Originally Posted by LuvndemYorkies (Post 2880674)

I have heard that the they are breeding bitches that are way over the standard size to the number one yorkie? I also read a post somewhere on here where this was also discussed earlier.
What the heck does this do to keep the integrity of this breed if the people with top ranking yorkies are breeding to way oversized females?
I mean surely that will crop up somewhere along the way say a daughter of this breeding having trouble delivering pups because she is having way oversized pups???
I mean tell me where this helps the breed? It is being discussed how it is so important to have a bitch that should be CHampioned or could be championed etc etc and how she is worth her weight in gold, then explain how these breeding practices of breeding a top ranking dog to such a way oversized bitch. 3 lbs over the size for a yorkie is a way way oversized dog to be bred, let alone to be bred to the top ranked dog? and this is more than just here say. it is being discussed on another list and the person that owns the way oversized bitch has said yes she bred to the top ranked yorkie with this way oversized bitch. and she is on a contract to not place the pups until spayed and neutered.
this makes it very hard to understand, newbies are looking for the right way to breed and when we hear things like this, we loose confidence in those who we think of as experts or stewards of the breed when we hear of such breedings.
any opinions on this? is there a need to breed like this? what is the justice of this type of breeding? is there a reason other than collecting that stud fee?

Originally Posted by LuvndemYorkies (Post 2880674)

I have heard that the they are breeding bitches that are way over the standard size to the number one yorkie? I also read a post somewhere on here where this was also discussed earlier.
What the heck does this do to keep the integrity of this breed if the people with top ranking yorkies are breeding to way oversized females?
I mean surely that will crop up somewhere along the way say a daughter of this breeding having trouble delivering pups because she is having way oversized pups???
I mean tell me where this helps the breed? It is being discussed how it is so important to have a bitch that should be CHampioned or could be championed etc etc and how she is worth her weight in gold, then explain how these breeding practices of breeding a top ranking dog to such a way oversized bitch. 3 lbs over the size for a yorkie is a way way oversized dog to be bred, let alone to be bred to the top ranked dog? and this is more than just here say. it is being discussed on another list and the person that owns the way oversized bitch has said yes she bred to the top ranked yorkie with this way oversized bitch. and she is on a contract to not place the pups until spayed and neutered.
this makes it very hard to understand, newbies are looking for the right way to breed and when we hear things like this, we loose confidence in those who we think of as experts or stewards of the breed when we hear of such breedings.
any opinions on this? is there a need to breed like this? what is the justice of this type of breeding? is there a reason other than collecting that stud fee?

Originally Posted by LuvndemYorkies (Post 2880674)

I have heard that the they are breeding bitches that are way over the standard size to the number one yorkie? I also read a post somewhere on here where this was also discussed earlier.
What the heck does this do to keep the integrity of this breed if the people with top ranking yorkies are breeding to way oversized females?
I mean surely that will crop up somewhere along the way say a daughter of this breeding having trouble delivering pups because she is having way oversized pups???
I mean tell me where this helps the breed? It is being discussed how it is so important to have a bitch that should be CHampioned or could be championed etc etc and how she is worth her weight in gold, then explain how these breeding practices of breeding a top ranking dog to such a way oversized bitch. 3 lbs over the size for a yorkie is a way way oversized dog to be bred, let alone to be bred to the top ranked dog? and this is more than just here say. it is being discussed on another list and the person that owns the way oversized bitch has said yes she bred to the top ranked yorkie with this way oversized bitch. and she is on a contract to not place the pups until spayed and neutered.
this makes it very hard to understand, newbies are looking for the right way to breed and when we hear things like this, we loose confidence in those who we think of as experts or stewards of the breed when we hear of such breedings.
any opinions on this? is there a need to breed like this? what is the justice of this type of breeding? is there a reason other than collecting that stud fee?

Originally Posted by Mardelin (Post 2880693)

I don't think most of us that are answering your questions can answer for someone else and what their breeding practices are....It's really none of our business. I do know that those top breeders when allowing their studs to be championed out do so with a very tight contract, insisting anything that isn't shown by the bitch owner will be petted out on a spay/nueter contract. And they do have tight reign by instilling 3rd generation control.

My advice is find a mentor, one that knows what their doing and forget about what everyone else is doing.......

Originally Posted by Mardelin (Post 2880693)

I don't think most of us that are answering your questions can answer for someone else and what their breeding practices are....It's really none of our business. I do know that those top breeders when allowing their studs to be championed out do so with a very tight contract, insisting anything that isn't shown by the bitch owner will be petted out on a spay/nueter contract. And they do have tight reign by instilling 3rd generation control.

My advice is find a mentor, one that knows what their doing and forget about what everyone else is doing.......

Originally Posted by LuvndemYorkies (Post 2880674)

I have heard that the they are breeding bitches that are way over the standard size to the number one yorkie? I also read a post somewhere on here where this was also discussed earlier.
What the heck does this do to keep the integrity of this breed if the people with top ranking yorkies are breeding to way oversized females?
I mean surely that will crop up somewhere along the way say a daughter of this breeding having trouble delivering pups because she is having way oversized pups???
I mean tell me where this helps the breed? It is being discussed how it is so important to have a bitch that should be CHampioned or could be championed etc etc and how she is worth her weight in gold, then explain how these breeding practices of breeding a top ranking dog to such a way oversized bitch. 3 lbs over the size for a yorkie is a way way oversized dog to be bred, let alone to be bred to the top ranked dog? and this is more than just here say. it is being discussed on another list and the person that owns the way oversized bitch has said yes she bred to the top ranked yorkie with this way oversized bitch. and she is on a contract to not place the pups until spayed and neutered.
this makes it very hard to understand, newbies are looking for the right way to breed and when we hear things like this, we loose confidence in those who we think of as experts or stewards of the breed when we hear of such breedings.
any opinions on this? is there a need to breed like this? what is the justice of this type of breeding? is there a reason other than collecting that stud fee?

Originally Posted by bjh (Post 2880708)

If you are talking about breeding a top ranked male to a over sized female then this is my take on this subject. Many show breeders do breed females that are a little over standard and I have no problem with that. While a 10 lb bitch might be a bit large you have to consider her pedigree and her qualities. If she is of outstanding quality, with smaller lines behind her then she could very well produce some nice offspring. Of course, the breeder would want to sell the offspring on a spay and neuter contract if none were show quality. Over size is a fault just like a bad bite, bad topline, etc, but it can be corrected with proper breeding. As for the offspring from a large bitch having whelping problems, it is possible but most likely if they are bred to smaller males with smaller size behind them there should be no problem. I have heard that it is the female that determines the size of the pup in the uterus. Personally, I don't feel comfortable breeding small females, I prefer most of my breeding bitches to be 7 to 8 lbs. I would much rather have a show pup out of a larger bitch with good sound, solid structure than from a 5 or 6 lb bitch that is fine boned with light structure. Some breeders, after they have bred many years, might start getting smaller and smaller pups and it gets harder to get a good show and breeding prospect so they have to bring a little size back into their lines. JMO.

Originally Posted by Mardelin (Post 2880391)

Pat,

How it was explained to me is that it takes 10 generations before the line becomes yours.

The other thing that was passed down to me, is that some never reach the experienced/exhibitor breeder stage and forever stay and the newbie stage.

As you stated, very rarely to you see Pastoral, Yorkboro, This Time, Exmoor, Rothby and they produce Champions consistently....Occassionaly the do outcross when they begin boxing theirselves in. But, then these people have been doing it for years.

Originally Posted by topknot (Post 2880650)

I do not see what you see Barb, I have only seen one dyed dog in all my years of showing and that was years and years ago.

You missed Memphis, right?

Originally Posted by topknot (Post 2880650)

I do not see what you see Barb, I have only seen one dyed dog in all my years of showing and that was years and years ago.

You missed Memphis, right?

Originally Posted by Brooklynn (Post 2880678)

LOL...the #1 yorkie in the USA is female so I guess someone is just wanting play around with ya :)