APRI to AKC?

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Ines3185lyorkie

You are correct. That is a big selling point..stating that the dog has papers. Most of the time you are asked to pay more because of this.

I am just wondering how do you prove that your dog's parents are AKC registered? If let's say the breeder / seller is not reacheable? Just curious. I think that when AKC ever drops it's registry standards...it will all go to the dogs

Lol, good pun! The other AKC registry "PAL" wouldn't be the same as a dog with "Papers," no more than the other alternative registries are. I think it's more if a dog owner wants their dog to compete in AKC sponsored shows such as the agility show or something of that nature. They still wouldn't be allowed in a best of breed type of dog show. I don't think it's possible to have the puppy registered with the AKC if the breeder hasn't even registered the litter. The breeder doesn't have to register the actual puppy, but he does have to register the litter, and I think this is where some of the confusion comes from. For example, Joey's breeder registered the litter, and I needed that number to register Joey. The breeder game me his pedigree (family tree) but I could have received that information from the AKC for an additional $30.00.

[Ines3185lyorkie]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

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Lol, good pun! The other AKC registry "PAL" wouldn't be the same as a dog with "Papers," no more than the other alternative registries are. I think it's more if a dog owner wants their dog to compete in AKC sponsored shows such as the agility show or something of that nature. They still wouldn't be allowed in a best of breed type of dog show. I don't think it's possible to have the puppy registered with the AKC if the breeder hasn't even registered the litter. The breeder doesn't have to register the actual puppy, but he does have to register the litter, and I think this is where some of the confusion comes from. For example, Joey's breeder registered the litter, and I needed that number to register Joey. The breeder game me his pedigree (family tree) but I could have received that information from the AKC for an additional $30.00.

I am glad you caught it. Thanks for the info..

[yorkiekist]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

The Pedigree is just a paper with the puppy's family tree. It lists parent, grandparents, great grandparents, and so on, with champions listed in red. Some breeders don't even have it themselves, but you can still get it from the AKC. Years ago, you could just look at a dog, and know it was purebred, and since AKC was the only registry, I suppose some people didn't bother with the pedigree papers. I personally wouldn't get a puppy that was not AKC, and it's the first step in selecting a good breeder, but hardly the only step.

Yes I know about pedigrees and what they are.And just because its an AKC dog, it might not be great quality nor the breeder. What I am saying is that if you buy a pet quality dog from an AKC breeder but the breeder does not give you the AKC puppy papers but does give you a pedigree, AkC will go ahead and register the puppy. That means that the breeder just sold a nice pet puppy and you get full breeding rights and AKC papers to boot. I am not sure how the AkC can get around this as there are no breeder signatures anywhere and how does AKC know that the puppy is the same one you got from that breeder without going through DNA testing. This is the rumor that I heard. Hopefully it is not true.

[yorkiekist]

Originally Posted by Ines3185lyorkie

WHAT ABOUT THIS???AKC Launches Purebred Alternative Listing Program
Print This Article
[Friday, February 01, 2008]
-- New Features Offer Additional Benefits and Incentives --

The American Kennel Club® today launched the Purebred Alternative Listing (PAL) program - formerly known as the Indefinite Listing Privilege (ILP) program.

The new name more accurately describes the purpose of the program: allowing dogs that are ineligible for registration but are distinguishable as a member of an AKC-registrable breed, to participate in AKC Companion Events, AKC Performance Events and AKC Juniors competition.

The PAL program is designed to address the various reasons a purebred dog might not be eligible for registration: the dog may be from an unregistered litter or have unregistered parents; papers may have been withheld or lost by its owner; or the dog may have been surrendered, lost or abandoned, then adopted by a new owner.

PAL enrollees will receive a copy of Family Dog Magazine, a subscription to AKC's e-newsletter "Your AKC," a flier from the breed's Parent Club and an attractive certificate denoting their dog's place in the PAL program. Also included will be information on AKC Pet Healthcare and AKC Companion Animal Recovery enrollment.

"We currently enroll over 3,000 dogs per year in the program. It is our hope that we can expand this number and the overall appeal of the program by offering added benefits and renaming the program with this more creative and friendly acronym," said Assistant Vice President of Customer Service, Mari Beth O'Neill. "Welcoming more PAL dogs to the world of AKC events and privileges can only benefit both dogs and owners by providing educational resources and also exposing them to the joys of competing with your dog."

Dogs which currently have ILP numbers will retain their original numbers and continue to enter events under that number. PAL numbers will be issued beginning today.

More information about ILP/PAL.
Read about AKC's First PAL dog here

This sounds like a good idea!! People can have lots of fun with their dogs and participate in AKC events(other than conformation). As long as they arent going to start registering PAL litters!!

[Amazing Yorkies]

I called AKC back when there was a question on the owner of the sire refusing to sign papers, and the owner of the dam still able to register a litter. AKC said they are on the side of the dog, not the owners and if puppies are registerable as purebred, they would allow the owner of the Dam to register a litter without the owner of the stud's signature on the litter papers providing they supply a DNA of the puppies... Although, AKC is the only registration for me, I think this stinks. I knew a guy that had a house/dog sitter come and stay with his dogs while he was out of the Country. While he was gone, she bred her female to his male. When she wanted the litter papers signed, he refused because she had not gotten permission, and he had not witnessed the breeding so he wouldn't sign.
Anyway, AKC had the lady send in a DNA of the female, and puppies, his Stud's DNA was on file, and registered the litter anyway. He had no control over his stud when it came down to it.
I know of another that had sent a male to be Shown, and was bred without permission. The litter was registered without the owner of the male's signature, since the DNA proved the parents of the litter, they were purebred and able to be registered. She got nothing, btw in form of Stud payment.
Soooooo.... be sure to have a contract when you send your dogs to handlers, other breeders, or dog sitters. AKC said that they will abide by a contract stating no breeding is to take place... at least AKC said they would abide by a contract, but when it comes to it.. who knows?
I think the PAL program is for activities other than Confirmation.

[yorkiekist]

WOW! That does stink!!!!! That amazes me that AKC can do that. They are soooooooooo picky on having every T crossed and every I dotted and then they register without signatures.

[Amazing Yorkies]

I know!! I called them myself because I didn't believe it! They won't register if you screwed up somewhere on the papers without a lengthy detailed letter, but will register with no signature that may really screw an owner... go figure. The old saying, oh well, just don't sign papers... doesn't work!

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Amazing Yorkies

I called AKC back when there was a question on the owner of the sire refusing to sign papers, and the owner of the dam still able to register a litter. AKC said they are on the side of the dog, not the owners and if puppies are registerable as purebred, they would allow the owner of the Dam to register a litter without the owner of the stud's signature on the litter papers providing they supply a DNA of the puppies... Although, AKC is the only registration for me, I think this stinks. I knew a guy that had a house/dog sitter come and stay with his dogs while he was out of the Country. While he was gone, she bred her female to his male. When she wanted the litter papers signed, he refused because she had not gotten permission, and he had not witnessed the breeding so he wouldn't sign.
Anyway, AKC had the lady send in a DNA of the female, and puppies, his Stud's DNA was on file, and registered the litter anyway. He had no control over his stud when it came down to it.
I know of another that had sent a male to be Shown, and was bred without permission. The litter was registered without the owner of the male's signature, since the DNA proved the parents of the litter, they were purebred and able to be registered. She got nothing, btw in form of Stud payment.
Soooooo.... be sure to have a contract when you send your dogs to handlers, other breeders, or dog sitters. AKC said that they will abide by a contract stating no breeding is to take place... at least AKC said they would abide by a contract, but when it comes to it.. who knows?
I think the PAL program is for activities other than Confirmation.

I would think that the owners of the Stud would have legal recourse; I can understand AKC's position. This is a legal matter, and the owner should sue be for illegally obtained sperm. The AKC could back the stud's owner in this matter because they have proof that puppies were registered with his DNA.

[Amazing Yorkies]

Legally they have recourse, I'm sure. But there are pups out there now with her lines, that she has no control over. She trusted the breeder/handler not to breed, how will she be able to trust where the pups went, or who is using her lines. At least, the puppies would have been sold without papers and not full registrations. That would be some sort of punishment for breeding without permission, and there would be a lot less breeding done without permission. You can bet that the breeder/handler knew about this rule and knew it could be done with or without permission or signatures. I would rather AKC wouldn't register without signatures, and I bet this wouldn't have happened.

[lovenmyyorkie]

But i was under the impression that APRI would not register pets unless they were already regisitered with AKC. That's what I was told....but anyway.

My girl is APRI, and I when I changed her papers to reflect I was the owner, I asked to change her name. It was "Saffires Shelby" on the papers--she's called Sydney (where she came from already had a Shelby so they called her Sydney)--but APRI wouldn't change her name because she is AKC registered first.

My problem is I didn't recieve AKC papers with her and AKC will not help me find who had her registered last. I would love to get her AKC papers just wish I knew where to start. Any suggestions??

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by lovenmyyorkie

But i was under the impression that APRI would not register pets unless they were already regisitered with AKC. That's what I was told....but anyway.

My girl is APRI, and I when I changed her papers to reflect I was the owner, I asked to change her name. It was "Saffires Shelby" on the papers--she's called Sydney (where she came from already had a Shelby so they called her Sydney)--but APRI wouldn't change her name because she is AKC registered first.

My problem is I didn't recieve AKC papers with her and AKC will not help me find who had her registered last. I would love to get her AKC papers just wish I knew where to start. Any suggestions??

I don't even understand why she was registered with APRI if she was supposedly registered originally with AKC. It doesn't make sense to me. The only one who can help you is the breeder, she has got to give you the litter registration number, and then you can register your puppy with the AKC. I have a feeling this won't happen.

[Amazing Yorkies]

Did you purchase her with the intent to breed?

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

I always urge people to register their dogs with the AKC, if they are indeed eligible, because I believe it is a good organization; and it's the only registry that does dog kennel inspections.

Not true. Other registries conduct inspection too. From everything I know and have heard, AKC is by far the most strict with this and will do them randomly, but other registries will inspect too--I think mainly though just after a complaint has been filed.

Off topic, I know, but just wanted to make that known.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

Not true. Other registries conduct inspection too. From everything I know and have heard, AKC is by far the most strict with this and will do them randomly, but other registries will inspect too--I think mainly though just after a complaint has been filed.

Off topic, I know, but just wanted to make that known.

Kennel inspections? Or paper inspections. Please send me a link to this if you can find it because this is big news to me.

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

Kennel inspections? Or paper inspections. Please send me a link to this if you can find it because this is big news to me.

Kennel inspections. I stated that based on actual experience, not links. (I turned in someone w/ dual AKC/CKC dogs in 2002--they had about 50 of them in a barn, admitted they didn't know the exact number they owned. BOTH CKC and AKC sent reps to inspect the premisis.)

From the 'Faq' section of their website:
"CKC takes all complaints received about a CKC member seriously and will begin an investigation immediately. If necessary, CKC will make on-site inspections, collect sample DNA swabs, and collect documentation from professionals such as veterinarians, groomers, or breeders."

I'm sure you could contact the organization if you want an in depth description of their procedures for handling these situations and they would help you out.

As far as 'links,'