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Old 06-28-2012, 06:02 AM   #1
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If your baby is diagnosed with a genetic disease such as a liver shunt, would it be advisable to find the breeder and let her know, I am very angry right now... that is after crying for days from the diagnosis, and I feel like telling her, is this something random or is she somehow responsible? there is so much information out there that I get overwhelmed so I thought it might be easier just to ask someone on here. thank you
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Old 06-28-2012, 07:24 AM   #2
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I am sorry for the diagnosis of liver shunt From what I understand LS is genetic and you should definetely let the breeder know. The breeding stock she is using needs to be spayed and neutered to prevent future offspring being born with LS.
I see you are in Oak Ridge..I live in East Tn also. Have you consulted with Dr. Tobias at UT? She is the best in the nation for treating LS babies.
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Old 06-28-2012, 09:35 AM   #3
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Well, hopefully your breeder didn't already know that there is LS in her lines It could just have popped up, that does happen, from what I understand. I'd approach her nicely (you catch more flies with honey ) and go from there. Hopefully they're a good breeder who cares.

Wishing your baby all the best! Definitely check into Dr. Tobias, I have seen many babies here that are now thriving because of that doc
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Old 06-28-2012, 10:42 AM   #4
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Breeders do need to be advised with a "firm" diagnosis of LS. That is the full range of diagnostic tests have been done, in order to confirm the type of Liver Disease. High BATS are just not enough to confirm LS and exactly what type it is.
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Old 06-28-2012, 10:44 AM   #5
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A little confused on what you mean by "find the breeder", surely you know the breeder, have a contract with them et al. If you bought at a pet store, then your remedy if you are looking for a financial remedy will be covered or not through the details of the health guarantee they offer.
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Old 06-28-2012, 12:25 PM   #6
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I am sorry for the diagnosis of liver shunt From what I understand LS is genetic and you should definetely let the breeder know. The breeding stock she is using needs to be spayed and neutered to prevent future offspring being born with LS.
I see you are in Oak Ridge..I live in East Tn also. Have you consulted with Dr. Tobias at UT? She is the best in the nation for treating LS babies.
Thank you for responding, I just found the breeder on facebook so I messaged her, I appreciate you confirming that is what I should do. I would love to take her to UT but I just don't have the money right now, so I will just have to do what I can with the vet here in Oak Ridge.
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Old 06-28-2012, 12:37 PM   #7
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A little confused on what you mean by "find the breeder", surely you know the breeder, have a contract with them et al. If you bought at a pet store, then your remedy if you are looking for a financial remedy will be covered or not through the details of the health guarantee they offer.
I had her name on the bill of sale and registration number, I just didn't have her phone number, so I found her on facebook.
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Old 06-28-2012, 12:44 PM   #8
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Breeders do need to be advised with a "firm" diagnosis of LS. That is the full range of diagnostic tests have been done, in order to confirm the type of Liver Disease. High BATS are just not enough to confirm LS and exactly what type it is.
continued testing is very expensive for me, which test would confirm? because he had several test he wanted to do at a couple hundred of dollars a test, I just can't afford to do them all, so he said we will treat a shunt since that is what her symptoms are. I honestly don't know what to do in this horrible situation.
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:01 PM   #9
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I hate to say this, and I know you won't want to hear it, but you must do what is best for the pup. Is there anyone that can lend you the money? If you can't get proper treatment for this dog, surrendering it to a Yorkie rescue would be what needs to be done to ensure that this pup has a fighting chance. That's why you need a firm diagnosis. If it's the type that is treatable by diet and meds and not surgery, you'd be okay. If the shunt is the type that needs to be operated on, diet and meds might buy a little time, but without surgery this baby is in trouble. I'm so sorry I am in the same boat as you, if one of mine got seriously ill, and needed surgery that I couldn't manage financially, I would have to part with them and surrender to rescue. When we got our dogs, we were pretty well off financially, but the economy has really hurt us. I would have to do the right thing for my baby, as heartbreaking as it would be for us.

Please try to get a definitive diagnosis. Call UT and just ask what it would cost for the tests there, it may be even less than your local vet.

Thinking of you and your baby
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:17 PM   #10
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Quote:
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continued testing is very expensive for me, which test would confirm? because he had several test he wanted to do at a couple hundred of dollars a test, I just can't afford to do them all, so he said we will treat a shunt since that is what her symptoms are. I honestly don't know what to do in this horrible situation.
What are her Pre and Post numbers?
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:23 PM   #11
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What are her Pre and Post numbers?
the first time the test was done, the pre number was 78 and the post was 83. the second time the first number was 4 and the second was 80.
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:53 PM   #12
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the first time the test was done, the pre number was 78 and the post was 83. the second time the first number was 4 and the second was 80.
Yes the numbers are elevated, but you are doing good by learning what you can. Did you see the specialist yet? That would be a good start. Numbers like that along with a dog that is asymptomatic (not sure if your dog is or not), usually lean more towards have MVD rather than a shunt.

My Roxy, her first BAT was Pre 43 and Post 100.9 - that was when she was 3 years old. We did about 5 more BATs over her 4th and 5th year, along with a U/S and other blood work, and the Protein C test. She is also pretty asymptomatic, so her Vet and IMS both felt she had MVD. I didn't do anything further, except special diet and loads of liver supporting supplements...

Now Roxy is 7.5 years and still asymptomatic. She needs a dental, so my Vet did a full blood work, including a BAT (since it had been about 2 yrs)...Well...Her Post is 280 Talk about a SHOCK!!!!

We are still trying to figure out what is going on...but I just wanted to tell you that you are not alone And having a liver issue is not a death sentence for these pups
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:57 PM   #13
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Oh and the Vets over here in the NY area, usually say that a Post under 100 is most likely MVD and a Post over 100 is a Shunt...but each dog is different, as we all know some dogs that had numbers under 100 with a shunt, and dogs over 100 with MVD
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:21 PM   #14
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One thing you can do now is go to the library here; there is a sticky entitled Help for Vet Care. You might be able to find some economic support through one of the organizations listed.

You can also call Univ of Tennessee and ask what is the best test to determine Extraheptatic Shunt that they would recommend. Explain that your funds are limited and "due to your health guaranty" you need to be able to confirm a diagnosis of LS.

Also the breeder might be able to help you out in this aspect of things. Maybe they would be open to advancing you the money for the test(s).

The BAT numbers are relatively "low", unfortunately while those numbers are suggestive of MVD, it is not definitive one way or the other.

I know you must be feeling overwhelmed about now. But your pup does need you to garner around you the support necessary do the work to raise the funds, to proceed with testing, so that you know what you are dealing with.

There are some financial options you can apply for;
1. Care Credit
2. Investigate the Help with Vet care links
3. Find out what and how "much" will the testing cost to determine the $$ you need to raise for your pup
4. Have a garage sale; summer is a great time to do this
5. Part time job?
6. Family/friends - short term loan?

Just take it step by step. slow and sure. Do something each day. Phone calls/emails can get you in touch with Univ of Tennessee.

Talk with the breeder. Have a plan on what you want to say. Know your contract inside out prior to calling the breeder. Does your State have Puppy Lemon Laws? If so look them up see what the breeder needs to abide by.

I wish you the best for your puppy. And if there are other questions you have, please do ask. We all want a good and healthy long life for your dog.
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Old 06-28-2012, 05:06 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TLC View Post
Yes the numbers are elevated, but you are doing good by learning what you can. Did you see the specialist yet? That would be a good start. Numbers like that along with a dog that is asymptomatic (not sure if your dog is or not), usually lean more towards have MVD rather than a shunt.

My Roxy, her first BAT was Pre 43 and Post 100.9 - that was when she was 3 years old. We did about 5 more BATs over her 4th and 5th year, along with a U/S and other blood work, and the Protein C test. She is also pretty asymptomatic, so her Vet and IMS both felt she had MVD. I didn't do anything further, except special diet and loads of liver supporting supplements...

Now Roxy is 7.5 years and still asymptomatic. She needs a dental, so my Vet did a full blood work, including a BAT (since it had been about 2 yrs)...Well...Her Post is 280 Talk about a SHOCK!!!!

We are still trying to figure out what is going on...but I just wanted to tell you that you are not alone And having a liver issue is not a death sentence for these pups
thank you so much, I really needed to hear that! I don't feel so alone and like there is hope.
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