Show Prospect or Show Quality

[YorkieRose]

Originally Posted by Brooklynn

If I were in the situation this breeder was in with 9....I'd pick the best of what I needed at the time whether it be a male or female and place the "nice" ones into loving pet homes, as I can't keep or show 9 and besides...I wouldn't be having two litters at one time LOL...

You are not the average show breeder...I mean that in a good way.
I would have not problem placing a good prospect with a serious newbie or two..and co-own...then the rest could be pets.

I have no problem breeding two litters at once. I like to watch a group of 5 to 8 pups develop...but I was home 24/7...and many times two bitches would decide to have one each...

I have been to many well known show kennels and seen 4 and 5 litters at once...they feel as I..they like to compare a group...a group a too big for my liking...

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by Brooklynn

I don't think anyone is being put down? I also agree becareful who you listen too and what a breeder has done for the breed....I couldn't agree more with that statement

Donna

Agreed, with one exception.

[Woogie Man]

Originally Posted by Mardelin

Not from completely different lines. In order for one to set type one must line breed. There is a couple of documents on line breeding, I'll hunt them up for you so that you can keep them for your files. Line breeding is done with distant relatives with a commonality in their lineage. And by no means am I speaking about inbreeding. Yes, on occassion you may box yourself in and have to outcross, and with outcrossing you are taking the chance of brining in something you don't want.

I realized after you answered just how my question sounded.

When I say different lines, I'm thinking that there is likely some intersection of pedigrees anyway, at least among the well known ones. For instance..... my Bonnie and my Roger have 5 common ancestors within 6 generations. They're related but it's distant.

I'm happy with what I've begun with but I'm thinking about the future and how to proceed. Now if Junior turns out well, I'll be re-thinking some things as I had pretty much ruled out using his Dad in the future. We'll see how it goes.

[Brooklynn]

Originally Posted by YorkieRose

You are not the average show breeder...I mean that in a good way.
I would have not problem placing a good prospect with a serious newbie or two..and co-own...then the rest could be pets.

I have no problem breeding two litters at once. I like to watch a group of 5 to 8 pups develop...but I was home 24/7...and many times two bitches would decide to have one each...

I have been to many well known show kennels and seen 4 and 5 litters at once...they feel as I..they like to compare a group...a group a too big for my liking...

I work, so no more than one litter at a time LOL...No, you're right, I'm not your average show breeder...I don't like the whelping box nor do I want a big name in the breeding arena. I just want to produce and show my own nice dogs and love them. I'd prefer to show than breed so that is another avenue I would move towards and am moving towards.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by LuvndemYorkies

Newbies -many have started without a mentor.if you have an eye for a dog and don't mind studying WARNING if you are looking for advice check out the persons own statistics. SERIOUSLY what have they done for the breed? Not what has their mentor done!
just because they talk a good talk and it doesn't add up when you look at their own accomplishments in the breed. so be careful who you listen to for advice
Also have you noticed the serious/accomplished breeders don't hang around here putting others down-juz sayin

I agree many newbies start without a mentor, most do, but from the experienced breeders I've talked to all suggest getting a mentor is the best way to go, it will save you money and heartache in the long run.

I totally agree with your advice on checking out the breeder, so many are willing to mentor people and have never shown themselves. Often when they use the word "mentor" it just means they will sell you a dog on open registration.

[Brooklynn]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

I agree many newbies start without a mentor, most do, but from the experienced breeders I've talked to all suggest getting a mentor is the best way to go, it will save you money and heartache in the long run.

I totally agree with your advice on checking out the breeder, so many are willing to mentor people and have never shown themselves. Often when they use the word "mentor" it just means they will sell you a dog on open registration.

I would like to add Nancy, serious yorkie exhibitors and breeders do watch this forum They may not comment but they do watch it. They just don't have the patience as I've been told by a few They'd get banned so they sit and watch quietly.

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by Brooklynn

I would like to add Nancy, serious yorkie exhibitors and breeders do watch this forum They may not comment but they do watch it. They just don't have the patience as I've been told by a few They'd get banned so they sit and watch quietly.

You're right, many on here often and monitor/read and know who's who in the zoo.

[Ivy League]

I had to make the decision about a year ago after my male had too high bile acid levels,too high for breeding, for sure. I was faced with the decision of giving him back to my breeder/mentor and getting a replacement show quality pup/dog at no cost. Or i could keep him and neuter him and pay discounted rate on a replacement show quality dog. It was a hard decision. We were going to keep him and tried it but he was literally beating up and hurting the new puppy so we decided to give him back and she petted him out. It was really tough but I knew that it had to be done. I am one of the few newbies who got so lucky the first time around finding an amazing, reputable trustworthy mentor. She stands behind what she produces and if the dog is not going to reach its championship she will replace it. If it fails to pass any of her/our required health tests the dog will be replaced at no cost and the dog being replaced would be spayed/neutered. We will only breed champions who have passed all health exams and who are of breeding quality. She is truly an inspiration and what I strive to become. I currently own a bitch and a dog from her. The dog is the replacement one and he is quite "Awesome". He finished in just 5 shows at the age of 12 months in June. In February i am going to start working on his grand championship. Anyways i think just depending on the relationship you have with your breeder you could risk it and get a puppy at a young age, I did and even though it didn't work out the first time she stood by me and replaced with an even better dog. I would be willing to do it just because of my relationship with her but I would encourage others against it. You never know how a puppy will turn out. So much can change and fall apart. If i were to purchase from someone else i would wait until they were at least a year old and even then be very cautious. I would make sure at that age they have passed health tests (cerf, prelim hips, heart, thyroid, knees, BAT, ETC) and that level topline, nice movement, temperament, balance and color are there and what you want. I know many show breeders do not perform these tests but the only way i would purchase from someone else is with these things.(with that being said if they are all there chances are the breeder will probably be keeping the said dog) I know its really tough to get started showing yorkies and getting your own show quality dogs, show breeders guard their dogs and lines with good reason (we must protect the breed), but if you stick around and prove yourself you will hopefully eventually get there. My advice to newbies is to not get impatient and you should go with your gut feeling. If the contract seems shady and they are only selling the dog as"Show Prospect" or "Show Potential" i would be very careful. If their dogs are that great they should stand behind them!!!

[Brooklynn]

Originally Posted by Ivy League

I had to make the decision about a year ago after my male had too high bile acid levels,too high for breeding, for sure. I was faced with the decision of giving him back to my breeder/mentor and getting a replacement show quality pup/dog at no cost. Or i could keep him and neuter him and pay discounted rate on a replacement show quality dog. It was a hard decision. We were going to keep him and tried it but he was literally beating up and hurting the new puppy so we decided to give him back and she petted him out. It was really tough but I knew that it had to be done. I am one of the few newbies who got so lucky the first time around finding an amazing, reputable trustworthy mentor. She stands behind what she produces and if the dog is not going to reach its championship she will replace it. If it fails to pass any of her/our required health tests the dog will be replaced at no cost and the dog being replaced would be spayed/neutered. We will only breed champions who have passed all health exams and who are of breeding quality. She is truly an inspiration and what I strive to become. I currently own a bitch and a dog from her. The dog is the replacement one and he is quite "Awesome". He finished in just 5 shows at the age of 12 months in June. In February i am going to start working on his grand championship. Anyways i think just depending on the relationship you have with your breeder you could risk it and get a puppy at a young age, I did and even though it didn't work out the first time she stood by me and replaced with an even better dog. I would be willing to do it just because of my relationship with her but I would encourage others against it. You never know how a puppy will turn out. So much can change and fall apart. If i were to purchase from someone else i would wait until they were at least a year old and even then be very cautious. I would make sure at that age they have passed health tests (cerf, prelim hips, heart, thyroid, knees, BAT, ETC) and that level topline, nice movement, temperament, balance and color are there and what you want. I know many show breeders do not perform these tests but the only way i would purchase from someone else is with these things.(with that being said if they are all there chances are the breeder will probably be keeping the said dog) I know its really tough to get started showing yorkies and getting your own show quality dogs, show breeders guard their dogs and lines with good reason (we must protect the breed), but if you stick around and prove yourself you will hopefully eventually get there. My advice to newbies is to not get impatient and you should go with your gut feeling. If the contract seems shady and they are only selling the dog as"Show Prospect" or "Show Potential" i would be very careful. If their dogs are that great they should stand behind them!!!

Excellent Post! Welcome to YT! There are some good people in Colorado! The Messingers not sure I spelled that right are some great people in Colorado and I know Bente Martuci and she's a very sweet lady! I met the Messingers at Bluebonnet and I was totally impressed with them, the kindness, their ethics and their dogs!

Donna

[shodanusmc]

I view the difference as something that even I can understand. Marge is show quality, and I used to be a show prospect. Fortunately, I was placed with a good woman nearly 40 years ago.

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by shodanusmc

I view the difference as something that even I can understand. Marge is show quality, and I used to be a show prospect. Fortunately, I was placed with a good woman nearly 40 years ago.

So Marge perfected the offspring?

[shodanusmc]

Originally Posted by Mardelin

So Marge perfected the offspring?

Pretty much! I had a small part, as I have a great top line and bite!

[YorkieRose]

Originally Posted by Brooklynn

I would like to add Nancy, serious yorkie exhibitors and breeders do watch this forum They may not comment but they do watch it. They just don't have the patience as I've been told by a few They'd get banned so they sit and watch quietly.

In that case, I am sure my comments are not always met with a smile.
Been around too long and seen too much, to make a blanket statement, that a show breeder is the best breeder...the best breeders I know personally, DO show and win, but seen and heard stuff I wish I could erase from my mind in the name of breeding show dogs...

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by shodanusmc

Pretty much! I had a small part, as I have a great top line and bite!

LOL, I've seen that bite!

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by shodanusmc

Pretty much! I had a small part, as I have a great top line and bite!

Actually if the topline is great, all else in the structure falls in place. She must have brought the beauty and brains to the table.