True Biewers.

[yorluvr]

Originally Posted by goldenray

This is still listing it as Biewer Yorkshire Terrier. They should just be Biewer Terrier. I don't know one single breed that when a new color develops call it by the breeder's name. So if they want them called Biewer, they need to drop Yorkshire. I went to the link you gave and the pictures there do NOT look like a Yorkie. Cute dog, but just not a Yorkie. Besides this is the US, if Biewer's are going to be here, it's time to look at a serious club and address the serious issues for the breed. The club would need to start their OWN stud book here. AKC gives info on things like that. Once again any questions that I can answer or help that I can be, I would be glad to help how I can.

In talking privately with some of the Biewer breeders, I believe they are serious about promoting the Biewer as its own breed. I agree that Yorkshire should be dropped from the name. Cher, you spoke on another post on breed type. Type is what distinguishes a yorkie from another breed of dog. The yorkie and the biewer do not resemble each other at all.

The Biewer is here, and I can't deny I would love one as a pet. I think they are adorable. But they are not the yorkie as we know it. That said, I would be more than happy to help the serious biewer breeders in their quest to establish the biewer as a breed in the US. The problem I see are those "breeders" who are out to make a fast buck buy mixing the breeds and not trying to establish a legitimate stud book.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think their are serious breeders and those breeding tri-colors, but telling the unsuspecting buyer they are yorkies and can be shown in AKC. I know this because a breeder in CA sold some tri-color/biewer "yorkies" and told the buyers they could be shown in AKC competition. When they were entered at an AKC Sanctioned Match, a yorkie breeder/judge refused to judge them on lack of merit and not meeting the breed standard. The exhibitors were angry at the judge, but should have been angry at the breeder.

I think you will find there are more serious yorkie breeders willing to help the serious Biewer Terrier breeders establish their own breed, rather than trying to make it a variety of the Yorkshire Terrier.
Julie
Jo-Nel, Reg'd. Yorkies

[centralnewyorki]

[QUOTE=Stormy]

Originally Posted by YorkieRini

OK..this is the Mother club in Germany for True Biewers. You can start here..there is so much translation and I am still trying to figure and validate some of the info..maybe you can help me




Our Biewer pups arrived here from Germany yesterday....First time I saw one REAL !!!
They are DOLLS ! !! Swwet and adorable

You're in NY?! Where?? I need to squeeze these little pups! If you're close enough, we need to get a yorkie/biewer meet-up planned! Gorgeous, gorgeous, gorgeous!

[whispersmom2]

I am wondering something.. What if a pic of a Biewer were in say, a coloring book. The Yorkie colors were colored in..Then, same pic and Biewer colors put in. Wonder how different they would look? I have thought about that for a long time!! Boy, tells you how scientific my brain is, huh?? Or, even, a parti thrown into the mix...That is another consideration..

[YorkieRini]

Originally Posted by whispersmom2

I am wondering something.. What if a pic of a Biewer were in say, a coloring book. The Yorkie colors were colored in..Then, same pic and Biewer colors put in. Wonder how different they would look? I have thought about that for a long time!! Boy, tells you how scientific my brain is, huh?? Or, even, a parti thrown into the mix...That is another consideration..

I'm sorry, I don't understand your question...?

[whispersmom2]

When we hear a statement that a Biewer looks nothing like a Yorkie I am wondering if that in part is because it is not easy to look at black, white and tan and imagine the exact same animal in black and tan or blue and gold..
My question is..is it possible our eyes are deceiving us because of the coloration???
Like a birthday party where every single food is the wrong color-green mashed potatoes, black ice cream and so on. Would the potatoes still look like potatoes or some other green veggie all mashed up...Gawsh, that certainly was a scientific example, huh? But, that actually was a study done years ago..

[BamaFan121s]

OK, as an outsider to this ‘situation,’ let me offer some advice-take it or leave it.
I’m not a Biewer owner/breeder/expert. I don’t know jack squat about them except that they’re beautiful and what I’ve read here. But anyone can see what’s happening here:

NO ONE on this board can possibly know EVERYTHING about this breed. It’s a new breed, not from here, not officially recognized by any U.S. associations, from what I have gathered. EVERYONE here is still very much in the learning process regarding these little guys-- that being said, no one person here holds all the answers to the breed. From what I can tell, because of it’s “newness” here, how they should be handled from a Biewer breeder’s perspective has been left wide open for interpretation—because no standards or anything else have been set in stone here. There seem to be various opinions of those learning about the breed and it’s origin/background that are conflicting. EVER breeder, regardless of breed, should feel they are doing the best job possible with their dogs and everyone is not going agree 100% of the time. It seems like what has happened here is some believe so strongly either in what they do or against what others do, a lot of criticism of others’ practices have risen-- feelings have gotten hurt and people have been offended. IMO, at this point in the breed’s history here in this country, no one person should be looking at another and condemning what they are doing, but instead they should be learning from each other since Biewer breeders are so few and far between as it currently stands.

Again, if it isn’t the AKC standards-set Yorkshire Terrier, don’t ask me. I don’t know if they are Yorkies, Biewers, mixes WHATEVER! I think that learning more about them is something that interests us all but not if it is going to come in the form of “You’re wrong, I’m right” and no “this states this so you’re wrong, I’m right.” Let me ask you this, if they are no way WHATSOEVER related to Yorkies (and again, I have NO CLUE) why are they even being discussed in such detail on this forum…isn’t this YORKIEtalk?

I’m not trying to offend anyone or step on any toes, but it is sickening to see so many breeders with so much experience and such great knowledge to put down and questioned by other good breeders. This can be said for all sides. PLEASE give it a rest and be civil!

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by whispersmom2

green mashed potatoes, black ice cream

By the way, this is the grossest birthday party I've ever heard of!

[yorluvr]

Originally Posted by whispersmom2

When we hear a statement that a Biewer looks nothing like a Yorkie I am wondering if that in part is because it is not easy to look at black, white and tan and imagine the exact same animal in black and tan or blue and gold..
My question is..is it possible our eyes are deceiving us because of the coloration???
Like a birthday party where every single food is the wrong color-green mashed potatoes, black ice cream and so on. Would the potatoes still look like potatoes or some other green veggie all mashed up...Gawsh, that certainly was a scientific example, huh? But, that actually was a study done years ago..

In a coloring book, perhaps you could not tell. But in reality there apprears to be a difference in coat texture besides the obvious coloring. I have not seen a Biewer with a straight coat, to the ground, with full face furnishings. Most of the pictures I have seen have coats 3/4 of the way to the floor. It is not the smooth silk texture that the yorkie is noted for. The heads are similar, but it is not the head that makes a yorkie a yorkie. You can have a black wooly yorkie, but that does not make it correct to the standard. It is the feel of coolness when you touch a yorkie with correct texture that separates it from a soft coated yorkie. Hard to discribe unless you have actually felt the difference. It's just not all in the colors.
Julie
Jo-Nel, Reg'd

[YorkieRini]

Originally Posted by whispersmom2

When we hear a statement that a Biewer looks nothing like a Yorkie I am wondering if that in part is because it is not easy to look at black, white and tan and imagine the exact same animal in black and tan or blue and gold..
My question is..is it possible our eyes are deceiving us because of the coloration???
Like a birthday party where every single food is the wrong color-green mashed potatoes, black ice cream and so on. Would the potatoes still look like potatoes or some other green veggie all mashed up...Gawsh, that certainly was a scientific example, huh? But, that actually was a study done years ago..

OK..now I understand. We have to look beyond color. Color is a general perception, Type is what we should look at. Like it was mentioned earlier reference post#11, explains Type and how important that is over color; not only in Biewers and the Standard (b/g) Yorkie but also with the Tri Colored Yorkies that are registered with the AKC. If I understood post #11 correctly, Breeds are developed by breeding 'Type to Type'. Color not being the only focus.

[whispersmom2]

When a True Biewer is in full show coat, is the coat oiled and wrapped like the Yorkies? Just curious as I have never seen one in wrappers. If not, is it possible that the reason their coat is not the long flowing silk that we see on True Yorkies?

[Stormy]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

OK, as an outsider to this ‘situation,’ let me offer some advice-take it or leave it.
I’m not a Biewer owner/breeder/expert. I don’t know jack squat about them except that they’re beautiful and what I’ve read here. But anyone can see what’s happening here:

NO ONE on this board can possibly know EVERYTHING about this breed. It’s a new breed, not from here, not officially recognized by any U.S. associations, from what I have gathered. EVERYONE here is still very much in the learning process regarding these little guys-- that being said, no one person here holds all the answers to the breed. From what I can tell, because of it’s “newness” here, how they should be handled from a Biewer breeder’s perspective has been left wide open for interpretation—because no standards or anything else have been set in stone here. There seem to be various opinions of those learning about the breed and it’s origin/background that are conflicting. EVER breeder, regardless of breed, should feel they are doing the best job possible with their dogs and everyone is not going agree 100% of the time. It seems like what has happened here is some believe so strongly either in what they do or against what others do, a lot of criticism of others’ practices have risen-- feelings have gotten hurt and people have been offended. IMO, at this point in the breed’s history here in this country, no one person should be looking at another and condemning what they are doing, but instead they should be learning from each other since Biewer breeders are so few and far between as it currently stands.

Again, if it isn’t the AKC standards-set Yorkshire Terrier, don’t ask me. I don’t know if they are Yorkies, Biewers, mixes WHATEVER! I think that learning more about them is something that interests us all but not if it is going to come in the form of “You’re wrong, I’m right” and no “this states this so you’re wrong, I’m right.” Let me ask you this, if they are no way WHATSOEVER related to Yorkies (and again, I have NO CLUE) why are they even being discussed in such detail on this forum…isn’t this YORKIEtalk?

I’m not trying to offend anyone or step on any toes, but it is sickening to see so many breeders with so much experience and such great knowledge to put down and questioned by other good breeders. This can be said for all sides. PLEASE give it a rest and be civil!

As a new owner of a pet Biewer directly in from Germany.....I agree with this post. Lots to be discussed, but can it be done in a friendly pleasant manner ?

[YorkieRini]

Originally Posted by whispersmom2

When a True Biewer is in full show coat, is the coat oiled and wrapped like the Yorkies? Just curious as I have never seen one in wrappers. If not, is it possible that the reason their coat is not the long flowing silk that we see on True Yorkies?

From my experience I have not had to wrap any coats yet. They are growing nicely I have 1 out of my 5 girls that I'd says coat is NOT correct. Texture is off, and there is some wave. Out of the 6 I have Dice is the one with the hard silk which is heavier lays straight, doesn't mat, white and blue shine feels most like human hair. The other 4 girls (full sisters) have silky coats, white and blue shine, yet finer strands, occasional mats that comb out easily.

[YorkieRini]

Here is the thread with more pics. "Hope" is the one on the far left is the one that has the least desired coat IMO. She and her sister will be my first breeding Dice to sire both litters (if he is 1yr by the time of their 2nd heat which is in April).

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/sho...hlight=Biewers

If you look you can see the there is a 'Type' to the Biewer. Now I've seen Tri Yorkies only in pics, and IMO in comparing to 2 pics. The overall types are completely different. Meaning we can't assume based on comparing pic of each. We have to take a group of each for comparison. That shows the 'Type' is established, it's more than random markings/coloring. Owning both breeds, I can vouch, personalities are extremely different.

[yorkiegal719]

Boy my head is spinning! I don't even know which thread this is. I have been reading all these posts over the last few days about Biewers, coat color, texture, size, similarites, breeding practices etc. and no one can agree. This is why it is so important to keep these two great breeds apart. By now after 20 odd years, they are not the same breed. There still is very many variables that all the breeders have to work out, that will come in time, as long as we are all on the same page. I do not know if I will ever breed but I have been typing my little fingers off trying to get some hard info on what is acceptable and what is not. I have gotten a few good answers. I will not go into them here. Let's just say, like should be bred to like and leave it at that. I have 2 right now and they are wonderful dogs. I have just gotten my female a few weeks ago. Her coat is somewhat differnt than my male but not that much so I'm thinking that they will have very similar coats which are silky and smooth. I do not let my boys hair grow all the way down, it's messy for a male. I do not wrap, no need, not showing but I do know that it has the ability to hit the floor. It's my choice to keep trimmed. We will in time see how my females will grow. They're body type is a little different too, she's totally square, he's a little longer. He's bigger boned than she is. So this is where the inconsistancy lies with breeders. We should take the best from each and try to devleope something that will knock your socks off! Here's two views of my Archie, ya gotta love that tail!...

[Stormy]

Originally Posted by yorkiegal719

Boy my head is spinning! I don't even know which thread this is. I have been reading all these posts over the last few days about Biewers, coat color, texture, size, similarites, breeding practices etc. and no one can agree. This is why it is so important to keep these two great breeds apart. By now after 20 odd years, they are not the same breed. There still is very many variables that all the breeders have to work out, that will come in time, as long as we are all on the same page. I do not know if I will ever breed but I have been typing my little fingers off trying to get some hard info on what is acceptable and what is not. I have gotten a few good answers. I will not go into them here. Let's just say, like should be bred to like and leave it at that. I have 2 right now and they are wonderful dogs. I have just gotten my female a few weeks ago. Her coat is somewhat differnt than my male but not that much so I'm thinking that they will have very similar coats which are silky and smooth. I do not let my boys hair grow all the way down, it's messy for a male. I do not wrap, no need, not showing but I do know that it has the ability to hit the floor. It's my choice to keep trimmed. We will in time see how my females will grow. They're body type is a little different too, she's totally square, he's a little longer. He's bigger boned than she is. So this is where the inconsistancy lies with breeders. We should take the best from each and try to devleope something that will knock your socks off! Here's two views of my Archie, ya gotta love that tail!...

WOW Theresa, they are gorgeous....and double wow on that tail !!!!