Beware of this Horrible Disease! - YorkieTalk.com Forums

Luckymom · 12-10-2008, 07:43 PM

Hi. I am brand new to this site and am so happy to meet all of you. I have two yorkies, and one yorkie mix. My yorkie Lucky is 8 years old, and Hayley is 12 weeks. They are so precious to me. I just wanted to warn all of you who have never heard about Portal Caval Shunt Disease. It is a disease of the liver and I just found out today my Lucky has it. The last couple of months have been awful because it took that long to diagnose him! So if your yorkie ever starts getting very depressed, lethargic, is very unsteady on his feet (walks like he is drunk), disoriented, paces, drinks a lot of fluid, beware of this disease. He has been so pathetic I was so afraid. They are treating him with antibiotics and some other meds, and also put him on a VERY low protein diet called LD (that is the new food I have to put him on). If I help even one person then that is great. I have just been beside myself with worry. Hopefully in a few days on the new meds and diet, he will be back to his old self. I am so glad I found yorkietalk.com! Gail

Lisa and Pic · 12-11-2008, 02:47 AM

I am so very sorry about Lucky and it sounds like you are being a great YorkieMom. However, I am glad you found us and Welcome to YorkieTalk.

jfalz73 · 12-11-2008, 02:57 AM

Welcome to YT! I will keep your Lucky in my prayers!

Ellie May · 12-11-2008, 04:26 AM

Welcome to YT and I'm so sorry about Lucky.

Sadly, most vets know so little about liver disease in Yorkies that they don't do bile acids testing soon enough. Most dogs with this disease are diagnosed at a much longer age (before a year or two). Is it a liver shunt or microvascular dysplasia?

The L/D he is on, is it canned or dry?
Is he on Denosyl or Vetri-DMG?
Is he on lactulose and vitamin e?

MollysMum54 · 12-11-2008, 04:30 AM

I was wondering if this kind of illness means we should cut down on our doggies protein intake as they get older? I feed a lowish protein dried food to Molly, but add more in the shape of chicken or lamb. She is just over 3 years old.

Ellie May · 12-11-2008, 04:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MollysMum54

I was wondering if this kind of illness means we should cut down on our doggies protein intake as they get older? I feed a lowish protein dried food to Molly, but add more in the shape of chicken or lamb. She is just over 3 years old.

Has your dog been diagnosed with this?
There isn't any reason to go very low protein if they haven't been diagnosed with a disease that would require it.

Luckymom · 12-13-2008, 10:55 AM

First of all, thanks for the warm welcome and for caring. Yes Lucky has been actually diagnosed (3 days ago) with Portal Caval Shunt which is this liver disease. His acid bile test was supposed to be like under "7" and his number came back at "245"! It is a wonder he is still alive. As I said he was SO depressed, lethargic, stumbling, no balance, very disoriented. just awful. Anyway, she gave him Amoxicillin and some liquid stuff to get the toxins out of his system. Then she switched him to LD Diet which is very low protein. She said it is extremely important that he stay on this low protein food. After 3 days on the new food and meds, he is already perking up - I am so happy to report this!! I will keep you posted - it is so nice to meet all of you.
Gail

YorkichonBella · 12-13-2008, 11:14 AM

Thank you so much for sharing your story and knowledge on this disease & we wish the very best for Lucky. So glad he is now beginning to feel better and hope it continues!! Hugs!

Yorkieluv · 12-13-2008, 07:34 PM

Hi Luckymom

I'm so sorry that your Lucky has liver problems. My yorkie also has liver disease, so I know exactly the symptoms you are talking about. The liquid stuff is very likely lactulose. This is just as important as giving the appropriate food (L/D in your case). I'm not sure if your vet explained it to you, but lactulose should be given 3x/day in amounts that will make him have 2 soft stools per day...not firm, not diarrhea, but somewhat difficult to pick up with a paper towel. This is of paramount important in keeping the toxins from backing up. When the toxins back up, it causes the neurological symptoms that you have seen in Lucky. Many of us have had to tweak the dosage of lactulose to get it just right. It takes some time, but when you get it right, it will be very beneficial to your baby.
Denosyl and milk thistle are very helpful supplements for dogs with liver shunt. They help protect the liver from further damage, and they also help the parts that are already damaged.

Luckymom · 12-14-2008, 09:06 AM

Hi Yorkieluv,
Thanks so much for your response! I am so sorry to hear your yorkie has the same thing, but I am also glad to hear from someone who understands. Everyone has been so wonderful and caring..I appreciate everyone's input. You are exactly correct, it is Lactulose that he is taking. I give it to him 3 times a day, and the Amoxicillin 2 x a day. The vet said he may have to stay on these things for a very long time. But that is OK if it makes him feel better. I can't tell what his stool is like because we have a huge backyard and I never can seem to catch him pooping. But I am going to try to catch him so I can see the consistency. He is feeling much perkier, but he still does this weird thing. After he eats he kind of paces around and whines, and then when he lays down to sleep, his head twitches - like little sideways jerks. I know that sounds weird. I honestly think that his brain has been damaged from all the toxins and it is making him do weird things. He is still a little unstable on his feet but I think that will get better. Any input is always welcome!! THANKS!!

Luckymom · 12-14-2008, 09:19 AM

help please with photo. I am new so don't really know what I am doing yet. I just want to upload one picture of Lucky so that it will show up next to all of my posts (like everyone else has). Please someone tell me step by step what to do? I am computer savvy and all, but I am not sure where to go to do this. thanks.

Yorkieluv · 12-14-2008, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luckymom

Hi Yorkieluv,
Thanks so much for your response! I am so sorry to hear your yorkie has the same thing, but I am also glad to hear from someone who understands. Everyone has been so wonderful and caring..I appreciate everyone's input. You are exactly correct, it is Lactulose that he is taking. I give it to him 3 times a day, and the Amoxicillin 2 x a day. The vet said he may have to stay on these things for a very long time. But that is OK if it makes him feel better. I can't tell what his stool is like because we have a huge backyard and I never can seem to catch him pooping. But I am going to try to catch him so I can see the consistency. He is feeling much perkier, but he still does this weird thing. After he eats he kind of paces around and whines, and then when he lays down to sleep, his head twitches - like little sideways jerks. I know that sounds weird. I honestly think that his brain has been damaged from all the toxins and it is making him do weird things. He is still a little unstable on his feet but I think that will get better. Any input is always welcome!! THANKS!!

You're right! It's good to be able to talk to someone who is going through the same thing...When my yorkie was first diagnosed, nobody that I knew had ever been through this, and I had to learn most things on my own...I did a ton of research and read everything related to the liver and nutrition that I could get my hands on. I wish I would have had someone to share with me what I know now. I have learned so much since my yorkie was diagnosed, and I try to help others as much as possible.

If he has liver problems that are not going to be fixed through surgery, then it will be absolutely necessary for him to stay on the lactulose FOR LIFE. I really doubt that he has brain damage...The symptoms after meals that you are describing are typical of dogs who are still backed up with toxins.

It's imperative that your baby have at least 2 soft stools per day and that you monitor this everyday. Until you get the dosage of lactulose just right, he will continue have those symptoms which are uncomfortable for them. Feeling ill/twitching/whining/pacing after eating is common in symptomatic liver compromised dogs and is a sign that he needs more liver support in the way of supplements, proper dosage of lactulose, and small, frequent meals are VERY important.

Feeding small, frequent meals is of paramount importance in a dog that is symptomatic like your baby...Feeding a small meal every three or four hours (total of 5-6 meals per day) will help lighten the load on the liver....
Doing this makes it to where the toxins don't back up like they would if you only fed 2-3x/day... This makes *the world of difference* for them. It helps them tolerate their food much better, and it makes it to where they don't feel sick after they eat.
Don't let him eat a large amount at once. So, if he's supposed to eat 1/2 a cup in the whole day, split that up into 5 equal parts and feed that every 3-4 hours...
If you do this, you will notice a huge improvement in the neurological symptoms after meals.

Canned L/D is better than dry because the dry L/D contains ethoxyquin which is carcinogenic...If you would prefer to stick with a dry food, Royal Canin makes a prescription food for liver compromised dogs called Royal Canin Hepatic LS 14 which is very palatable and most dogs seem to love.
The following is a link to a group that will provide you with a ton of information. You will learn so much there. Please join:

DogLiverDisease : Dog Liver Disease

Luckymom · 12-14-2008, 02:36 PM

Yorkieluv,
Wow thanks for all the info. I can tell you have definitely done your homework. You have helped me SO much!! I will start feeding Lucky more frequently and also I will try really hard to catch him pooping so I can see his stools. I also have been googling everything I can about this disease. I will also go to the link you provided. Yes, he doesn't seem to whine and twitch as much between meals - mainly after I feed him. I just feel so sorry for him, it is so sad to see him uncomfortable. Hopefully he will gain most of is balance back - he is still a little unsteady on his feet, but not as bad. Before his diagnosed the poor thing could hardly walk. He was stumbling around like he was drunk. It broke my heart. I feel so bad because he was showing some lethargic, depressed, symptoms for like a month before I really realized that something was bad wrong. But when he started stumbling around it really caught my attention. I wish so bad I had helped him earlier. Today he is finally actually running a little bit which is great. I will keep you posted regularly so you can see how he is doing. Thanks again for being so kind and helping me with this.

Luckymom · 12-14-2008, 02:38 PM

Ellie Mae,
Lucky is on Dry L/D and Lactulose. He is definitely doing better. Thanks so much for asking and for caring. I appreciate all the input.

Luckymom · 12-14-2008, 02:40 PM

Yorkichonbella,
Thanks so much for you sweet thoughts about Lucky. yes this disease is bad. I had never heard of it until this diagnosis. I wanted to spread the word because the vet told me that Yorkies are the number one breed to get this. She said it usually appears by the age of 4. My Lucky is 8 so she was surprised it showed up so late. Thanks again!!

12-10-2008, 07:43 PM	#1
Luckymom Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Tulsa, OK, USA Posts: 43	Beware of this Horrible Disease! Hi. I am brand new to this site and am so happy to meet all of you. I have two yorkies, and one yorkie mix. My yorkie Lucky is 8 years old, and Hayley is 12 weeks. They are so precious to me. I just wanted to warn all of you who have never heard about Portal Caval Shunt Disease. It is a disease of the liver and I just found out today my Lucky has it. The last couple of months have been awful because it took that long to diagnose him! So if your yorkie ever starts getting very depressed, lethargic, is very unsteady on his feet (walks like he is drunk), disoriented, paces, drinks a lot of fluid, beware of this disease. He has been so pathetic I was so afraid. They are treating him with antibiotics and some other meds, and also put him on a VERY low protein diet called LD (that is the new food I have to put him on). If I help even one person then that is great. I have just been beside myself with worry. Hopefully in a few days on the new meds and diet, he will be back to his old self. I am so glad I found yorkietalk.com! Gail

12-11-2008, 02:47 AM	#2
Lisa and Pic ♥ Piccolo & Vivi ♥ Donating Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Kentucky Posts: 14,311	I am so very sorry about Lucky and it sounds like you are being a great YorkieMom. However, I am glad you found us and Welcome to YorkieTalk. __________________ Lisa, Dixie, and Jazzy (RIP Piccolo and Vivi)

12-11-2008, 02:57 AM	#3
jfalz73 Owned by my yorkies Donating Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Coats, NC Posts: 5,001	Welcome to YT! I will keep your Lucky in my prayers! __________________ My little dog-a heartbeat at my feet. -Edith Wharton jeanne BrooklynBenjamin

12-11-2008, 04:26 AM	#4
Ellie May And Rylee Finnegan Donating Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Metro Detroit, MI Posts: 17,928	Welcome to YT and I'm so sorry about Lucky. Sadly, most vets know so little about liver disease in Yorkies that they don't do bile acids testing soon enough. Most dogs with this disease are diagnosed at a much longer age (before a year or two). Is it a liver shunt or microvascular dysplasia? The L/D he is on, is it canned or dry? Is he on Denosyl or Vetri-DMG? Is he on lactulose and vitamin e? __________________ Crystal, Ellie May (RIP), Rylee Finnegan, and Gracie Boo🐶

12-13-2008, 10:55 AM	#7
Luckymom Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Tulsa, OK, USA Posts: 43	Lucky's diagnosis First of all, thanks for the warm welcome and for caring. Yes Lucky has been actually diagnosed (3 days ago) with Portal Caval Shunt which is this liver disease. His acid bile test was supposed to be like under "7" and his number came back at "245"! It is a wonder he is still alive. As I said he was SO depressed, lethargic, stumbling, no balance, very disoriented. just awful. Anyway, she gave him Amoxicillin and some liquid stuff to get the toxins out of his system. Then she switched him to LD Diet which is very low protein. She said it is extremely important that he stay on this low protein food. After 3 days on the new food and meds, he is already perking up - I am so happy to report this!! I will keep you posted - it is so nice to meet all of you. Gail

12-11-2008, 04:30 AM	#5
MollysMum54 YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: England,UK Posts: 1,176	I was wondering if this kind of illness means we should cut down on our doggies protein intake as they get older? I feed a lowish protein dried food to Molly, but add more in the shape of chicken or lamb. She is just over 3 years old.

12-13-2008, 11:14 AM	#8
YorkichonBella My little Shadow Donating YT Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: NC Posts: 4,132 Blog Entries: 2	Thank you so much for sharing your story and knowledge on this disease & we wish the very best for Lucky. So glad he is now beginning to feel better and hope it continues!! Hugs! __________________ Bella Ganma-ma to ColeRIPNoahRIP

12-13-2008, 07:34 PM	#9
Yorkieluv Donating YT 3000 Club Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: USA Posts: 7,178	Hi Luckymom I'm so sorry that your Lucky has liver problems. My yorkie also has liver disease, so I know exactly the symptoms you are talking about. The liquid stuff is very likely lactulose. This is just as important as giving the appropriate food (L/D in your case). I'm not sure if your vet explained it to you, but lactulose should be given 3x/day in amounts that will make him have 2 soft stools per day...not firm, not diarrhea, but somewhat difficult to pick up with a paper towel. This is of paramount important in keeping the toxins from backing up. When the toxins back up, it causes the neurological symptoms that you have seen in Lucky. Many of us have had to tweak the dosage of lactulose to get it just right. It takes some time, but when you get it right, it will be very beneficial to your baby. Denosyl and milk thistle are very helpful supplements for dogs with liver shunt. They help protect the liver from further damage, and they also help the parts that are already damaged. __________________ Miko 's his Mommy

12-14-2008, 09:06 AM	#10
Luckymom Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Tulsa, OK, USA Posts: 43	Hi Yorkieluv, Thanks so much for your response! I am so sorry to hear your yorkie has the same thing, but I am also glad to hear from someone who understands. Everyone has been so wonderful and caring..I appreciate everyone's input. You are exactly correct, it is Lactulose that he is taking. I give it to him 3 times a day, and the Amoxicillin 2 x a day. The vet said he may have to stay on these things for a very long time. But that is OK if it makes him feel better. I can't tell what his stool is like because we have a huge backyard and I never can seem to catch him pooping. But I am going to try to catch him so I can see the consistency. He is feeling much perkier, but he still does this weird thing. After he eats he kind of paces around and whines, and then when he lays down to sleep, his head twitches - like little sideways jerks. I know that sounds weird. I honestly think that his brain has been damaged from all the toxins and it is making him do weird things. He is still a little unstable on his feet but I think that will get better. Any input is always welcome!! THANKS!!

12-14-2008, 09:19 AM	#11
Luckymom Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Tulsa, OK, USA Posts: 43	help please with photo. I am new so don't really know what I am doing yet. I just want to upload one picture of Lucky so that it will show up next to all of my posts (like everyone else has). Please someone tell me step by step what to do? I am computer savvy and all, but I am not sure where to go to do this. thanks.

12-14-2008, 02:36 PM	#13
Luckymom Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Tulsa, OK, USA Posts: 43	Yorkieluv, Wow thanks for all the info. I can tell you have definitely done your homework. You have helped me SO much!! I will start feeding Lucky more frequently and also I will try really hard to catch him pooping so I can see his stools. I also have been googling everything I can about this disease. I will also go to the link you provided. Yes, he doesn't seem to whine and twitch as much between meals - mainly after I feed him. I just feel so sorry for him, it is so sad to see him uncomfortable. Hopefully he will gain most of is balance back - he is still a little unsteady on his feet, but not as bad. Before his diagnosed the poor thing could hardly walk. He was stumbling around like he was drunk. It broke my heart. I feel so bad because he was showing some lethargic, depressed, symptoms for like a month before I really realized that something was bad wrong. But when he started stumbling around it really caught my attention. I wish so bad I had helped him earlier. Today he is finally actually running a little bit which is great. I will keep you posted regularly so you can see how he is doing. Thanks again for being so kind and helping me with this.

12-14-2008, 02:38 PM	#14
Luckymom Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Tulsa, OK, USA Posts: 43	Ellie Mae, Lucky is on Dry L/D and Lactulose. He is definitely doing better. Thanks so much for asking and for caring. I appreciate all the input.

12-14-2008, 02:40 PM	#15
Luckymom Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Tulsa, OK, USA Posts: 43	Yorkichonbella, Thanks so much for you sweet thoughts about Lucky. yes this disease is bad. I had never heard of it until this diagnosis. I wanted to spread the word because the vet told me that Yorkies are the number one breed to get this. She said it usually appears by the age of 4. My Lucky is 8 so she was surprised it showed up so late. Thanks again!!