What do you mean exactly?

I mean, if the parti colors are a naturally occuring coloring of the yorkshire terrier, then in any group of yorkies that are bred, this coloring should come up occasionally?

It can if the parents are Carriers for the gene.

I guess I don't get it then. If it's a different genetic make-up, then it would be a different breed, not just a color variation.

Here is a little bit of something I read from Cher Hildebrand that is very interesting. Top Parti Yorkies Genetics Parti Yorkie Parti Color Yorkshire Terrier and Biewer Yorkies

I mean, I just find the whole subject interesting. I have never personally seen a parti colored Yorkie, so I have absolutely no experience with them. I have also never met someone with one, so the only things I know about them is what I have read on this forum. I just cannot get my brain to process that parti colored Yorkies could possibly be pure-bred Yorkshire terriers.

I honestly don't even understand how they came about in the first place - even assuming that they are pure-bred Yorkies. Since they aren't the standard, why would anyone breed for that trait? And, if this coloring just "popped up" one day and breeders decided they liked it and wanted to breed for it, then why wouldn't it be accepted by the YTCA? I don't understand why there is a controversy as far as the YTCA is concerned if there is "proof" that there was no cross-breeding involved to attain this coloring.

Not a chance in He**on that one, Since there are no other breeds mixed in, and AKC requires atr least 3 breeds be mixed todf develope a new breed.

That's why I feel the Biewer breeders have shot themselves in the foot with that route.

But the PARENT club does say they are yorkies. The fact that they listed the parti color as as DQ proves that they recognize them as yorkies.

A few comments about the link that you posted.

Goldenray talks of the Gordon sisters and their book, “The Complete Yorkshire Terrier.” Even the Gordon sisters had their own share of parti color showing up in their litters. During the AKC Parti investigation in the late 1990’s, one of the Gordon sisters told AKC that they had more parti pups than Nikkos kennel’s had but that they “got rid” of them.

Goldenray says that “The only way that gene could come into existence is for breedings to have occurred somewhere along the line with Maltese or Shih Tzu. My personal theory is that both are great possibilities.” There are numerous books and writing from the late 1800’s that say it was felt that the Maltese WAS indeed used to breed to short coated scotch terriers to increase the length of coats.

When talking about “The Stockkeeper in 1887,” it doesn’t tell you that Kershaw’s Kitty was solid blue with no tan markings, she had on saddle, she had no tan. Since there was very little record keeping in those days, we don’t know what colors the parents, grandparents or great grandparents were of these dogs who began this breed. Even if they were correctly colored, it doesn’t mean that they didn’t harbor hidden genes for other colors.

The article also says that “the Biewers can never be shown in AKC events as they are not registered with an organization acceptable in the US.” Well, never say never cause as we learned a few posts above, that they have been accepted into a foreign registry that AKC does
Recognize (and thus will allow registry transfers into AKC).

This is a man made breed and the genes that some of our dogs inherited may not be the ideal genetic code that the YTCA wishes it could be.

But that theory has been proven wrong. Why would they need to DQ them if they are not yorkies?

The separate breed route is impossible because we cannot prove that they are something they they are not. But it can be and has been proven that they are yorkies.

Maybe!!! :D But it is only going to take getting the right person interestred in showing them. And that is only a matter of time.

Eventually someone will have the clout, the desire, resources to take on the YTCA.

Okay. :) Very interesting. It's a catch-22 though - can't be a seperate breed but 'can't' be a variation of the current breed....


I have wondered what the actual lineage is, since I have never seen one. But, this is all very interesting.

Would 'parti people' like to see it as a variety of the Yorkshire terrier? I can't see the possibility of a parti yorkie ever competing against a 'standard' yorkie.

You can read on our website CYTC...Our Mission , howthey came about.
It did not just pop up one day, they have been popping up since the breed first started, but one day someone did actually say, hey these are beautiful dogs, why are we culling them.

They had a long hard battle with the AKC to get them recognized, but eventually they proved to the satisfaction of the AKC, that this color does occur naturally in the yorkshire terrier breed. And that is how it came about.

There are books and show records from the 1800's that speak of white yorkies.

I cannot speak for everyone, but for myself, I think they would be better in a separate category, mainly because the judging is so subjective and judges are biased.

Currently though, AKC is not allowing Biewer to be registered with them...even if they are transferred from another registry that AKC recognizes. Just wanted to point as the way it is stated above is a bit confusing. :)

Hmmm...time will tell I suppose. Optomism never hurts, even if that is all it is for now. :) IMO, claiming that they will be excepted eventually is no more than speculation and hoping at this point...not something anything knows for certain, unless there really ARE magical crystal balls...likely, likely not. Again, only time will tell. It will be interesting to see, that's for sure.

To understand you would need to research the history of the breed in the beginning.
The dogs started out as rat catchers they were not bred to a standard.
They were bred back to other dogs who also had good rat catching skills.
No records were kept at this time of who or what breeds were bred together.

It wasn’t until the show era started that they started breeding for a certain type of dog.
But by this time there were already different breeds mixed in with the founding dogs.
Even the show breeders were secretive about how they were breeding,
They didn’t want competitors to know how they were producing a certain look.
Records were kept but since there was no DNA back then,
Who’s to say what other type of dogs were being used together.
There are strong feeling that a Maltese was use for it long silky coat texture.

The old books written talks about white dogs with spotty patches of gray were produce but never went to far
As the Show era already had a white dog the Maltese.

Along with the founding dogs strongly stated as the main dogs.
The Clydesdale / Paisley and Old english black and tan.
There were other dogs also thought to be in the breed.
Ones being the Skye since Kershaw's Kitty a Sky was bred to Swift's Old Crab, a cross-bred Scotch Terrier
Skye Terrier produced colors ranging in the chocolate, fawn, white and tans,
This could also explain where the chocolate and gold colors come from.

The different colors has popped up for years.
Breeders just killed them because they were considered a flawed dog.

I see, eventhough Biewers are accepted by a foreign registry that AKC recognizes, the Biewers would still have to be a BREED that AKC recognizes, in order to be allowed transfer into AKC's registry?

I know the history of the breed. And I understand that there were a lot of genetics mixed in to create the yorkie we know today. But, if the theory that the gene is naturally occurring is correct, then, to this day, breeders of yorkies are still secretly killing parti puppies in some conspiracy to keep the truth quiet.

Good point. So eventhough they do recognivze these other registries, they still have to meet certain criteria for the AKC to accept them.

Hey I just learned something.

In the past I have searched through threads trying to find the original post that something was quoted from. Never paid any attention to that little arrow in the quote box. :p

I found this old info. it seems to show that there has been argument from the beginning on what people were doing to improve the breeds (or to win a prize). There is reference to a Maltese being used and breed purists showing disdain for it. I don't think it does anything to settle any questions, but does show just how long this has been going back and forth. With so many dogs being shown in the broken-haired Scotch terrier class, it no wonder that there are so many variations within the modern Yorkie.


The country - Google Books

Joan Gordon has a great history of the Yorkshire Terrier posted on the YTCA site. She makes a convincing case for there being no reason for a Maltese (or other breeds that have been alleged) to have been used to produce the Yorkshire, but that doesn't mean it wasn't done by some breeders. Here's a link to that history.

History of the Yorkshire Terrier by Joan Gordon

Yes some show breeders will keep them a secret, because if they were to admit to their champion dog producing such a FAULT, they would be expected to have that dog neutered. Hopefully they are just giving them away and not killing them,..

I does not occur in every pair of dogs, only in dogs who both carry the gene. Not every dog carries it.

:eek:

I'd like to know who is getting 5 to 6 K for thier parti's!! I know one breeder did a while back when she was basically the only one breeding them...but I highly doubt anyone is getting a price like that today. However, I did see a few teaspoon yorkies priced between 8 to 10 k!! ;)

All kidding aside, from what I have seen lately advertised...the prices of the parti's are running close to what is being asked for the Biewers.

[QUOTE=WalnutHill;2964471]Okay. :) Very interesting. It's a catch-22 though - can't be a seperate breed but 'can't' be a variation of the current breed....


I have wondered what the actual lineage is, since I have never seen one. But, this is all very interesting.

Would 'parti people' like to see it as a variety of the Yorkshire terrier? I can't see the possibility of a parti yorkie ever competing against a 'standard' yorkie.[/QUOTE]



That is exactly what this parti breeder would like to see. A variety class for the parti yorkie. Just as the American cocker has three color variety classes. The three varieties do not show in the same ring until group.

I also believe the keepers of the parti have a long way to go to get the parti up to the standard of today's show yorkie. IMO...when and if we start breeding better examples of the breed...just maybe the YTCA will take the parti seriously. I just hope and pray it's in my lifetime, so I can show one.

That's good news. Do you have a link to that Russian acceptance?

Yes, that was what I meant. (And I wasn't doubting that you didn't know that, I know that you did. It just wasn't clear the way you worded it.) No worries. :)

Hmmm...let's see:

Here's one that says SOLD, price tag 5000
parti yorkie puppies

Here are some for 4500, 2500, 3000.
Parti yorkie puppies

3000, 3500,
Parti Yorkies pups and Yorkshire Terriers, Yorkies for sale in OK.

Here for 4500, 2000
Yorkshire Terrier Breeder - Parti Color Yorkies, Chocolate Yorkies - Golden Yorkie Puppies

4000
Yorkshire Terriers, Parti Yorkies, Chocolate Yorkies, Golden Yorkies,Dogs and Puppies for Sale.

2500, 3500, 4000,
J Fortin Yorkies My Girls

Heck, I have also seen them for sale fairly recently by breeders here on YT for as much as 4500. Now whether or not these breeders are getting the prices they are advertising for them...who knows? Guess you'd have to contact them to find out. But the higher price tags are certainly still there, no question about it. I would think that the consistent pricing that is seen reflects the amount that people are consistently paying...

I read somewhere that parti yorkies can be shown in obedience, but not in confirmation!?!?!

Does anyone have up-to-date info on the parti yorkies participating in any AKC events??

Parti's can be show in AKC classes other than Conformation but I don't know who is showing or how many are showing in those allowed classes.

There are different prices for everything in this world, including dogs. You can buy a Rolls Royce if you can afford it or you can buy a Ford. It is all in what you personally want and are willing to spend.

Interesting...I'd like to see one in the ring and I'd travel any where in the US to see it :)

What they are advertised for and what they are selling for are two totally different things. I personally don't know anyone who's getting over 4000.00 for their parti pups. Most are in the 2500-3500 range for a nice pup and I've seen others advertised for 800-1800 with full registration on a fairly regular basis. It also depends on the area the dogs are selling from, east and west coast prices are normally higher than the central part of the country.