Cocidosis or Giardia

[China]

What is it and how do puppies get it?

I wash all the utinsels and rinse them well using clorox.
The female is bathed at least a couple of times a week and I clean her
nipples and rear area sometimes several times a day.Yet I had a puppy to get Cocidosis and it spread to the whole litter of 3 puppies. One died and the other 2 were on medication for a good while after they were sold.
The vet offered little information on this other than to keep the animals clean and their area clean.

Now for future litters what can I do to make sure this dosn't happen again.. What am I missing, what didn't I do that could have prevented this??What am I looking for? I have raised Yorkies several years now and this is a first and it was soooo un-nerving.

China

[Wylie's Mom]

I'm not sure what you should do in the event of a pregnant or nursing female, but I know some breeders can help.

[ksmoss]

One of my yorkies had giardia when I got her. We had to keep her isolated from our other dogs until her treatment was done and her test came back negative. We also had to pick up her stools right away and treat the area with a bleach solution because the eggs can live on the ground and re-infect the dogs if the area they are going potty and the area is not treated. Ask your vet what they recommend. I know it was a ton of work, but well worth it to keep it from spreading to my other dogs. My little yorkie finally got better, but it took two treatments, and about 3 or 4 weeks until we were sure she was okay. Hope this helps.

[lemonlauren]

My puppy had giardia when we got him, and developed coccidia quickly thereafter if he didn't already have it (coccidia I believe lives in all dogs' intestines to a certain extent, but it turns into a problem sometimes in puppies when they are under stress like moving to a new home, or other dogs can have it spiral out of control if their immune system is compromised).

Both are horrible intestinal parasites, both are pretty hard to get rid of. Giardia is harder to get rid of because it's harder for vets to see (it's really small), and may not even be evident in every poop while the pup is infected. Even the smallest amounts of poop ingested will reinfect a dog. We have washed our pup's bum and paws immediately after EVERY SINGLE poop with baby shampoo for over a month now to get rid of the giardia. If they sniff it, you have to wash their face too, as well as pray they didn't ingest any it. We hope it's gone in our pup now, but it's nearly impossible to be absolutely sure until the stools stay consistent for awhile longer. We also use a 20% bleach 80% water solution which we pour over the area he pooped on right after we pick up the poop. We also wipe the floors and the bottoms of our shoes down with this solution and let it dry thoroughly about once a week. Literally even little bits of poop you can't even see will reinfect the pup, and bleach is the only thing that really kills it, so bleach your grass if you have to... or just make sure they only use the bathroom on gravel which is easier to bleach (our yard here in Nevada is landscaped gravel, so we're lucky we don't have to deal with grass).

Dogs can get these parasites from a healthy mom carrying low levels of them in her stool, other dogs' poop, bird poop (I think), standing water like rain puddles, eating mud/dirt, etc.

Hope that helps a little... these parasites are nasty, as you know by now. Sorry to hear about the pup. :-( Your vet's advice is all you can really do, so far as I know. Clean, clean, clean, and NO POOP. I can't imagine how hard that would be with a brand new litter of pooping puppies!

Lauren & Nikko

[China]

Thanks so much for the input. This is really a great help and it gives me a direction to take to....
When you mentioned the bird poop, you may be on to something there.

My backyard neighbor had just fenced in his spare lot and started raising chickens. The chickens aren't the problem but the black birds,doves and pegions coming after the uneaten chicken feed were. I use to be able to keep dry food outside on the back patio during the day for the dogs that are allowed out but the birds got so bad we had to bring it in. They come after the extra feed the neighbor leaves for his chickens. I have 2 big oak trees out back, one overhangs the patio and the birds roost and wait there leaving there poop over the ground under the tree where the dogs walk back and forth.
When this all stared was about last June and the litter was born in July and we lost the pup in Mid September when Hurrican Ike hit. We had to evacuate and the puppy got sick and no vet was available. Knowing what I know now I am blessed that I didn't lose the other 2.
So this is at least making sense now, I guess I'll have to disenfect the whole yard and find something to keep those darn birds away..... At least that's a start...
So far my adult dogs don't show any problems, should I be concerned with this effecting them? Let me know what yall think this is serious...

Thanks again.

China

[Laura Hollingsw]

I am dealing with the exact same thing I posted in health. I think I should have posted here. YES all your dogs will have it if they are togehter. it is very contagious. I purchased a female Yorkie and she came with it. I thought I got rid of it But I guess I didn't my vet told me not to treat all my dogs. I shouldn't have listened.Now for sure 1 of my puppies have it. Thankfully I found out before they went to there new home. I am treating all my dogs. My vet said bleach will not kill it. She said that if the weather is 0 degrees or lower it will kill the parasite. I hope so cause we have had lots of that weather here. They said to wash the puppies everytime they get poop on them. To clean up poop right away. Last time I dumped bleach right on the spot. Straight bleach. It must not have helped. I also spray all my grooming tools with 1/2 vinegar and water.
I will also be watching this thread. Hopefully someone can share something because I am in desperate need of help!!!.

[bjh]

Originally Posted by China

What is it and how do puppies get it?

I wash all the utinsels and rinse them well using clorox.
The female is bathed at least a couple of times a week and I clean her
nipples and rear area sometimes several times a day.Yet I had a puppy to get Cocidosis and it spread to the whole litter of 3 puppies. One died and the other 2 were on medication for a good while after they were sold.
The vet offered little information on this other than to keep the animals clean and their area clean.

Now for future litters what can I do to make sure this dosn't happen again.. What am I missing, what didn't I do that could have prevented this??What am I looking for? I have raised Yorkies several years now and this is a first and it was soooo un-nerving.

China

I am sorry you had to lose a puppy over this. Coccidia is much more common than most people realize. I have read that up to 72% of dogs may have some level of infection with coccidia. A dog can get it from eating dog poop, bird poop, a cockroach or mice droppings. The mom can be a carrier but show no clinical signs until she has pups then she might have an outbreak of diarrhea. Just a small amount of feces on her coat or feet can spread it to her newborn pups. The incubation period is usually 6 to 10 days. Often you see puppies anywhere from 3 weeks to 8 weeks or older that have the outbreaks. The outbreaks are usually triggered by stress so that is why it shows up more when a puppy is being weaned or goes to a new home. Many breeders will automatically treat puppies with Albon about a week before letting them go to a new home, just as a preventative. Coccidia is hard to diagnose in a routine stool sample if the dog is not having an outbreak.

Giardia is usually passed on from dogs drinking dirty water. It is also difficult to treat.

How old were the pups when you sold them. Did the pup die at your home or at the new owners home? I am sure you did all you could. In the future you will know what signs to look for. Normally any puppy that has icky poop and is straining should see a vet immediately.

[Laura Hollingsw]

I to cleaned, sterelized and washed like crazy. I cleaned up poop immediately and dumped bleach on it. Now my puppies have it. So the mom dog must of had it too.My vet told me I did everything right it is just so hard to get rid of. I am now going to medicate my dogs every 6 months and checked poop before I breed a female. Then treat pups before they go to a new just as a precation. I feel like a bad breeder but my vet keeps telling me it is not because I am not clean..... My hands are so sore from washing them now they are splitting open. I am just praying all this work is going to help!!!

I have separted all my pups now. They are all washed and everything sterelized. So now it is a waiting game and just cleaning like crazy. Please pray for me and my puppies!!!

[China]

[F]Laura, I have talked to my vet about this again since I have a new litter. He said the bleaching and cleaning will help as long as you stay at it. One caution he mentioned is if you over look one area (yard, garage, house): the parasite can still latch onto a dog or pups bringing it back to the pups and reinfect them againeek:.So be sure and clean feet (paw's) each time they go outside or if they are in another part of the home you may not have cleaned as well.
The other problem is when the puppies go to a new home the stress they suffer from being separated from mom and siblings can set it off. Not only that but do the new owners have other dogs that may be harboring the parasite thereby further exposing the pups to it. Plus you cannot control how others keep their animals even if you make them aware of the situation. But you can try.

The only thing we can do as breeders is keep or animals and their quarters as clean as we can and watch the pups for any sign's of illness. Since we are aware of the danger it now gives us something to look for.

I feel bad that I was not aware of this problem before losing a puppy and nearly losing 2 more. But at least now I can be prepared and act as soon as something seems out of the ordinary.

I have a friend that rasied Siamese Cats and their neminusis is Clymida. So I guess we all have something to contend with. I must count my blessings to have not had this surface the past 3 years of breeding.[/FONT

Laura my prayers are with you and your babies. I think you are doing all you can and if I get anymore info I will let you know.....

I am going to try a couple of other disenfectants on the market and see how they do........I will let you know what they are and how I am using them....

Best to you

China

[fannie]

Bleach does not kill cocci and you have to be very careful using that around your dogs. You can damage their lungs with the fumes. However, steam does kill cocci. Invest in a steam cleaner and use it regularly.

Something else you can do is use Marquee. It's a horse wormer that will get rid of cocci in our dogs. Talk to your vet about it to get the proper dosing. Give a dose to mom 2 weeks before she has her puppies and then dose the puppies when they are 2 weeks old.

[Laura Hollingsw]

China thank you so much!!
I am so sorry you lost puppies. I will pray for you with this new litter. From what I understand if you treat the mom before she gets pregnant 2-3 weeks before whelping and the puppies at 2-3 weeks then should be fine. So far all my puppies are o.k. I am just so frustrated with the whole thing because it seems like it is something I will never get rid of.
I also have a huge back yard. I know there has to be poop out there somewhere. When all our snow starts melting I hope I can get it all.
Is there not someway we could sanitize our lawns??? You would think there would be something.
I am also wondering if I should ask my vet for more meds to send with puppies because if it is cleared up thenit might come back again from the stress of everything.
My puppies were screaming when I separated them for hours and would not stop. I ended up putting them back together because I was afraid that with with being so upset it would make it worse. I hope didn't do the wrong thing but I am just at a loss what to do everything so contradictory.They are calm now and happy.I just could not let them scream anymore and it was screaming.... It sounded like someone was killing the poor babies. Usually they calm down after abit but it was for 2 1/2 hours straight.
I am at my frustration level with pipes bursting,freezing weather (-30ish), sick dogs,and life in general lol. I know it will get better I am just venting I guess....
Laura

[Laura Hollingsw]

I also forgot to add... I have been using vinegar and water half and half for disinfecting. My vet said that is good disinfectant and safer around dogs?puppies.

[bjh]

I would never treat a pregnant female with anything. I know that Albon given to pregnant bitches can cause birth defects. If a puppy has coccidia then the puppy, litter mates and mom just need to be treated with albon for one week. The danger with coccidia is if you ignore the symptoms. Whether you are a puppy owner or a breeder, if your puppies start getting icky poops then they need to go to the vet immediately. I always keep Albon on hand.

[smartpuppiepets]

What can i say, i keep it clean, clean, clean... but after i told our vet that someone who got one of our puppies reported to me positive of this parasite he recommended treating all the adults on a schedule and we do it. regular fecal exams of our adults and puppies as well. I read somewhere that amonia also kills it.
The interesting part is that we never heard of this problem before until we had a bird feeder here and a few regular visitors to it. We took off the bird feeder and i have decided that the most i miss the birdies i am never having it back again.
The more information i have about the parasite , it seems to infect even reptiles.... nasty and hard to get rid of and easy to bring it back in.
i plan to treat all the dogs at vets recomendation a few times a year, not expensive at all ., We also do more fecals more often.
And yes, we keep it clean, clean and clean.
'
So sorry about the loss of your puppy... so sad. In the circumstances i am sure there was nothing else you could have done diferent at the time.
Hope you find a way to talk to your neighbors or do something to keep those birds away from your dogs and babies.

Good Luck !

[Laura Hollingsw]

The Pregnant bitches do not get treated with Albon. I'm not sure what it is called because I have never had to deal with this before. It is something that is safe and you treat them 2 weeks before whelping.