Please help!!!

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by FlDebra

Agree! I hand fed a litter of 5 from 3 days old when I lost my girl Sadie. No way would I have split them up and then left them completely on their own. Bad enough they had only me for a mom instead of their real mom.

This is not a good sign at all. I hear so many stories of breeders selling off way too young pups because the mom won't nurse, is sick, or doesn't like them. When in reality it doesn't matter -- those pups are still the breeder's responsibility!! Most of them are probably just tired of the extra work and mess. Shame on them! Maybe this momma dog is at the vet's sick, but that is still no excuse. When a breeder is wanting to do something like this, other short cuts and wrong-doings are likely. I would ask yourself if you really want this puppy. As cute as they all are, do you want to encourage irresponsible breeding?

If you do get her -- listen to Mardelin! She knows her stuff and the Goat's milk idea saved my puppies! Much better than the commercial formula they sell. Also I would get one of the stuffed animals that have the little plastic heart in them that beats and a reheatable rice bag to keep warm. My puppies all liked to cuddle toegether on the one I bought. Got mine (a cat) at PetSmart.

While I don't agree with the breeder's reasons for allowing these pups to go home at a young age. Bottom line the pups welfare is what is at stake here.

Goat's Milk is the closets thing to mother's milk.

Commercial mother's milk replacements have some problems with them.
Esbilac has trace minerals that can contribute to shunt.
Just Born can contribute to premature cataracs.

[YoRkIeMoMmY92]

Ok I talked to the breeder and she brought mom home today but she is not aloud around the pups or any other dogs she can't even go outside because she had surgery but the vet gave her scientist special can puppy food and milk and told her as long as they are eating good and not throwing up she can start getting rid of them next week.

[Woogie Man]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

The only advice I could give you would be to NOT get the pup at such a young age. Even if the mom is no longer able to nurse, it's the breeder's responsibility to continue raising the pups until it reaches a suitable age to be released. It's not the ideal situation, but it's definitely does NOT justify separating them from the litter mates and placing them with new owners at such a young age. Placing them at under 8 weeks is not even LEGAL in many states.

I'm sorry, but I truly believe that if you get this dog, not only are you just setting yourself up for a rough time and heartache, but you are also supporting a breeder with very unethical breeding practices, which would make you both pretty irresponsible.

I agree with this completely and cannot fathom a good reason for taking a pup on at 5 weeks. The ONLY responsible thing to do is for the breeder to keep these pups until they are older. If you are able to help her out with their care, fine, but under no circumstances should these pups be taken away from their Mom and littermates at this time.

[AllDogBoots]

Originally Posted by YoRkIeMoMmY92

Ok I talked to the breeder and she brought mom home today but she is not aloud around the pups or any other dogs she can't even go outside because she had surgery but the vet gave her scientist special can puppy food and milk and told her as long as they are eating good and not throwing up she can start getting rid of them next week.

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by YoRkIeMoMmY92

Ok I talked to the breeder and she brought mom home today but she is not aloud around the pups or any other dogs she can't even go outside because she had surgery but the vet gave her scientist special can puppy food and milk and told her as long as they are eating good and not throwing up she can start getting rid of them next week.

Geez, the vet is as irresponsible as the breeder. I love it.....getting rid of them. I know that in my heart this isn't the proper thing to do, but the pup is in a horrible situation and just maybe would have a better survival rate with you.

You're between a rock and a hard place, whether to support a greeder or walk away from a pup. Or go with your heart.

[Woogie Man]

Originally Posted by YoRkIeMoMmY92

Ok I talked to the breeder and she brought mom home today but she is not aloud around the pups or any other dogs she can't even go outside because she had surgery but the vet gave her scientist special can puppy food and milk and told her as long as they are eating good and not throwing up she can start getting rid of them next week.

I'm sorry, but that vet's advice is crap. He is wrong on so many levels. In your state (Ohio), it is illegal to sell puppies before 8 weeks of age, for many good reasons, all pertaining to the welfare of the pups. Vets don't always give the best advice in matters such as this and this vet is not only wrong, but apparently is ignorant of the law.

This is a bad situation, but the breeder is looking for an easy way out, with no regard for these pups. To go along with this is only enabling her unethical behavior.

[blancla]

I am so sorry that you are going through this. I don't agree with the vet or the breeder in this case. Mardelin has given you some great advice. She helped me a lot when I had a litter. Please PM her if you have any questions. She is a great asset to YT.

[FlDebra]

Originally Posted by Mardelin

While I don't agree with the breeder's reasons for allowing these pups to go home at a young age. Bottom line the pups welfare is what is at stake here.

Goat's Milk is the closets thing to mother's milk.

Commercial mother's milk replacements have some problems with them.
Esbilac has trace minerals that can contribute to shunt.
Just Born can contribute to premature cataracs.

Originally Posted by YoRkIeMoMmY92

Ok I talked to the breeder and she brought mom home today but she is not aloud around the pups or any other dogs she can't even go outside because she had surgery but the vet gave her scientist special can puppy food and milk and told her as long as they are eating good and not throwing up she can start getting rid of them next week.

Mary -- agree wholeheartedly. I did not even know the other reasons for not using the commercially prepared formulas. I do know you and another breeder on here saved my puppies lives, especially the littlest one who was not doing well at all on the formula. With the goat's milk, they all thrived, even the little one the vet thought was not going to make it.

Yorkiemommy92 -- You are having to hear what this vet says second hand. Hard to believe he would say that, but maybe he did. Vets do sometimes give lousy advice and this is. I am guessing you meant the vet gave her Science Diet puppy food. I would not go with that! Get a quality puppy food and use the goat's milk formula Mary (Mardelin) suggested.

If you read what you wrote "she can start getting rid of them next week, " you will see the situation clearly. People (not you) are thinking of getting rid of these precious, living, breathing puppies! Just using those words tells me volumes about attitude. I doubt the vet used those words, if he did, he is in the wrong business! She may be a friend of your mom's, and there are always a million excuses why irresponsible breeders do not keep the puppies long enough.....but I think you understand what is right and wrong here.

If you are able to devote the time needed for the puppy, maybe you could volunteer to be a foster mom to more than one for a few weeks until they ARE old enough to sell. If you could take half, and another person could take half (or if you could take them all!) they would have so much better of a start. They learn by socializing with each other. It makes for much more confident and emotionally-secure pets. Trust me on this one!

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by Woogie Man

In your state (Ohio), it is illegal to sell puppies before 8 weeks of age

How sad.

[YorkieRose]

Breeding is not always smooth sailing...the breeder needs to to her job..keep the pups until placing age...they may not be able to be with their mom, but they sure need the littermates for ideal development at this point.

Unless the breeder is in ICU or the graveyard, it is never acceptable to allow the new owner to do their job.

[OwnedByJezebel]

Originally Posted by YoRkIeMoMmY92

The breeder is a close friend of my moms and she is a really good person and if anything happens to the puppy she will make it right and we are not paying for the puppy until the end of the month but she is going through a lot and can't be home to take care of the puppies because her nephew is dying.

What is she going to do with the other pups? What is she going to do with the Mom? None of them should be left alone at this point.

I don't understand the significance of when you are paying for the pup. What does that have to do with any of this? Regardless of when you pay for the pup, that does not change that it is illegal for it to be "gotten rid of" before the age of 8 weeks.

[smepperson]

Originally Posted by FlDebra

Mary -- agree wholeheartedly. I did not even know the other reasons for not using the commercially prepared formulas. I do know you and another breeder on here saved my puppies lives, especially the littlest one who was not doing well at all on the formula. With the goat's milk, they all thrived, even the little one the vet thought was not going to make it.

Yorkiemommy92 -- You are having to hear what this vet says second hand. Hard to believe he would say that, but maybe he did. Vets do sometimes give lousy advice and this is. I am guessing you meant the vet gave her Science Diet puppy food. I would not go with that! Get a quality puppy food and use the goat's milk formula Mary (Mardelin) suggested.

If you read what you wrote "she can start getting rid of them next week, " you will see the situation clearly. People (not you) are thinking of getting rid of these precious, living, breathing puppies! Just using those words tells me volumes about attitude. I doubt the vet used those words, if he did, he is in the wrong business! She may be a friend of your mom's, and there are always a million excuses why irresponsible breeders do not keep the puppies long enough.....but I think you understand what is right and wrong here.

If you are able to devote the time needed for the puppy, maybe you could volunteer to be a foster mom to more than one for a few weeks until they ARE old enough to sell. If you could take half, and another person could take half (or if you could take them all!) they would have so much better of a start. They learn by socializing with each other. It makes for much more confident and emotionally-secure pets. Trust me on this one!

[OwnedByJezebel]

I think it is strange that the vet isn't going to allow the Mom to be around other dogs. Has anyone ever heard of such a restriction after the Mom has eclampsia? Perhaps a restriction that she shouldn't nurse anymore, but why should she have to stay away from other dogs?

[blancla]

Originally Posted by OwnedByJezebel

I think it is strange that the vet isn't going to allow the Mom to be around other dogs. Has anyone ever heard of such a restriction after the Mom has eclampsia? Perhaps a restriction that she shouldn't nurse anymore, but why should she have to stay away from other dogs?

I find it odd too. My Ellie had eclampsia, and the only thing the vet told me was not to let her nurse the puppies anymore. I put a onsie on her and she still tended to them even though I bottle fed the entire litter. They turned out great and are in happy healthy homes now.

The entire story isn't sounding right to me. I just wanted to offer some help in the event that she did have to take the puppy home so early. I am not in agreement with it though.

[Sbyork]

Everyone has said it better than I can. I am going through something very simular, My puppies are 5 weeks today and Mom had to be spayed yesterday, She is doing OK but I don't want to stress her by letting them nurse BUT she still sees them and cleans them.
They MUST MUST be with their litter mates untill 12 weeks or I know first hand they will never have all the social skills as a DOG. My Mother got one at 7 weeks, years ago and while she loved him to pieces he was NEVER a happy dog with anyone but her! He never got any doggie social skills.
I also have a wonderful puppy formula that has saved many Moms and puppies in the last 30 yrs, If you would like please PM me!
Again PLEASE do not let them separate those puppies. They need to be fed every 4 hours around the clock and you NEED to know all the little signs, any breeder knows from day one something can go wrong and ANY breeder needs to be willing to do the best for the babies , no matter what else. She chose to bring them into the world NOW she needs to get with the program
Sorry this may sound harsh
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