Annual Vaccinactions - why are some still doing them?

[Ellie May]

Have you read the AAHA release? It is several pages long. General vets are going to have a hard time telling you that info isn't correct. This would go for vaccinating every 3 years.

For vaccinating at one year and never again, those studies are going to be harder to get access to. There is a lot going on with this at the University of Wisconsin. Because those studies are still being done and there are a lot of questions, that probably wouldn't be good to bring up to most vets. Although those same studies will more than likely prove to be true soon..

Also check vet school and vet school hospital sites. They are the leaders in veterinary medicine and you don't normally read where they vaccinate annually. At their hospitals, they would be doing it much less.

[yorkietalkjilly]

Started with that and then went to Texas A&M's statement, Texas Administrative Code "result"(haven't located the specific code covering anything but rabies which basically says the 1 or 3 year vax ok(no difference so why the code language but if you've read much of the TAC that is no surprise) and on from there to articles you all have posted and those searched. From what I have read and been able to absorb to date, I just don't yet have the assurance that the titer levels are the sole factor to be considered in predicting immunity, need to read way more and ask questions of vets working in vaccine immunity studies and more real-world vets. Am so worried that Tibbe's existing titers may address only disease strains as of his last vaccinations should we stop for a bit and no mutations which might be picked up in newer vaccines. See? I don't even know about how the vaccines are made yearly! But as I read how many critters are coming into suburbia with their ?maybe? newer or mutated strains of things and potentially infect animals Tibbe could come into contact with, I wonder if I have to worry about that. The reason I am hesitant to change yet is that I haven't yet seen anyone make the flat out statement supported by available documenting long-term studies with provenance WE can read that previously vaccinated animals haven't ticked up in the diseases now that they don't get yearly boosters. Maybe that is out there and I missed it. I just don't know enough yet.

[Ellie May]

People are only vaccinated for viruses as kids. We are then considered immune for life. It is 99.9% likely that it works the same for dogs.

AAHA would not stand behind a protocol if it wasn't safe. A very large number of vets in the US have AAHA accredited offices (meet minimal standards set by AAHA). That is how much vets look to this organization.

You need to do what you're comfortable with though.

I stopped doing titers because I just don't think they are worth it.

UC Davis:
William R. Pritchard Veterinary Medical Teaching Hospital

Colorado State:
CVMBS Minor Template 800 x 600

There are many more like this, just can't find them right now. Some don't post the recommendations on their sites.

I'd hope if there was a change in a vaccine to cover more strains that my vet would let me know about that..

We all need to do what we (and our vets) feel is best. I don't believe vaccinating yearly is in my pup's best interest because there can be side effects from it that we don't see right away. My girl's vet would agree that with all the vaccines out now and how often they are given, we could possibliy be creating a problem.

[yorkietalkjilly]

Yes, I am giving great weight to AAHA's position but wonder if anyone will ever let us mortals just see what they used in taking their position. I've vaccinated yearly since I got my first dog with no reactions and none of those diseases or the diseases suspected to come due to vaccinating so it is hard to justify changing yet what has worked so far. I'm wondering why there isn't there more consensus amount vets and accrediting organizations if it is so safe not to vaccinate yearly. I'm going to keep reading and asking.

Well, got to get to some office work for now.

[Ellie May]

I see what you're saying, but what major animal health organizations don't agree? Pretty sure also (would have to confirm) that all 27 vet schools support this protocol.

The people who don't agree are individual vets who do not specialize in immunology (I could most definitely be missing something though).

[Ellie May]

Every peered reviewed and accepted study done will be on PubMed (not all can be read for free though). Here is a synopsis of one. This is for lifelong immunity though. Because it hasn't absolutely been proven, the three year approach was taken for now by the major organizations:

Age and long-term protective immunity in dogs and ... [J Comp Pathol. 2010] - PubMed result

[yorkietalkjilly]

I think I read that about the 27 vet schools many times last night but only went to Texas A&M's so far. Will they ever let us see what they based their decision on? Professors and younger scholors are very often cutting edge and all of that but also I worry about their abiding passion to change for the sake of change sometimes. Will they ever make their actual studies available to us and answer that one question they haven't yet, I wonder?

[Ellie May]

The studies are published. They have to be made available to us.

Three-year duration of immunity in dogs following ... [Vet Ther. 2005] - PubMed result

Evaluation of the efficacy and duration of immunit... [Vet Ther. 2004] - PubMed result
These pups weren't even given a dose at an old enough age to ensure protection.

The vets I know (several) who use the newer protocol aren't all young and they don't just change their ways without a good reason.

I almost lost my girl to a vaccine. That isn't to say we shouldn't vaccinate. I do and will continue to. But I won't do it as often as some vets are suggesting. Just in the last decade halothane is being used less and less. I'm really glad to see things like that. It has been replaced by something newer - and much better. So in that way, I'm very happy to see that vets will move ahead.

We do need to be careful about undervaccinating. And it's definitely not wrong to listen to our vets.. But I hope those vets are listening to the experts on this issue and every other issue.

Yes, there is a chance that a dog vaccinated every 3 years could get distemper and parvo. There is also a chance that a dog vaccinated annually could also.

[yorkietalkjilly]

Oh, that's what I've been looking for - some studies to chew over.

[yorkietalkjilly]

I haven't lost to a vaccine reaction but have seen dogs die from the diseases - a family pet from distemper when I was younger, my Doberman from Lepto before the vaccine and two friends dogs from Parvo(well, I didn't actually see the latter two die). All terrible deaths for any dog and none had had vaccine but could have gotten them with the vaccine, too, although I've yet to personally know of even one death after vaccination or reaction in my lifetime among all of the dogs I've known or known about on a personal basis. One's personal experience does weigh heavily, doesn't it, despite what the experts are saying.

Last year the Health and Human Services Administration gave its take on more modern mammogram guidelines based on studies, etc., but not one real-world, credible, practicing cancer specialist that I heard speak or read or even one cancer patient whose cancer was caught under age 50 seems to agree with HHS so I am not yet ready to trust corporate decisions or even studies all that much as I look at the mammogram situation and some of the other lovely private corporate decisions made lately. I'm just pretty conservative until I get all the facts straighter in my head than I've got them to date but I've got to admit there is some pretty compelling information to sort through and despite my fears, I'm open minded to learning all I can for Tibbe's sake.

[Ellie May]

Personal experience definitely does play a big part in it. In our case, it was the lepto vaccine. I have made the decision to give it to my dogs though (if I had other dogs that didn't react to it) in Michigan because lepto is prevalent here.

I have seen enough about the subject to know that at some point, enough is enough though. There is no reason a dog should be getting 5-8 vaccines every 365 days. They are preserved in toxins for the most part and they are potent. Just won't put my pup's body through that yearly unless I or her vet thought that she was in a lot of danger without them. The research just doesn't lead me to believe that there is a lot of danger by doing some of them less often.

[yorkietalkjilly]

Yes, that's kind of what HHS said in stating mammograms themselves are inherently dangerous and research shows that doing them in younger women don't actually prevent cancer effectively in that age group. Great research, good studies and they were done finally done considering it. But if I were under 50, I believe I would still get a yearly mammogram as I think the cancer risk is greater than the mammogram risk.

I'm in the position of learning whether or not I can correlate all the vaccine research on, amongst others, the the potential danger of yearly toxins, etc. versus any possible increased liklihood over time of my dog actually being more likely to contract a possibly deadly disease due to all of the above concerns I've mentioned. I'm not at the enough is enough position yet as I don't yet have all of the facts. And I need sleep!

[lexipoo]

Wow, great posts and love all the information. Thanks so much for informing us with all this information. I am so confused with all of this stuff and worry all the time when we take Lexi to the vet's. She was 2 years old in November and we have done the yearly shots and haven't had a problem. My vet does not give her the rabie shot at the same time and we have scheduled them a month or so apart. She hasn't had the Lepto as we have asked not to have that one. Lexi had her shots in February again and is now scheduled to do the rabie shot again at the end of the month. I really am thinking about canceling. I did ask him why we have to do the rabie shot every year as it is good for 3 years...but, unfortunately our answer is the county requires it yearly? He did not push up to get it done but that is the answer... I have talked to others that I work with and some follow the vet and others just do what they feel is right. This sure can be tough as you worry one way or another...thanks for your insight...much appreciated hugs

[ladyjane]

Originally Posted by lexipoo

Wow, great posts and love all the information. Thanks so much for informing us with all this information. I am so confused with all of this stuff and worry all the time when we take Lexi to the vet's. She was 2 years old in November and we have done the yearly shots and haven't had a problem. My vet does not give her the rabie shot at the same time and we have scheduled them a month or so apart. She hasn't had the Lepto as we have asked not to have that one. Lexi had her shots in February again and is now scheduled to do the rabie shot again at the end of the month. I really am thinking about canceling. I did ask him why we have to do the rabie shot every year as it is good for 3 years...but, unfortunately our answer is the county requires it yearly? He did not push up to get it done but that is the answer... I have talked to others that I work with and some follow the vet and others just do what they feel is right. This sure can be tough as you worry one way or another...thanks for your insight...much appreciated hugs

Rabies is controlled by state or county...sometimes local laws. The guidelines we are referring to are for DHPP. After the first year, the recommendation is for every three years.

[lexipoo]

Originally Posted by ladyjane

Rabies is controlled by state or county...sometimes local laws. The guidelines we are referring to are for DHPP. After the first year, the recommendation is for every three years.

Do you give your little ones a Rabie shot every year?