Exactly! And then get upset when you tell them that the pet needs the other "necessities".

There was a thread started, and the OP asked... Why do people always ask for advice, but they never use it? (It was a very good question) I think that's where a lot of YTers frustration comes from. I mean how many times can you answer the same question politely, and they keep finding excuses to not take your advice. & a lot of times the dog could be in some serious trouble. Kind heart or not sometimes tough love is neccessary.

As for the spay/neuter subject. I'd have to agree with everyone else. If you can't afford to do that, then how can you afford the pet??? & just because you can have one doesn't mean that you should get one. Spay/neuter should be the 1st thing you ask about. It's the RESPONSIBLE thing and its also the RIGHT thing to do. If those aren't your intentions then I would suggest you leave the pup where it is.

Very well put!

It's funny because when I was a newbie I read a few post that I thought some people were really rude. I think I even posted how rude I thought they were...but now I see them as the most caring and compassionate people. Maybe I just know the group better or see the heart behind the post...idk

I now do notice a lot of new members who make comments to start something..or don't listen to advice and get really rude about it. I don't understand joining a group that stands for the love of animals and then mistreat them and don't understand why someone talks harsh to you??

There is (as with any online forum) some unnecessary rudeness on YT. I trust that the administrator and moderators can and do take care of things of that nature. If you think something was uncalled for, report it.

I think sometimes insistence that one seeks the help of a professional is mistaken for rudeness. There is always talk about just answering the question and not giving our opinion. Here's the problem. Every single post on this forum is an opinion. Yes, we can give facts; however, in the end they are still just the opinions of laypeople because we do not know if we're even interpreting these facts correctly. And to just explain to somebody how to get their female through pregnancy with no lecture, well, I think that in itself is a disservice to the dog because that lecture may just get the OP to get the dog spayed. Nobody wants to hear that they should spay after breeding their girl, so IMO it doesn't matter how sweetly it is said. I also almost never answer medical questions to the best of my knowledge simply because I am not a vet and will not play one online even in the name of being kind and helping a dog. If somebody just doesn't have the money, I'm not going to tell them how to treat at home. I'm going to say very strongly that medical care is needed. Would it be better for the dog to lay at home and get sicker without care or us give the owner an answer that could get them through? Of course the dog would be better off if we gave an answer. However, ethically that is wrong.

There is a place to ask about mild medical issues. There is not a place to ask about life threatening, acute emergencies. ONLY a vet should be answering those questions. It is unfair to the dog AND to the people feeling forced to give an answer who are untrained to do so. If a dog gets hit by a car or the like, I'm not going to spend too much time trying to convince them to seek veterinary care. And for people who think some people here hide behind a forum and wouldn't word things this way in real life - I'd say not so. When one of my family members' pets is critically ill, they know they can call me anytime. They know I'll hold their hand through it. They know I'll help them in whatever way I can. They know I'll even talk to the vet for them. But they also know that I sure as heck am not going to stand by and watch their animal suffer without saying something - and no, it's not going to be what they want to hear. They get over it and do what needs to be done.

I'll say in the past some have thought I was too harsh. That's fine. I certainly don't try to be. At the same time, I'm okay being a little bit to the point sometimes. IMO, it is a better approach than trying to vet peoples' dogs without a license which does happen here.

Oh my goodness that is so funny, I need to send all my replies to you and you can edit them to make them more "politically correct." :D

Agreed! It is basic care and if they cant afford it they shouldnt have a pet. There are even low cost clinics in every state. There is no excuse for it

Love it!!!!!!!

True, we lay people are not qualified to answer medical questions and I hope that the OP's who do ask a medical question about their animals know the difference between an rash, flea problem etc and a real emergency.

I guess I'm just a push over. I care too much about whether the OP gets the answers they seek in order to care for their furry family member.

Have you considered the economy lets face it it has not only affected the humans when it comes to cut backs in their life styles but also the pet they own. Some people may have had the means to care for their family members shin and fur but now things are very different. The money spent on pet care may need to be spent to maintain basic family needs such as electric, water, gas or the rent and if YT is an avenue to seek help in order to provide assistance to their pets than I am more than willing to offer my assistance.

I'm not making excuses... but it definitely factors into the number of OP's coming to YT for answers, dont you think?

This has been a very interesting read, thank you for your opinions and for taking the time to get your point across without getting out of hand. You all definitely keep it real . . !

So, the economy is the reason for so many irresponsible owners popping up on YT...interesting. I wonder if you would give the same pass to a person on a parenting forum who didn't want to take their child in to see the doctor because money was tight. "So, you need instructions for a do it yourself appendectomy? No problem. First, hit the kid over the head with a heavy object (not too hard mind you, just enough to knock em out for a couple of hours...)"

Truly, I don't get the point of this whole thread. No one has told you to stop giving advice. If you want to continue, that's your prerogative. If someone else chooses not to or to voice their opinion of the situation, that's their prerogative, too. The biggest difference is that you won't have to face anyone publicly complaining about how you are enabling reckless and potentially dangerous behavior.

Yes, the economy is a factor, but not an excuse to provide inadequate care or for laypeople to go too far in giving medical advice. It may seem that people are being harsh here sometimes when insisting that a dog is treated in the case of an emergency. I can tell you from spending many hours in a general practice office and an ER that it is even more harsh there (not rude, but the vet does talk realistically about the suffering that has to be stopped immediately). But there the option we suggest for rescue is replaced by a vet telling them if they cannot immediately treat, they need to euthanize. It sucks, but it's reality. And in the case of mild medical issues going on, they may refill an rx once without seeing the animal, but they can't go much beyond that. If there is a problem, you come in, period. Diagnosing over the phone is not generally acceptable and it is a disservice to the animal.

I would have to agree w Ellie May and caution you about being a substitute for vet care. Unfortunately, even for ppl here who have medical training (either in vet med or human med), we are unable to verify history, examine the animal, perform lab tests, and lack a license in various states to practice vet med. Really only a DVM should be "diagnosing" a dog's symptoms, and one who is licensed to practice in the state the poster lives in. Although I sympathize w ppls' plights, we should not be practicing veterinary medicine online - not just no emergencies, but that includes rashes, ingesting possible toxins; all types of situations I have seen here in the short time I have been here. I think there are stickies here helping ppl find a way to afford medical care, perhaps a more appropriate answer would be to suggest seeing a vet in their area and if a payment problem exists, post the sticky on how to get help paying for vet bills.

Yes the economy def has a factor. Sometimes the best thing for the pet is to give it up to rescue. Love is not enough. For example, if the dog is on a special diet due to allergies, or needs expensive meds daily, that is not something you can skimp on, and if you can't afford that, better to let someone who can afford it take care of the dog, rather than let the dog suffer without his meds. But you mention rescue and people get really offended.

I'm just gonna sit on my hands for this thread and watch. Or I'll get banned! Good luck everybody else!
:2popkorn:

When the going gets tough, the tough get going. I recently reworked my budget because my income has taken a huge hit over the past couple of years. In taking an in depth look at my spending I saw a lot of things that could be eliminated. I say cut corners...perhaps a start is internet access and cable tv. Perhaps that is a suggestion to make to people.

I think we are all seeing this effect. And yes, you have to look and make some changes. We recently looked at increasing our insurance deductibles as a way to make some cuts. Every penny helps. Oh, and I can think of a few other things that people can cut like going to the movies, cigarettes, alcohol, eating out a lot, etc. And back to the financial responsibility of a pet, I just think that if you are not able to be comfortable financially when an emergency arises, you really need to consider if you really need to get a pet. I know that the last two ER visits for Rosie was between $200 and $400. The last visit for Mikki to get a heartworm test and her shots was over $200. I just don't think people think about that. I know I didn't think about it at all when I got Rosie. But it was something that my DH and I discussed before deciding to keep Mikki. And you know, the unexpected always happens at the worse time.

It's all about priorities! :)

The point of this thread was to have some of my concerns about how some people respond to an OP's question !

Some of you did just that. . .which proved my point. There are those who can answer just the question and are willing to provide answers and there are those of you who take it one step further by adding such harsh, judgmental words or just plain contempt instead of just answering the question !

My hope was that by bringing this to your attention people may think twice about how they approach the question. An OP shounldn't have to go into every little detail and aspect of there life situation before a member deems them worthy of a respectful response. I would hope that it could be managed with a little more grace and kindness. But, Oh well I tried.

I got a lot of input and reasonable responses from you with some very valid points. Others just didn't get it . . .

(Logging off frustrated !)

bbm

tv...yes, internet...ummm, how would they be able to connect to YT to ask for free vet advice or to incite pandemonium about the meanies?

Just kidding but, seriously...that is a huge chunk of a budget with eliminating some of these cable companies...an easy $150/mth could cover a vet visit, food, meds, etc.

Oh, I think we all "got it". You are trying to censor YT and you are not the first person to do so.

I don't think there is as much "unkindness" here as you are saying. This is a very nice forum with some really wonderful people who go out of their way to help people with their pups.

I have bolded one line in your above quote: Do tell me where you saw harsh and judgemental statements in this thread...and contempt?!?!?!? I really do not understand that word at all in relation to this thread.

Yeppers! ;)

This. Exactly this.

What is the harshest thing that you have read on this thread?? We hear a lot about harsh, rude replies. I don't want to reread this thread, but I don't remember anything that would qualify?

And we do understand. You want some here to have a different posting style. That's ok. It's your opinion and that is important. However, it is not going to happen unless the admin or moderators believe somebody has crossed a line. ..just as nobody can tell you how to post.

:thumbup: :thumbup:

I didn't read a single reply to this thread that was harsh or judgmental so I'm not sure what point was proved.

ETA:

If we're talking about harsh and rude posts, there are some that come to mind. How about when posters are very nice to the OP, but decide it's open season to bash vets (and the OPs that do the same)? You know, the posts about how vet X is just horrible and must hate animals because they won't take payments in emergencies. How about the ones where vets are just completely stupid about nutritional matters... Some of us find these posts to be incredibly rude, hurtful, harsh, misinformed, ridiculous, upsetting, and out of line. I can tell you that as a prevet that does not plan to always take payments someday, I take offense to this rhetoric on YT. I'm sure there are others here in the field or with vet friends that feel the same. However, there is only so much I can do about it. Yes, I consider it incredibly rude that people say such things on YT. I'm not going to spend too much time trying to make people say things how I want them said though (unless it's a friendly debate, of course). It's an online forum. People word things how I don't like. I sometimes address it and then move on. Just goes to show you that YT is very diverse and even the most innocent posts to some are considered rude by others. There is NO WAY everybody can get along perfectly at all times here.

There is no way YTers can answer some of these posts nor should we be expected to. Some just need a vet and Yters are not vets. We try to help but sometimes they need a pro like a mentor for breeders and vets we are neither. We are regular ordinary people on a forum with only personal experiences or that which we have read about

I'm not sure what rude or harsh comments you read, but could you point them out? Because before your last post there was nothing rude said.

For the most part, I really try to write hoping I can educate in some way, not just vent at the OP, although, I do that sometimes too. There are people here, who set such a wonderful example of how to educate; they have really inspired me to do better. However, even when I’ve done my very best, it still ticks some people off, so all I can do is my best, but, I’m seriously trying. I feel for those who answer medical and breeding questions, these threads are very emotional, and it’s easy to get involved in the outcome. I know sometimes I feel like if I could only convince the person to see a vet, a dog’s life could be saved. I think people learn more by example than they do be nagged and criticized. I guess what bothers me the most is when I try to do a good job and be careful; I get criticized for being “pretending to be kind.” The bottom line is we have a very diversified group, and you will get a lot of different styles of replies, but some of the best medicine tastes awful.

I dont tnink your seeing it you say an Op shouldnt go into every detail to get a respectful response. I will tell you we deal with some very difficult situations and the more detail some one gives the more we are able to help them and the more their post wont get misunderstood. Sometimes a more direct blunt response is needed. Example someone comes on here says they have dropped their dog 6 ft and hes showing paralysis symptoms. aLL posters are saying go to the vet, go to the vet, go to the vet, but OP is still posting not seeing the seriousnous of it. Now someone posts: You need to get off the internet right now and rush your dog to the vet. Its direct and to the point and yes posts like that are considered rude but there is no wiggle room for the OP they know exactly what they need to do. Whether they like it or not it usually gets them on the move. . Another thing when a poster says well I just dont have money to go to a vet I will see the same posters that are accused of being rude going out of their way to give oP info on how they can get care credit or low cost care

Every time I see someone complaining about the cost of vet care, I always want to ask if they have cable TV. I turned off my cable a couple of years ago, and stream Netflix over my Wii instead. This saves me about $100/month - so $1200/year. That is huge - enough to start saving up for a pup's medical emergency.

It's just very hard for me to see people prioritize materialistic things over their pup's lives...so I tend to walk away from the money threads. I'd trade in my car for an old clunker, sell all my electronics, and take a break from my grad program before I let Levi suffer.

OP since you are so concerned about the plight of people with the economy being as it is, just curious if you have perhaps cut down on breeding? That might be a perfect way right now to help the situation. It is probably hard to sell pups these days anyway....but I am sure you would not want to place one in a home that could not afford vetting expenses. I would rather see people try to prevent the problem rather than putting a bandaid on a wound that needed sutures if you know what I mean.