At my wits end!

[joandcal]

Hello Yorkietalk family!
I am new to yorkietalk and to owning a yorkie (we owned a 90 lb golden last) and desperately need your help!
I have a new (almost 11 week, 2 lb, named Luke) old yorkie/shipoo puppy. We have had him since 9 weeks and having some huge problems.
We have done all we have been told to (small crate, light on, soft music) and he will sleep from 9:30 - 12:30 then when we hear him we get up to let him out only to discover he has already peed and pooed in his kennel. We still put him out, clean up and put him back with minimal interaction so as not to get him too excited. When we put him back he then proceeds to cry and bark for the next 1 - 2 HOURS! We have been told to let him out so he wont go in his kennel but also told not to respond to the crying to get him used to it. He doesnt seem to mind going in his kennel.
His kennel is downstairs in a cozy room. I really dont want a dog in our bedrooms but after 2 1/2 weeks of us all wearing earplugs and cleaning his kennel multiple times a night and messes during the day (I can take him out and he does nothing then come in and within min. he has peed/pooed inside). I am truly at my wits end!
We are all exhausted and I am struggling with my house smelling bad all the time!
I love him, and he is a great boy, very intelligent as his training at 11 weeks old has got him sitting, responding to his name, laydown, and sometimes come. He is great as long as we are right there with him but the unending crying at night and the constant peeing and pooing inside is really getting to me. What am i doing wrong?
I would be truly grateful for any advice from those who know and love yorkies.

[mtjimenez]

Hi!
I am sorry you are having such hard time training your puppy. I know how hard it is to train them. I have a 6 month old Yorkie. I got her in the winter so I started the whole training process with the pee pads. Unfortunetely, now that is summer she won't go outside to pee or poo. I have been trying to train her to go outside for the last month with very little results. Sometimes she'll go pee and poo outside then other times she'll go inside even after been outside for a while. It is frustrating but I'm hoping she'll eventually get it!!! Hang in there you are doing all the right things!!

[Ladylavender]

You may have gotten the "smallest" crate, but it is still to big for your 11 wk yorkie. You must fill the back of the crate so that there is very little room in the front of the crate. The dog should only be big enough to stand, turn around and lie down. No extra corner or room to potty in.

No water after 7pm. pick it up. Feed only 2 x per day (1st thing in the a.m. and around dinner time in the p.m.), to limit the amount of pooping. Millie used to poop only 2 x per day, when fed on a schedule. Take your dog for an evening walk around 7 - 8pm (since sun is still up).

At bed at 9:30pm after you take him out to pee. (if you have to be outside for 10 mins to 1/2 hour, you need to stay out there with him until he goes. If he does not go, you need to put him in the crate and in 10 mins take him out again, and continue you this until he goes. (it is hard work, but must be done, to get your little one understand what you want. After a few night of this he will "get it". You need to continue to repeat your "potty word" until he goes.

He should only have to go 1-2 times afterwards, during the night (he is still small with a small bladder). If he whines in the crate, get him out and immediately take him outside to potty. It should not take him long, but if it does, you need to stay out there until he goes. No playing, just keep refocusing him to potty. You may want to point him in the area he has potty before to stimulate him. After he goes back in the crate. You will lose a lot of sleep during this phase, but it is important you keep this regime up, because you want to be successful. When you put him back in the crate and he has gone outside, it's ok to let him cry. (This is hard too). In a few hours if he cries/whines again, take him out, again as before.

You need to take him on 2 walks per day. about 15 mins and then he needs some play time, every day, where you sit on the floor and have him chase a ball or a toy.

During the day, If you are home and you were not clear on this, you will have him on a schedule. A schedule to eat, play and potty. in the a.m., out of the crate, goes from an a.m. walk, he eats and within 10-15mins he goes outside to potty, again and you stay out there until he does go. If he goes (which he should if you are out there long enough) then he gets play time outside the crate, you must watch him and be with him during this time and playing with him. If he does not go, back in the crate for 10 minutes and then out again to go potty. He gets play time only if he goes potty.

after he gets his playtime and his early walk, he should be tired (he is only 11 wks after all) and can go back in the crate to sleep. When he wakes up, outside to potty. Don't let him back in until he does. He should pretty quickly because he has been sleeping and his bladder should be full. It might take 10-30mins. But you MUST stay out there. If he will not go after a while, you will need to put him back in the crate and after 10 mins take him outside and start up the potty routine again. After potty, he gets free time to play and once again you must be there for him. You could keep in in a play area, but there is no guarantee that he will not potty during sometime when you are not looking.

Unfortunately, potty training will consume your life for about 4-5 months. (it should get a little easier when he catches on what you expect of him. POTTY TRAINING WILL REQUIRE MORE PARTICIPATION ON YOUR PART THAN HIS. You will be more trained than him. At some point, he will finally "get it" and start asking to go out on his own. Unfortunately, he may be 9-10 months before that happens, but if you keep up the work, it will so be worth it in the long run. you will have a well adjusted housebroken dog that you will never have clean up after again and will be a pleasure to own.

[Maximo]

ETA: good advice above


Welcome to YT.

Your pup is very young and very tiny. Every dog is different, but you could have some time ahead of you before he sleeps through the night and is perfectly potty trained. He probably won't sleep more than 5 - 6 hours at night, and he will need frequent potty breaks during the day. Make sure he has one right before bed, and first thing in the morning.

Try feeding dinner around 5 p.m. (no food/treats later) and walking your pup and having a play session in the evening. The exercise will help take care of potty needs and help tire out your pup before bed. Always praise your dog immediately when he potties in the right place.

You don't have to have the pup sleep in your bedroom (although it would solve your problems quickly ). I saw an episode of "It's Me or the Dog" in which the trainer Victoria recommended doing exactly as you are doing not responding to the dog crying.

Just my personal opinion -- with a pup that young and small, I would consider using an xpen with disposable pee pads. You can put a rubber mat or remnant of linoleum under the pen and pads. A dog that is pee-pad trained can ultimately be a strictly outdoor potty trained dog.

Hope some of this helps.

[joandcal]

thanks so much for the advice. I guess I was spoiled with my golden. He was trained in 2 weeks.
I was told to let them drink all the time by vet tech but told by trainers to take water away after 7pm. What do you think?
He also seems to "go" befor he starts to fuss at night, how can I help this?
Giving me this time line has helped me to think more long term.

[baby yorkie]

My baby did the exact same thing. I kept her downstairs in a crate and didn't want her upstairs. We would always have that surprise in the morning and at about 7-8 months we would just guess if she left us a little present. It didn't matter if she barked or not...she had already done it. I gave in and moved her upstairs, fearing that I wasn't hearing her all the time. She quit immediately. She slept longer than she ever had and not a peep out of her. No more surprises left for mommy to clean up. She just needed me. I purchased a new baby at Easter and put my new baby's crate on top. I eventually had to move both downstairs because the new baby came with parasites and ringworm, which I didn't want lingering on my carpet. Both have been downstairs for about two months and doing fine. My baby is 18 weeks (2 lbs) and doesn't leave me any presents either. I did purchase a baby monitor so I could listen to them though. If my baby eats late, she needs to go out in the middle of the night. I'm monitoring that. Good luck and I'm sure your baby will figure it out. They're all different. (I know how frustrating it can be. The Pine-sol and bleach smell started to make me sick.)

[Ladylavender]

Originally Posted by joandcal

I was told to let them drink all the time by vet tech but told by trainers to take water away after 7pm. What do you think?
He also seems to "go" befor he starts to fuss at night, how can I help this?
Giving me this time line has helped me to think more long term.

No water after 7pm. Listen to the trainers. after your pup is housebroken, you can give him water all the time, but during the housebreaking phase, limit his water intake.

If you make his crate area smaller, by stuffing it with cardboard or some other material, where the only place he has to pee is right under him, then he will start fussing before he has to pee. He will attempt to get out to void instead of voiding where he has to lie down. You do need to make sure that the area you are blocking up is secure and he cannot find a way to get into a small corner to void, away from where he lays down.

[Ladylavender]

forgot to add that you may NOT be hearing your puppy in a timely fashion and he is whimpering to be let out, but you don't hear him until after the fact. You may either consider putting him closer to your room so you can hear him in when you are in a dead sleep, or use an alarm clock to wake you up every few hours to avoid your puppy from having a mishap. I have known those that have used an alarm. I never did, because Millie was in the room next door to our room with the adjoining door to the rooms wide open. At the 1st indication of a whimper I was up and out.

[Roccosmommy]

Welcome to YT! You have definitely come to the right place for advice - lots of experts on here. The potty training advice you've received is excellent, but I would also be very careful with timing of feeding, since your pup is very tiny at only 2lbs. You need to be careful of hypoglycemia, which is very dangerous for these little ones and can happen if there is too much time between meals. While I do agree that the last feeding at 5pm makes for more predictable potty training, I would also recommend a small snack (a few dry Cheerios, a biscuit, etc.) later in the evening before bedtime. Best of luck to you with your new furbaby!

[Roccosmommy]

Originally Posted by Ladylavender

forgot to add that you may NOT be hearing your puppy in a timely fashion and he is whimpering to be let out, but you don't hear him until after the fact. You may either consider putting him closer to your room so you can hear him in when you are in a dead sleep, or use an alarm clock to wake you up every few hours to avoid your puppy from having a mishap. I have known those that have used an alarm. I never did, because Millie was in the room next door to our room with the adjoining door to the rooms wide open. At the 1st indication of a whimper I was up and out.

Excellent point. My little guy also sleeps not far from my bedroom and I also got up at the first whine he made. He's been sleeping through the night since he was about about 4 months (he's almost 6 months now).

[Maximo]

Originally Posted by joandcal

thanks so much for the advice. I guess I was spoiled with my golden. He was trained in 2 weeks.
I was told to let them drink all the time by vet tech but told by trainers to take water away after 7pm. What do you think?
He also seems to "go" befor he starts to fuss at night, how can I help this?
Giving me this time line has helped me to think more long term.

In my humble opinion, I think it is unhealthy for animals and humans to limit water/fluid intake or to limit potty breaks. I think it especially risky to deny a tiny dog water from 7 pm to 6 am, or whatever time you get out of bed.

[Ladylavender]

Originally Posted by Maximo

In my humble opinion, I think it is unhealthy for animals and humans to limit water/fluid intake or to limit potty breaks. I think it especially risky to deny a tiny dog water from 7 pm to 6 am, or whatever time you get out of bed.

Of course it's your choice, but I am telling you what will work. Trainers are also telling you what will work and it is NOT hazardous to your puppy's health. I have never heard of a puppy dying or going thru dehydration symptoms for not have water between 7pm and 5-6am. That is just ridiculous. But if it makes you feel better, you can give your puppy water and expect to get up more frequently, or give him an ice cube to lick on to help with his dry mouth after you taking him out and before you get him back in his crate.

I certainly would not tell you anything I wouldn't do or did not do.

[Maximo]

Originally Posted by Ladylavender

Of course it's your choice, but I am telling you what will work. Trainers are also telling you what will work and it is NOT hazardous to your puppy's health. I have never heard of a puppy dying or going thru dehydration symptoms for not have water between 7pm and 5-6am. That is just ridiculous. But if it makes you feel better, you can give your puppy water and expect to get up more frequently, or give him an ice cube to lick on to help with his dry mouth after you taking him out and before you get him back in his crate.

I certainly would not tell you anything I wouldn't do or did not do.

I would worry that not drinking water after 7 pm would contribute to hypoglycemia, especially in a 2-pound pup.

For both animals and humans, I am an advocate of keeping the fluids going by consuming and eliminating often. It's better for the kidneys, liver, and all vital organs, all systems.

[Mom to Hot Rod]

Hi and welcome to YT. Congrats on your new little one.

In my opinion, you little guy is way too young to limit foods and water. At 11 weeks, he should be being fed at least 4x a day if not free feeding. His blood sugar can drop very quickly--especially at 2 lbs. You have to visualize the size of his stomach and think about just how much food he can eat at one time, not a whole lot at all. His little stomach is probably the size of a dime.

As for water, you should have water available at all times. I never like restricting water, I even put one of those rabbit water bottles on Hot Rod's crate.

At 11 weeks, the best tip that I can give you for successful potty training is patience, patience, and more patience. Keep in mind, his little bladder and how much fluids he can keep in him. Can you take him out every hour? For sure every 2 hours. Remember, puppies do not automatically know that they are supposed to potty outside or on a potty pad,they need to be taught/trained. Their mothers stimulated them to potty and they did so whenever and wherever.

Diligence on your part, you need to figure out his signs as to when he needs to potty. Look for anything that will give an indication that he is restless and walking in circles, etc. At this point, you should take him out or put him on a pad. Once he is in the actual act of pooing or peeing, say a phrase for that purpose. Then praise profusely. Treat also. This phrase should only be used when you take him out to potty. I use "do your stuff" and mine know what this means. We kept them on potty pads as we boat so we wanted to make sure that they would use them. They are pretty regular in that I know when they will poo. They usually do it 2x a day, on our first walk and then after work. If I come home at lunch to walk them, Hot Rod will usually go then, as I don't get home until 2- 2:30. Maggie will usually be after work.

We also got an expen for Hot Rod. I had his crate, potty pad, food, water, and toys in there. This way if we were delayed in getting home, he had all he needed.

As for his not wanting to be in the crate, I can certainly understand that, but you will need to be strong. Do you exercise your pup? By playing or walking him, you will tucker him out and come bedtime, hopefully he will be tired.

something that I started with Hot Rod: I put a regular bed pillow on my lap, turned down the family room lights and told Hot Rod, "nite-nite". He would grab his lamb that we got for him the very first weekend we had him, and gnaw on his tail until he literally fell asleep with it in his mouth. lol He is 2 1/2 years old and we still have this ritual. I just love this time as it gives me time to stroke them and just cuddle with them.

We also put them in their pen at night and we go up to bed. They know that when we get up, it's time for them to go into the pen. Whether they are asleep on the pillow/sofa or playing, when we say "nite-nite" they go into the pen willingly and go into their beds. Again, we have a potty pad in their. We've since taken their food and water out of there. Sometimes, if they have been gnawing on the bullies, I will put water in for them.

Sorry this is so long, but this is what has worked and works for us. Hope this helps somewhat. Here is a picture of our pen. Best of luck to you. Patience...it will happen one day.

[ArmaniMan]

Originally Posted by Maximo

In my humble opinion, I think it is unhealthy for animals and humans to limit water/fluid intake or to limit potty breaks. I think it especially risky to deny a tiny dog water from 7 pm to 6 am, or whatever time you get out of bed.

Originally Posted by Maximo

I would worry that not drinking water after 7 pm would contribute to hypoglycemia, especially in a 2-pound pup.

For both animals and humans, I am an advocate of keeping the fluids going by consuming and eliminating often. It's better for the kidneys, liver, and all vital organs, all systems.

have to agree here!

I would be very careful limiting water and food in such a small puppy... really a puppy this age should be free feeding and have access to food and water at all times.

Can you set up a pen like the photo above, so that your pup has access to pads all the time?

I have always used a pen like this, one side has their bed, blankets, toys, food and water and the other side is lined with pads... they learn very quickly to leave their sleeping side to go to the potty side. I also never had to get up in the middle of the night with mine with this arrangement. When they were very young, I chose to get up once or twice and check on them just to make sure all was okay... but they didnt need me to.

They have toys that heat up and other ones that have a heartbeat sound, I always gave these to my puppies to help them sleep through the night.

It does help with puppies to have them close by, I always set up their pen as close as possible to me.

Good Luck.