Small dog syndrome

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by BobbiB

FYI...I'd bring a Pit into my house with Shelly, and feel waaaaay safer than bringing another small breed. A small breed is more likely to dominate, a Pit brought up with him would love and teach him...from EXPERIENCE, not hearsay...I know this.

I would hope with any breed it would depend on the temperament of the dog more then breed. I suggest with ANY larger breed dog though that when no one is around the small dog and large dog be separated because any large dog can hurt a small dog especially on accident.

[BobbiB]

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly

I can't say I don't admire your passion for this special breed because I do. They are wonderful dogs most of the time and only a few of them present problems to others but the problems are ghastly when they do occur. But keeping on denying the harm some of this breed can do to people and their beloved pets moreso than other breed types is not helping improve the breed - it just turns people off. Acknowledging the real problems the breed has and working to somehow stop some of the fighting dog breeders by promoting long jail sentences plus working to encourage owners of the dogs to work hard on training and controlling the dogs and repeatedly contacting our legislators to make laws that require harsher sentences for bad owners who allow their dangerous dogs to hurt innocent people/pets are the only thing that might begin to turn the bad rap they have around.

People like me didn't create this problem and calling us bullies doesn't help the bully-breed's cause, the breeders of pitfighters and very bad owners do. Go spend your wrath on them.

The same thing happened with the Doberman. Years back they were known as dangerous attack dogs but those that loved the breed recognized it was in trouble, began to work to change the temperament of the breed and now they have lost their bad reputation because they don't attack anywhere near as much as they used to do and generally make lovely pets.

And if you ask any policeman, EMT or Animal Control officer and as a lover of the bully-type of dog, I have, they say the dogs who they and their brother officers have to respond to the most emergency calls for from attacks, bites, maimings and killings more than other breed types are the bully breeds, specifically the pitbull - as cops, EMT's and AC officers are not very PC - they just tell you like it is.

The three times I checked with our AC as to what type dogs are most often turned into them or abandoned on our streets, they responded that pitbulls are. Not Yorkies or other small dogs with small-dog syndrome.

Pitbulls are the most cruelly treated breed out there and who treats them this way? Their irresponsible breeders, disgraceful pit-fighters of the breed and far too many of their "loving" owners. I adore the pitbull but I recognize it has a big problem that needs people to work together to fix.

Can you truthfully deny that this is because of sheer numbers?

I'm asking because, yes...you hear more pit reports...but there are also much, much larger numbers that own pits. Logically...more own = more abuse.

So why are we, as people, okay with this stereotype against the BREED? It's NOT the breed...it's the statistically lower number of s**theads that own them. Put THEM in jail, and stop using the breed as an "example". It hurts the breed, not the scumbags who mistreat the breed.

[BobbiB]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

I would hope with any breed it would depend on the temperament of the dog more then breed. I suggest with ANY larger breed dog though that when no one is around the small dog and large dog be separated because any large dog can hurt a small dog especially on accident.

Have you really not yet recognized that I am quite knowledgeable about canines in general? Again, I like you,I really do, but sometimes I feel like you talk to me like I'm an idiot...lol.

I assure you, I'm not. Generally speaking, large dogs have more stable temperaments. Fact, not opinion. Small dogs are known for their attitudes, which isn't guaranteed, but pretty prevalent. Accidents are more likely with large dog/small dog relationships. Aggression is more likely with small dog / small dog. Feel free to look it up

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by BobbiB

You using "pit mixes" as a reference, (sorry to say because I really do like you) is asinine. Mixed breeds?? Really?? Easily 75% are pit or lab mixes according to shelters. That s**t is laughable, at best, and you know it.

I challenge you to do a google search of "Pit Bull Attacks, mistaken identity" and get back to me. Most of the media bull that is shoved down the publics throat about pits is just that...bull.

Then, look up German Shepherds in the 80s, Rottweillers in the 90s....and tell me, honestly, that there isn't always a breed that society poos on. It's crap. Stereotypical, blame someone for human incompetence crap....

Be thankful that you love a small breed...society loves them, even when they are bites, mean little ****ers. I had to CHANGE. My love because of stereotypes, and that blows monkey nuts, and I have every right to be upset by ignorance.

Most of the ones I am referring to people owning who are bad owners are full Pits but just like with any dog you can't tell if it's full or not unless you are actually looking a papers. Most of the ones for sale just say pits not pit mixes so I don't know. The ones I see at the shelter are both. So no I'm not necessarily referencing pit mixes. I don't watch the news and no matter what the breed the dog is that attacks I still think it comes back to bad owners. There is also the fact there are a lot of pits so lots of irresponsible people are getting them. Little dogs do have a bad rap people come here all the time saying nasty terrible things that people have said to them about there small dog. My dog prefers larger dogs at parks and trust me I can get why but I think it still goes back to bad owners.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by BobbiB

Have you really not yet recognized that I am quite knowledgeable about canines in general? Again, I like you,I really do, but sometimes I feel like you talk to me like I'm an idiot...lol.

I assure you, I'm not. Generally speaking, large dogs have more stable temperaments. Fact, not opinion. Small dogs are known for their attitudes, which isn't guaranteed, but pretty prevalent. Accidents are more likely with large dog/small dog relationships. Aggression is more likely with small dog / small dog. Feel free to look it up

I'm sorry if you thought I was that was not my intention. Trust me I'm not a big dog hater. My first dog that was my best friend the only friend I had through a tough time was a lab chow mix turned me into the dog lover I am. If I didn't have allergy's to most dogs as well as asthma and my grandma didn't have copd I would also have a lab and golden retriever two of my favorite breeds. I know that labs are also prone to attack things that come on there property and mess with there family.

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by BobbiB

Can you truthfully deny that this is because of sheer numbers?

I'm asking because, yes...you hear more pit reports...but there are also much, much larger numbers that own pits. Logically...more own = more abuse.

So why are we, as people, okay with this stereotype against the BREED? It's NOT the breed...it's the statistically lower number of s**theads that own them. Put THEM in jail, and stop using the breed as an "example". It hurts the breed, not the scumbags who mistreat the breed.

I've not seen any statistics on ownership of pitbulls but most vets I've asked tell me they are still in the minority of big, powerful breeds owned as pets, particularly as so many people fear them this day and time or their homeowners insurance won't cover their home if they buy one due to the claims and lawsuits they've been hit with.

And it is so true that the people that fight them and those irresponsible owners who fail to train and control them are the ones who deserve an earful but until we get them where it hurts - sitting in jail for 5 years for something their dog did or for their cruelty to their dog - I fear they will continue to breed just any male to any female without knowing if there is fighting history in either family line, pitfighters will continue to breed the most vicious of their dogs and give away/sell some of their puppies to the public as pets and lousy owners will continue to buy these dogs, bring them home, find they cannot control them because they never bother to show any true leadership, train them or set boundaries and just throw them away once they cause any problems.

It's so sad what has happened in the last 20 years to this noble breed-type of dog. The suffering and pain they endure at human hands is truly despicable! It's a good thing I'm not a judge - I'd send those that hurt and misuse to horribly them away for years!

[matese]

Getting back to lovetodream first post, small aggressive dog behavior, owner thinks it's funny. This is MY reason I just enrolled my lil adopted boy of 10 months in obedience school. FOR HIS SAFETY. I don't find it funny when this lil squirt of mine acts aggressive towards any size dog. ppl that have well trained, behaved dogs hold leash loose, the way Cody behaves he could make that well trained, behaved dog feel threatened, that well trained, behaved dog can pull his leash right out of owners had and I could have a injured or even a dead dog. I am humiliated, embarrassed by Cody's behavior, having strangers think I allow this. Cody's behavior has to be corrected for his safety. I will do all that I can do to try to have this corrected. I have had many dogs, all puppies that I raised, none were aggressive. Cody is my only rescue, his first obedience class was this week, I asked the trainer if it was to early to tell why he is this way. The trainer feels he was never socialized. There is a story behind this, tooo long to go into, but I agree with the trainer, he was never socialized. Cody just turned 3 y/o, I hope we can undo his behavior. I honestly am scared to walk him should he see another dog,thank god there are not many dog walkers in my area, mostly back yard dogs, but they do get out every so often. There are no ppl out to help me or my dog should we get attacked. I carry wasp spray on my walks because it sprays 25 feet. Yes I know about wind direction, I have had much practice, camping, walking my other dogs, campground dogs off leash. If I ignore Cody's behavior, do nothing to TRY to correct it, if he gets injured, worse, killed, I would never be able to forgive myself. Reason he is in training.

[ironmike86]

I agree. I didn't read every post but I trained Moki like he was a Pitbull. Yes he can jump on the furniture. But when I go up the stairs. hes not first either. He's by my side or behind. He eats dinner when we are done. He doesn't go to the bowl until he's release .Other meals he must be released before he eats. Dinner is the only family meal together because of schedule. PPL eat first. When we walk he heels. ect ect. And its always a battle for alpha. He test us everyday. If we are eating snacks he won't beg. He will sit and ask polity . http://vid45.photobucket.com/albums/...ps55e3705c.mp4

[R-Teddy]

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly

My son had to try to part two pitties who had locked jaws on one another(meaning neither would give up his hold despite two men over them yelling, pulling/hitting them, trying to get their feet from under them) and continued to sustain their holds, wouldn't let go no matter what and only by lifting up on the collar and cutting off the airway of the one he was straddling did that dog finally let go of the other dog who another man was trying to control and finally did, using the same method my son used. These two, burly, strong, pitbull-savvy men in that dog rehab facility couldn't separate them without extraordinary means and Danny said it took over three long minutes from the time he got there to the fight, which had been going on for about 30 seconds before they could secure the dogs they were working with and get to the fighting dogs and then the other guy joined in for them to finally part them. They both had to go right to the vet for treatment.

What difference to the victim is it whether the dog's jaw would lock itself by some mechanism that doesn't exist or he won't let go by sheer force of will and determination - the latter of which seems worse to me? The truth is, once you are in the jaws of a highly aroused, vicious bully-type dog, it can take an enormous effort to get him to let go of his prey.

The fact exists that there are far too many pitbulls who can behave viciously when their prey-drive is aroused right along with so many others that are truly wonderful babies who are as gentle as kittens.

With all due respect, I have had that same thing happen with two male dogs I had, neither of which had any pit bull or bully breed of any kind in them what so ever. One was a lab mix and the other a hound mix. I believe this can happen with ANY breed of dog.

[R-Teddy]

Originally Posted by gemy

Jeanie I know in protection training, that I observed, the trainers teach the dogs to hold onto that sleeve that they wear. There are studies somewhere that measured the biting power or crushing power of different breeds, and pitbulls were right up there, along with many *mastiff* type breeds.

Magic could easily crush a human tibia bone, and maybe even a femur bone - but god be willing - I will never actually know that for sure.

I agree that pit bulls have one of the most powerful jaws. Im just saying they arent any more difficult to train then other breeds and dont need anymore special training.

[R-Teddy]

Originally Posted by chachi

Here is my take on pits and other large prey driven dogs. I know there can be trained well behaved pitts because of the show pit bulls and paroles on animal planet. Those arent the kind of pits I encounter out on walks and in neighborhoods. The ones I encounter bark angrily and try there best to get to us to attack us on walks. They are not trained and they want to hurt me and my little dogs that are just minding their own business. For this reason I will never trust a pitt with my dogs or I would never trust them around my child. I may have a prejudice but it is based off of experience and not ignorance.

I respect your feelings and dont blame you. but the only thing I have to say is that is not the dogs fault, but the owners.

[R-Teddy]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

I think there are some dogs probably in all breeds that can't be rehabilitated and I feel so very bad for them because it's not there faults it's humans faults

Exactly, that is true with all breeds. Some dogs have bad breeding and can not be trained, in ALL breeds an it is very sad.

[R-Teddy]

Originally Posted by gemy

We have wandered a bit from the original intent of this thread, which was actually to encourage all to train their Yorkies. And yes I have read studies, not Yorkie specific but always in the top 3 reasons for owner surrender, is behaviour problems.... That encompasses, not housebroken, growling, snarling snapping, biting, non stop barking etc.

And for the most part it is the owners fault, afterall they need to train their dogs, big or small. There is a very very small percentage of dogs,maybe 1 or 2% that somehow were born with their minds wired differently. I know my gal Zoey was one such dog.

thank you. And no, I did not write this thread for yorkie specific.

[R-Teddy]

Originally Posted by BobbiB

No...people who aren't breed advocates don't see offense. Those that are DO. And nothing I can say will change others' views....but when multiple people use pits as an "example", that is exactly what they are doing. Giving others to go on. If you don't have one, if you don't go to the events, if you've never been FORCED to give an innocent pit up, then, no, you WON'T see the negative. If you've EVER lived it, you get it.

Have YOU ever had to give up a dog because of popular OPINION? Because I have, and it sucks. And when people use them as an example, it hits a nerve when you've been forced to put down an innocent family member, not because of guilt, but because of perception. These posts, using pits as "comparison" put a breed I love and advocate at risk, even if some don't think so.

Excuse me, but I have FIVE pit Bulls in My home. I am advocate! The only way I used Pit Bulls as an EXAMPLE was because it was a Pit Bull that I was walking at the time that the problem occurred with the woman and the little dog that the woman thought it was funny. If I had been walking a lab I would have said Lab, or if I was walking a German Shepard I would have said German Shepard. I am fully aware of all the ignorant prejudice out there for Pit Bulls and am ready to face it head on. I understand and respect your need to defend the breed. as I said, I live with and love five of them and work for a Pit bull rescue. but to accuse me of doing wrong here is and say I am not an advocate for Pit bulls is ridicules and unfair.

[chachi]

Originally Posted by R-Teddy

I respect your feelings and dont blame you. but the only thing I have to say is that is not the dogs fault, but the owners.

Or the breeders. Thank you for being respectful and listening to the other side and considering they just may have some reason for their fears of big prey driven dogs I appreciate it