To bark busters or not....

[concretegurl]

Originally Posted by Britster

Jeanie has given some great advice as usual!!

I personally would stay away from Bark Busters.

Why did I miss something about them?

Not that I'd hace issue witg new negative info Im just curious.

[Britster]

Originally Posted by concretegurl

Why did I miss something about them?

Not that I'd hace issue witg new negative info Im just curious.

I do not like their training methods.

They use chain-filled bean bags and tell you to throw them at your dog (not, like, hitting the dog, but close enough to scare them) when it barks or does something wrong. They use lots of corrections too. I also have heard of them advising children to yell and bark back at a dog when it's "doing something wrong"

I've seen a Yorkie ruined by them and a Rottweiler in real life. Maybe they are not ALL like that, but any company who charges the amount of money that they do, and come in with negative methods is not coming near my dog.

[sadesmom]

Originally Posted by Britster

I do not like their training methods.

They use chain-filled bean bags and tell you to throw them at your dog (not, like, hitting the dog, but close enough to scare them) when it barks or does something wrong. They use lots of corrections too. I also have heard of them advising children to yell and bark back at a dog when it's "doing something wrong"

I've seen a Yorkie ruined by them and a Rottweiler in real life. Maybe they are not ALL like that, but any company who charges the amount of money that they do, and come in with negative methods is not coming near my dog.

I'm definitely going to try training her myself. I think I have to do the obedience class before agility but I'm going to speak with them and learn about their ways before I sign up. I'd much rather do it alone, but I find I question a lot if I'm doing it right or not because I know I've done it mostly wrong until now

[concretegurl]

Brister thanks I read the breif training ideal and akipped their methods.
I have done a 360new on Bark Busters.

One trainer that I worked with said yo use a tin can full of pennies...I never did, because I dont think startling a dog with a n obnoxious sound is the way I wanted to train.

[yorkietalkjilly]

I personally just don't find startling a dog with noise or clapping or throwing things or spraying water in its face is at all necessary to connect with a dog. I wonder what they must think when we take a bottle and suddenly spritz them with water in their eyes? Adrenaline rushes into their bloodstreams from those things, most likely. To me, using these methods just tends to amp a dog up, makes him a bit wary of his trainer and a little more unsure than he was to start with and he may behave that trainer, but not for the reason I want.

I'd much rather have one trust me, look to me to always care for him and make his training fun, positive and upbeat in all ways. Now if he's misbehaving and crossing boundaries, I'm going to show him some gentle discipline with a claw hand on his neck or going over to him and using a couple fingers to poke at his shoulder or hip to snap him out of his out-of-control state but usually that method is only for a pretty wild dog early on in training as he's focusing in on another animal or growling, baring teeth IF just standing/sitting in front of him and raising a finger and telling him to "watch me" doesn't have any effect. Usually that nanny stance works well to get a dog focusing off another dog or cat - but not always!

I watch momma dogs treat their pups who are hanging onto another puppy's ear like this - they stand and stare at the puppies at first, warning the offender - and if that doesn't work, they go over and bump the little biter on the shoulder/hip/ribs or put their mouths over the pup's neck and let the recalcitrant pup know he's crossing a boundary that is not acceptable in their family. But she doesn't startle the offending puppy or douse him in the nearest puddle of water or bark him out or use any startle techniques at all - she uses her attitude, a warning stance, then walk over, a touch and a stern look out of the eye - but there's love back there, too, in that stern eye.

Dogs out-of-control or trying to take control of a situation don't mind some discipline as long as it's gentle, natural and fairly quiet, which keeps the fear-response or nerves from entering into the issue. I don't want to start a response in a dog that rushes adrenaline into its system, such as shocking things like water, loud pennies, scent sprays in the face and e-collars are want to do. I want training to be calm and matter of fact, where I'm always looked at as the one in control, quiet, loving and gentle like their momma was - showing them the way and correcting or disciplining with quiet hands when they go ballistic. Dogs will trust you and do just about anything for you when you train them that way and make their obedience fun and gentle and positive, kind of like their momma trained them or an alpha will train them in the wild or feral situation.

Obedience training that keeps it short, fun, positive, rewarding and a game for the dog will cause him to associate training and learning to do what the trainer says with good things and even when he doesn't want to, if the trainer tells him "No" or "uh oh", he will stop because he's conditioned to the good things that are associated with that trainer and he knows no fear or unpleasant situation has ever happened between the two of them. That total trust and positive conditioning will find you with a dog that loves to do what you say 98 - 99% of the time.

But as I always say, I don't recommend using the hand claw technique, the touching etc. with big powerful or midsize biting dogs. To me, that situation requires the abilities of a person with a long history of dealing with that type of situation and is prepared and ready to deal with all possibilities.

[sadesmom]

You have such great information! I feel like Sadie is just very untrained. When she was a puppy and most of her 3 years of life she has had a huge potty/accident issue as most yorkies I see. So I sort of concentrated on that. So I'm still trying to learn where to start. I make her sit for dinner and attention, but I definitely don't know how to make her do things. She will hardly sit for a treat that isn't salami! So square one it is I think with her.

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by sadesmom

You have such great information! I feel like Sadie is just very untrained. When she was a puppy and most of her 3 years of life she has had a huge potty/accident issue as most yorkies I see. So I sort of concentrated on that. So I'm still trying to learn where to start. I make her sit for dinner and attention, but I definitely don't know how to make her do things. She will hardly sit for a treat that isn't salami! So square one it is I think with her.

Square one is a good place to start. Deep breaths, keep it short and fun for her.

[concretegurl]

Our neiggbor used a spray bottle to squirr water at her dog to stop barking...an otheewise kid friendly dog came flying towards my kids snarling abd snapping when they were having a squirt gun fight in the cul de sac.

Im guess post tramic stress caused it thankfully we (beighborhood parebts) interceined before any kids were bitten.

[lovinmayorkies]

Originally Posted by sadesmom

I'm definitely going to try training her myself. I think I have to do the obedience class before agility but I'm going to speak with them and learn about their ways before I sign up. I'd much rather do it alone, but I find I question a lot if I'm doing it right or not because I know I've done it mostly wrong until now

I know what you mean.. I like training my dogs myself too.. and I have invented commands that suit my life stytem and not concerned myself with teaching them things they don't need for our lives together. But I have also taken mine to dog training... we have a lot of fun, they get well socialized, and before you know it.. you do learn something! I've gained some priceless gems of advice. I've got 4 dogs and now when i leave the house we stop before my open gateway.. they all have to sit.. takes a while.. then I step out and when I'm ready I say 'ok' and we start our walk. Just this one thing has changed the start of our walks from doggie chaos to comparative calmness! Just enjoy Sadie, but enjoy the classes too and take from them what you want x x

[sadesmom]

oh boy... well, she will sit for her dinner and aside from that she seriously sucks, which means I am seriously sucking at being her owner. I grew up with golden retrievers and I love them. They are so calm and loving and loyal. Sadie is the sweetest but also the meanest dog ever. We were just on a walk at the park ( Which the other two goldens get to run around free and she doesn't because even when we let the leash go behind her she does not listen or respond to her name and there for doesnt deserve it..) and an adorable rescue lab came across us and we had to pick her up! She was so mad that the other two got to the dog before her and she just started barking and crying and then when the dog came to say hello (while she was still up) she snarled at him!

I love her to death and I will never ever give a dog away in my life. But she makes me wish sometimes she was a golden! I don't know how or if it's even possible to make her a laid back dog that I can trust will listen to me and wont snap on any animal or child, especially when another animal snaps at her. I don't trust her, and I guess she doesnt trust me. Im going to go talk to my vet today and see what they recommend we do because I have never read a success story with all these issues. We wanted to get a golden once we moved out so she wouldn't be lonely and now im starting to think we wont be able to have any other animals while we have her... let alone my fear of when we have children... Anybody wanna tackle that comment?

[chachi]

Originally Posted by sadesmom

oh boy... well, she will sit for her dinner and aside from that she seriously sucks, which means I am seriously sucking at being her owner. I grew up with golden retrievers and I love them. They are so calm and loving and loyal. Sadie is the sweetest but also the meanest dog ever. We were just on a walk at the park ( Which the other two goldens get to run around free and she doesn't because even when we let the leash go behind her she does not listen or respond to her name and there for doesnt deserve it..) and an adorable rescue lab came across us and we had to pick her up! She was so mad that the other two got to the dog before her and she just started barking and crying and then when the dog came to say hello (while she was still up) she snarled at him!

I love her to death and I will never ever give a dog away in my life. But she makes me wish sometimes she was a golden! I don't know how or if it's even possible to make her a laid back dog that I can trust will listen to me and wont snap on any animal or child, especially when another animal snaps at her. I don't trust her, and I guess she doesnt trust me. Im going to go talk to my vet today and see what they recommend we do because I have never read a success story with all these issues. We wanted to get a golden once we moved out so she wouldn't be lonely and now im starting to think we wont be able to have any other animals while we have her... let alone my fear of when we have children... Anybody wanna tackle that comment?

you need a professional trainer

[southernlady]

Originally Posted by chachi

you need a professional trainer

This is what I did. My comments may not be welcome because although I had intended to get a yorkie, fate stepped in an I rescued a minature Dachshund three months ago. He is two, and Reggie is my heart. But he has fear aggression that evolved into offensive agression, and I was afraid to let him around anyone. Especially men. If he saw a hand come out he went balistic. I tried training myself, I love Victoria Stillwell and have It's Me or the Dog on DVD and I did make some progress, but I also realized I needed someone to help me get to the next level. I found a trainer here that both Reg and I love and have seen promising progress after only four sessions. In fact we go to see Teesha tonight It was a bit pricy but I feel it well worth it, I love seeing Reggie's confidence grow, and he is more relaxed on our walks and is enjoying them much more.

[chachi]

Originally Posted by southernlady

This is what I did. My comments may not be welcome because although I had intended to get a yorkie, fate stepped in an I rescued a minature Dachshund three months ago. He is two, and Reggie is my heart. But he has fear aggression that evolved into offensive agression, and I was afraid to let him around anyone. Especially men. If he saw a hand come out he went balistic. I tried training myself, I love Victoria Stillwell and have It's Me or the Dog on DVD and I did make some progress, but I also realized I needed someone to help me get to the next level. I found a trainer here that both Reg and I love and have seen promising progress after only four sessions. In fact we go to see Teesha tonight It was a bit pricy but I feel it well worth it, I love seeing Reggie's confidence grow, and he is more relaxed on our walks and is enjoying them much more.

You are welcome heRE AND YOUR ADvice and stories are just as important as a yorkie owners. Actually we have some people on here that dont even have a dog and they post

[sadesmom]

Originally Posted by southernlady

This is what I did. My comments may not be welcome because although I had intended to get a yorkie, fate stepped in an I rescued a minature Dachshund three months ago. He is two, and Reggie is my heart. But he has fear aggression that evolved into offensive agression, and I was afraid to let him around anyone. Especially men. If he saw a hand come out he went balistic. I tried training myself, I love Victoria Stillwell and have It's Me or the Dog on DVD and I did make some progress, but I also realized I needed someone to help me get to the next level. I found a trainer here that both Reg and I love and have seen promising progress after only four sessions. In fact we go to see Teesha tonight It was a bit pricy but I feel it well worth it, I love seeing Reggie's confidence grow, and he is more relaxed on our walks and is enjoying them much more.

I'm so glad you are making progress! That's been my concern because I've had trouble finding any success with these issues. Just like you, we can only get so far. My trouble is how to find a trainer. Do I want to do classes or should I do in home training? I thought that classes would socialize her more as well, but maybe basic obedience won't do anything for her fear aggression.

[southernlady]

Thank you Chachi for making me feel welcome here! I love talking about my Reg

Originally Posted by sadesmom

I'm so glad you are making progress! That's been my concern because I've had trouble finding any success with these issues. Just like you, we can only get so far. My trouble is how to find a trainer. Do I want to do classes or should I do in home training? I thought that classes would socialize her more as well, but maybe basic obedience won't do anything for her fear aggression.

Right now Reg and I are doing one-on-one personal training sessions, with his agression issues a class environment in the begining was not really an option. But Teesha is impressed with Reggie's progress and next week will be big, we are going to bring someone Reggie doesn't know into the class and work with that. Even though I have been doing this on our walks here at my apartment complex. My neighbors are all impressed with the progress. In a couple of weeks Teesha also want us to participant in a class to begin socialization with other dogs. I am so excited about this! And my motivation here is my friend's yorkie, I love the little guy to death but he has serious agression issues and I am one of the few people he likes. My friend rescued him 13 years ago - he is 16 now. When she first adopted him and he would agress, thinking she was comforting him she would pick him up and coddle him, cooing at him to try to relax him and what she really did is reinforce his behavior and now it is so ingrained in him it is an automatic reaction. I looked at that and thought I don't want Reg to be like that in 13 years, I want him to be happy and confident.

So from my personal experience, if it is possible for you I would recommend the professional trainer and private classes at first. I checked to make sure I was dealing with an accredited trainer, I wanted someone I knew would be able to help Reg. I hope some of my story helps you and your little one!