I haven't either. Not sure why. I'm sure they grasp the meaning of the term COULD NOT GET TO THE VET. I find it interesting that everyone is so quick to judge what someone else MIGHT do but they are affraid to think of what they themselves might do, if put to the test. Personally I feel sorry for all of the little puppies that many would let suffer so that they would not have to make the decision on how to deal with it.

Yorkierose posted a little while ago about a situation where she had a bitch in whelp and there was a blizzard and she had to take some extreme actions (with her vet on the phone helping as best as he could) to save her bitch's life.

I think my dilemma would be whether to stay with and take care of the mother and pups that were alive or leave them to take the dying pup to the vet. Do you pack up the mother and pups and take them along?

Ditto...both accounts. :thumbup:

I'm sure that more than one litter of pups were whelped during Katrina.

There were probably some tough decisions made during those times.

It was a question... simple as that. I read something in a book... what do you think.

No different then the question about tail docking. My friend said this.... is it true?

I guess you are very fortunate that you have never had to make that decision. But there are people out there that might someday have to, and you may be one of them. So what would you do to ease the suffering of a poor helpless animal if you were forced to make that decision. Do you perhaps keep ether on hand to make them unconcious?

I wanted to say that I have calmed down a bit and realized that I did jump to conclusions on this post. It just seemed so extreme that I couldn't imagine that people would do this. I do apologize to JeanieK for accusing her of trying to upset. This just seems so inhumane. :(

WHATEVER!!! :rolleyes:

And I would add there is a blizzard, do you take them all and risk all of them dying including yourself and your small child that you had to take along with you?. Do breeders keep ether or anything on hand to ease the suffering?

Already answered that...across the street neighbor, injection in fridge.

:confused: :confused: :confused:

No I don't. I've never had to think about it or "do it" in 10 yrs of raising these babies. My vet is always available to me any time day or night (2 miles from my home) Like I said, my track record isn't perfect and I have lost newborns to natural death. I'm still pondering the thought of what I would do in an EXTREME situation where vet care was NOT available. All I do know is the freezor thing would not be an option. So, what would that leave me?

pups
 

Unless the pup is in distress, you can wait until morning...if it is screaming and suffering, I give it a pill...a crushed Valium and they go right to sleep...I asked my MD for a prescription to keep on hand. I have given a pill to several adults who had to be taken to the vet to be put down when old..by the time we got there they were very calm and sedated...

I have known breeders who use the freezer, but there is never a need with medications.

Now Pat...I think that is very very humane and what a good idea....what's even better is YOU can take a valium too when all settles down ;) ..just kidding...there is no sleep for a breeder with newborns I bet...

Hearing a tiny baby screaming must be just horrible to hear...but that sounds peaceful and humane......why did I know you'd have a great answer here ?

Pat, you are always the voice of reason...thank you.

pup
 

JeanieK..I went back and read all the posts...you were probably reading an old book. Old time breeders do alot of odd things, they are cut from a different clothe..some work for me, some do not. One of the top show breeders in the country (25 yrs ago) told me to do exactly as your book said..."wrap it in a washcloth and put it in the freezer"...what was acceptable back then is not any longer. I did not find it acceptable back then...I might add when I have to give one of my poor newborn babies a pill..I take one myself..it is very stressful.

I have been gone all day and this is the first thread I read..LOL LOL

LOL! Where were you when we needed you on Post #2??

Thanks, Pat, for an expert's voice on the matter. Your post makes perfect sense.

LOLOL..I'm jealous because you haven't had snow..I'm in Cleveland Ohio..need I say more..lolol.

Thank you for being the "voice of reason". This site is visited by people like me, Yorkie owners, and breeders too. In response to someone who said what if you didn't have access to a vet,- well there are always emergency vets. In response to what if you can't leave the others at home unattended, there are vets who make housecalls and there are friends or neighbors who can stay or travel with the dogs. Freezing, drowning, suffocating or any other means other than an injection by the vet are BARBARIC in my neck of the woods!

What if weather conditions make it impossible for travel. NOT what if you are too lazy or don't want to pay the vet.

Ooh...I bet you are a little cold then, aren't you? All these people need to stop talking about BLIZZARDS, that's for sure. ;)

Ok that's it!! I'm gonna take you up on the invite to 'Bama!!..lololol I want to live where blizzards are desert not weather..lolol

Anytime...ha ha ha...I wore a shirt w/ no sleeves today too! Na Na Na Na Na! :p

This is one of the MANY reasons why I wont be a breeder! I am not tough enough to deal with these types of decisions. I must say, this thread has turned and twisted and Jeanie, what exactly are you looking for at this point? There have been answers given. Even a vallium, which I must say, seems the least of the horrors I have read. It seems to me that you keep reposting WHAT IF YOU COULD NOT GET TO A VET? and again, you received answers.
I have experienced some terrible weather conditions here and elsewhere (including a hurricane) and there have been times that getting to a human hospital was not even likely and I live less than 10 miles from three hospitals...
We are prepared the best we can and deal with whatever falls in our laps the best we can if we cannot get help and I think every breeder would do the best they could... I think the general consensus is simply that putting a dog in the freezer is not the best we can do, other solutions have been offered to you, and perhaps you have thought of some of your own as I hope you would have since you have been quite persistent with this particular question. Have you thought of other solutions on your own? Are you considering becoming a breeder? If so, perhaps you are in an area where this may be a real issue for you... One possibility I might suggest for you is that if the winters are that bad there, and the math for a dogs pregnancy is fairly easy, that you keep a female in heat from getting pregnant when those due dates would be more risky.
Good luck with your search and I hope you find what you are looking for.
Bren

Jeanie..I'm sorry you were attacked for your question.
It was a good question and a very interesting read.. Reminds us all that breeding does not always go smoothly.
There are some very tuff decissions to make at times.
Freezing is not something I could do. And glad to hear this is old school.
As far as I can see Pat had the best way to handle what to do...If I could not get the pup to the Vet right away to it have put down.
It's better to be prepared and have a plan in place.. if this should ever happen.
This is a good question to ask the Vet too next time I see him.

breeding
 

After my snowed in problem and a friends snowed in problem, I stopped breeding any litters due in mid Nov/Feb. Having four wheel drive means nothing if the vet or clinic is closed.
I had a call once from a breeder who is freaking out..her bitch was unresponsive..she car would not start..she was over an hour from me...the bitch died giving birth and she can not find a way to the vet...it was the worst. I have often asked myself if I could have done a section to at least save the pups..once the mother is not breathing you would only have a very few minutes to save the pups..??

You know Pat that is a good question too..I was thinking that as well when reading this thread..
If the bitch died if I could see myself doing a Section to save the pups...
Boy.. that is food for thought..And I hope I never have to face it...
MY mother did it when I was young...
So... as hard as it would be ..I guess I would try.

whelping
 

I certainly do not want to freak anyone out, but I would do it..I would probably need some therapy afterwards, but I would do it.

Well I have to commend you and Pat for being honest. Just thinking about that scenario, I can tell you I would not be able to do a section. Now, put me in the situation and the adrenaline pumping I may surprise myself and do it. Gosh, I hope I am NEVER faced with that decison as I'm sure you ladies feel the same.