Standing Ears - Genetic?

[BamaFan121s]

I mentioned in another thread something regarding standing ears as being a genetic trait. I was told that was inaccurate--that standing or flopping ears was not a trait passed on genetically. (Rather than ONLY being a result of not training the ear.)

Would like to get some insight on this from others. The member expressed interest in getting more info, so could how about lending a gal a hand?

[BamaFan121s]

In the meantime, I'm going to go digging through all my notebooks and binders for misc sources of info I've collected over the years. I'm pretty sure it's touch on in Padgett's book (my all time fave resource) but I'm going to have to go try to dig all this stuff out again.

[Too many dogs]

if they have ever stood, it is not genetic. I have had a couple of pups that the people did not keep the heavy ear hair off and it weighted them down. get the hair off and they will go right back up. or sometimes they will cut teeth and an ear will go down. usually goes back up tho especially if it is taped up a day or two. I have always heard if they have never been up, it is likely genetic tho.

[topknot]

It can be genetric as well as the ear hair no being trimmed off the ears at an important time in a pup's life. So it can be caused by either.

Some yorkies have can have a genetric trait of a thick skin ear leather and no matter what you do the ears will never stand. These ears are usually large as well.

Also while a pup is teething the ear can dip due to the stress of cutting teeth and then if the hair is not trimmed off during this time can cause the ear to flop. If they are not helped out and ears are always flopped - this ear too can permanetly stay flopped over. This can be for a smaller ear. If the ear stays this way for awhile - say by the time the dog is 1 - the ear will never stand.

I hope this helps. One reason you do not want to breed a large or thicker leather ears.

[Woogie Man]

I posted this in the other thread but will re-post here....

Ann Seranne, in her book The Joy of Breeding Your Own Show Dog, has a list of genetically dominant and recessive traits. As pertaining to ears...small ears, high set ears, narrow ear leather and dropped or tipped ears are all recessive traits. Large or long ears, wide ear leather, low set ears and erect ears are all dominant traits.

That's the only info I've ever seen that addresses this.

[BamaFan121s]

Thanks...it's one of those things I just assume is common knowledge. (I mean, EVERY physical trait is a result of genetics, right? Why would ears be any different?) Just trying to find more than just my word for it.

Found a few of my notes...going to see what I can find.

[topknot]

Also check out Gordon and Bennett book pg. 185 - talks about ears -

"should be small "V" shaped ears."

See second pearagraph - "should not be round at the tips, nor bat-shaped like a French Bull-dog's. They are carried erect, and when excited or at attention, carried even higher. Although this is not covered in the Yorkie Standard the ears should have quite thin leather (outer cartilage of the ear), although with enough strength to keep them erect. Thick leather leads to semi-erect or drop ears.
The size of the ear should receive a good deal of appreciative regard.
The ancestors who went into the prduction of the Yorkshire Terrier all had large ears and they are dominant genetically to small ears.
... no breeder should ever forget that the ears do add up in the total of a prosperous look to the head."

So yes, it can be genectic.

[topknot]

Here is a photo of a litter of just turned 9 week old pups. All ears are up!

[Woogie Man]

Originally Posted by topknot

Also check out Gordon and Bennett book pg. 185 - talks about ears -

"should be small "V" shaped ears."

See second pearagraph - "should not be round at the tips, nor bat-shaped like a French Bull-dog's. They are carried erect, and when excited or at attention, carried even higher. Although this is not covered in the Yorkie Standard the ears should have quite thin leather (outer cartilage of the ear), although with enough strength to keep them erect. Thick leather leads to semi-erect or drop ears".

So yes, it can be genectic.

I've seen also where thin ear leather can keep the ear from standing initially. I suppose there's just not enough structure there for a while.

It kind of reminds me of Goldilocks? and the 3 bears. You know, the ideal ear is not too thin, not too thick, but just right.

Come to think of it, that's about the way it is with the whole dog...not too this or too that but just so...

[topknot]

Originally Posted by Woogie Man

I've seen also where thin ear leather can keep the ear from standing initially. I suppose there's just not enough structure there for a while.

It kind of reminds me of Goldilocks? and the 3 bears. You know, the ideal ear is not too thin, not too thick, but just right.

Come to think of it, that's about the way it is with the whole dog...not too this or too that but just so...

LOL - yea Gordon goes into ... "The genius that added the beastly word. "too" should be made to realize that too many toos have too often led to too much woe." Before the present standard, the specification had simply beed "not far apart." The British standard still has it that way. The addition of the word "too" changes the whole picture by allowing for any kind of interpretation."

[YorkieRose]

Flop ears are most certainly genetic.

[kjcmsw]

I recently read -where I can't remember - but on some vet site something about the delicate cartilage can get broken - particularly in the case where one ear refuses to stand, often when the pups are very young from rough housing with their litter mates, etc. Seems like a reasonable explanation, particular on the one-ear situation. ~KC

[mommadog1]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

I mentioned in another thread something regarding standing ears as being a genetic trait. I was told that was inaccurate--that standing or flopping ears was not a trait passed on genetically. (Rather than ONLY being a result of not training the ear.)

Would like to get some insight on this from others. The member expressed interest in getting more info, so could how about lending a gal a hand?

I NEVER said that it was inaccurate. If your going to quote me do it properly!!! I said I did not agree!!!! And until I learn differently I will continue to believe that it is not genetic! inheriting something, and something being genetic are very different.

However I am not going to believe something someone says just because they said it.

[DerbyLayne]

Originally Posted by topknot

Some yorkies have can have a genetric trait of a thick skin ear leather and no matter what you do the ears will never stand. These ears are usually large as well.
.

That's Derby right there! Big, thick ears. I've seen them go up, but they refuse to stand for more than a few seconds. flop flop flop.

[mommadog1]

Originally Posted by Woogie Man

I posted this in the other thread but will re-post here....

Ann Seranne, in her book The Joy of Breeding Your Own Show Dog, has a list of genetically dominant and recessive traits. As pertaining to ears...small ears, high set ears, narrow ear leather and dropped or tipped ears are all recessive traits. Large or long ears, wide ear leather, low set ears and erect ears are all dominant traits.

That's the only info I've ever seen that addresses this.

Then erect ears are a dominate trait, and would dominate over floppy ears. So how can a recessive trait show up over a dominate? As far as I know it can't.