, and loved like their own children..And Brooklyn, I'm not speaking of you in this, I feel you are very up front and honest also

Originally Posted by bjh (Post 1794530)

The good breeders are not that hard to find but good breeders are not going to sell to people that want to breed or have small children, or work all day so those people go buy a cheap Yorkie from whoever and the cycle continues.