Is this right to do??

[bjh]

Originally Posted by treasurebeauty

I would love to give her the puppy back, but she is not willing to offer me a ful refund. I had been emailing her since the day I got the puppy, and I had made myself very clear that I want a full refund, and she can take her puppy back.

At the most recently phone call conversation with her, I made myself clear again, but all I got is a conversation with all the "fxxx" word; I have it record. She did not want to work with me at all.

I can only dispute the balance I made for the puppy, but I can not get my deposit back unless she is willing to return it. I will definately give her the puppy back after I got my full refund, but so far, all she had done is slander me on other website.

I fully understand. I had forgot about the long wait and the deposit you had paid. I hope you can get it worked out but it looks doubtful.

[tisheayorkies]

First off I did offer to buy the puppy back and pay for shipping, she refused, second the deposit she had here has been her due to the fact when a litter came up, she could not afford to get it, so instead of telling your deposit is non-refundable, i told her she could use it for a future puppy, i emailed her a few times on puppies that were born, but at the time it was no good for her. Initally she wanted a girl, then i got an email stating they wanted a male, i did not change her mind on the sex, she did. It made no difference to me if she got male or female, this was her decision before the pups were even born. I did not have to allow her to use the deposit for a future puppy, due to she could not afford one at the time when the litter came up, i have personally put up a deposit with a show breeder and had circumstances come up were i had to pass, so 9mths later i went back to the breeder and had to put up a NEW deposit, my deposit was not transferable. She had a few males to pick from, and i gave her first choice, she choose waneska's male. i sent her pics on different occassions and that the male she stuck with, now saying this i play with my pups daily, they are handled, brushed, ect..this male never had a hernia, and my vet can back that because they were seen at 3 days, 3 wks, 6 wks, and 8 wks by the vet, no umbiblical hernia was present, the day before shipping him i took him in to the vet and we found a hernia, his conclusion was he could of strained to poop and pop a hernia, he said to leave alone and it could fix on its own, the hernia was pee size, and looking at the pics she took some time later, i see it has grown, or the way she is holding him, either way it does need to be fixed now. I offered her a refund and to pay to have the puppy shipped back, but she refused, she wanted the deposit also, which was non refundable from the get go due to her not being able to use it on the litter she requested, but i kindly said instead of loosing, i would kindley hold it here for if she ever decided to purchase one in the future she could. Not many do that. Now when we found the hernia the day before shipping, which had to happen the night before because i never noticed it, and i brush my puppies daily, if i knew it was there i would have no problem telling her. When i got home from the vet i tried twice to call her, he was due to leave that night to go to the airport, she did not answer, i had to make a call on this, do i ship him or not, not being able to get ahold of her, and knowing she had to drive some hours, i didnt want her to show up and no puppy be there, so when i talked to her about the hernia, i told her i tried to call her before hand, she told me she works, goes to school and take care of the dogs, so she must of been busy, i didnt receive a call back either, so i decided to ship, i figured if it was a problem, then i would have him shipped back and refund her monies. When we talked i told her to ship him back collect and i would refund her money, but she refused and said she wanted her deposit that i allowed her to transfer than loose back also, i even told her that she could use it for a future puppy, again i was being nice and ethical. She has bought a few in the past, so i gave her a nice deal on a champion sired puppy, who's mother is champion sired and damn. He has a wonderful pedigree, both parents are liver shunt tested, eyes and heart clear, and patellas checked. I do what testing i can to help eliminate any problems. I can also give both my vets phone numbers and they will clearly state i have never had a puppy returned or another vet call on any health conditions of my puppies. Now for this puppy not being CH.Dylans that would be a lie, i would never let the son of Ch. Tyava's Sure Shot puppies go on full registration, I am under contract with ava tyree,that nothing goes out with full reg. without her permission inless im keeping it for my program, his name is cassanova, and cassanova has not even had a litter yet, he is just over a year old and is getting ready for the ring, i do not breed my males intil they finish their titles and pass health screenings, and same goes for my females, they have to pass health screen before being breed. We do an evaluation on the puppies at 8 wks old called the Puppy Puzzle Evaluation that was created by AKC Judge Pat Hastings, these test are done at 8wks old, they have to be done at 8wks old, i encourage all breeders to look this up, it has helped up in evaluating our puppies as far as quality, so at 8 wks old we know basically the quality we are selling. Not all breeding quality is set as show quality, many many champion dogs parents are not champions at all, are the two the same? NO they are not, I talked to a few akc judges on this issue, because it has been a topic i have seen alot, a good foundation bitch or male, may not be show quality, but produce show quality sound healthy puppies, we are talking about judges who have judged and shown theirselves for over 20 yrs as judges and longer as breeders. I take their advice in hand. Every breeder/exhibitor has the look and traits they desire, thats why in the ring all shapes and sizes come in. Dylan only weighed 3.6lb, a small dog for showing, but due to his correct confirmation, attitude and temperment he finished with no problem. Im not here to defend myself, im here to explain what happened, did i make a wrong call by sending him when i couldnt get ahold of her, probably, but you dont know intil you make the call and it turns out like this. Now Angel has received her money back, and i offered to have him shipped to me collect, and still to this day she has not shipped or contacted me, once she had him i got one call from her, and that is it, i havent heard from her since she got her money refunded, now she talking about selling him???? after she received her money and shipping fees returned to her..now that i call stealing and making a profit. Angel did not ask for a show dog, she does not show, she has for a healthy sound yorkie male, and by our evaluation, he is just that, he has no health issues, he has correct bite, tight knees, ect.. he i think will make an awesome stud one day or even a finished male, little white on yorkies is not a flaw, there are NUMEROUS of champions that had white on them as puppies, you dont see that when their coat grows out, it usually turns to a tan color, dont know anyone who has had all their litters soild black and tan. So this is not a fault, dylan had white on his chest as a puppy, and some of his babies too, and he is finished male, and they are finished offspring..thank you all for your input..tiffany

[AHicks99]

People please read all the other posts about her. Search her out and you will see. You can search Tu Co Yorkies, and what she formerly went by Tisheas Yorkies She contradicts her statements as if we cannot read and put together. She tries to make it seem as if it is all the buyers fault with no admission of her own as the BREEDER. Just in the long over drawn rebuttle she states to ship out then ship in and ship out. How is this in any way good for dogs. She made a judgement call to ship a puppy with a hernia. No she shipped a dog she knew wasnt what the buyer agreed on. How is this in any way putting the dogs first? Does she have any idea how hard it is on the puppy/dog that is being shipped back and fourth? People please just do your research and make your own assumptions on this matter. But please read them all not just one or two. I know there are many related to this but it is worth it and maybe it will serve some purpose to these dogs.

[treasurebeauty]

I was thinking about quote what she type about, but since it's a long quote, I will just type my respond here.

First lie she had above, she never call me at the time when she found out the puppy has hernia. I had her email stating she think it's not a big deal, and she can go ahead to ship without calling me. In her email she said, she didn't think it's necessary to call me, plus she doesn't have chance to call. She told me in her email, she is not the one to take the puppy to the vet, and she didn't know the puppy has hernia until her shipper told her about it when the puppy is on the way to the airport. Also, if she really did call, why my phone bill never show up her number?? and my voice mail never had her msg?? I can always go back to my cell phone service, and pull these all out.

Second, She never had the puppy that I want in the past two year while she is holding on my deposit. She always tried to ask me to take the puppy from her other litter, and she called this is as what she had made an offer for me? I know she always want to keep a female from her litter, which is understandable, but when there is a female available, it's either too tiny for breeding or she need to keep it for herself. I don't want to continue waiting, so I said okie, we can go for male. Please note, I am only talking about only on Waneska's litter. I have no interested in her other female's litter, that's why I gave her deposit stating I only want puppy from Waneska, but she never had a female available from Waneska's litter...

Third, the puppy had a vet check a day before he left, and you said he only had a tiny hernia?? I don't believe it. The pictures I took of his hernia is on the day when he arrived, and the hernia is even bigger than his testicle, even you said in the above quote that this require to be fixed!!! I am sorry, but I just can not believe that you think it's a tiny size that you wouldn't notice.

Last, Nobody here said the boy you send me is not out of Dylan. We are just saying maybe we need to do a DNA on this boy. And, please, stop saying that I am re-selling your puppy. He is still here with me!

And finally, I am still offering you a chance to take him back, and I think it's reasonable to ask for my deposit back, because you lied to me first, and now I don't trust you. I don't think I will want your other puppy, since I don't want to go through this again.

And please, stop lying.

[3FurryFaces]

I am very new to this. I have a pet yorkie on limited registration from a highly respected, long term show breeder. After knowing her and attending conformation and AKC events for the last year (some where she and others in her line show as well as shows that other exhibitors were at), meeting and talking to other breeders, I decided to try my hand in the show world. I am waiting for a show bitch - the breeder has taken no deposit. The last litter had one possible bitch but at 6 months developed a hernia. At that time, the hernia was repaired by the breeder, the bitch was spayed and sold as a pet. She says she never breeds a female with a hernia, some breeders do, but she fears the scarring may restrict whelping down the line and won't chance it. This breeder does not let them go out until 6-7 months or more depending on development, bite is correct, and some other things she looks for. She said she doesn't want to give me something that is questionable because it is her reputation and she wants to set me up for success, not disappointment. I respect her for this. I realize, getting the right bitch can take 1-2 years or more, longer if you want a specific breeding. Not every puppy will be show quality. No show quality dog goes to a non-show home on open registration. I may be wrong, but unless the dog or bitch to be bred is of show quality for conformation, it should not be bred. Dogs or bitches of show quality that are not shown but bred are a small minority in a breeding program usually because the breeder does not have the time or resources to show/finish that particular dog. This is not a comment on the quality of any dog in particular, including Duckie, because let's face it, without seeing him in person or putting hands on the dog, it is impossible to tell quality. I empathize with the two people having this dispute, but we as outsiders to the discourse will never know exactly what happened. If everything said here is true by both parties, then there are grievances on both sides. Unless I interpreted the conversation wrong, bottom line is the puppy received wound up costing this person $500 deposit and her time. Maybe it is best to move on. Place the puppy in a loving pet home with full disclosure of the medical condition - or repair it, still telling the prospective buyers. After all, isn't that what this puppy needs most of all? If what the breeder says is true, then she fulfilled her contractual obligations. In my search for a show dog I have seen contracts that provide for refunds and those that do not. They run the gamut from restricting your breeding rights of just the dog you purchased from the breeder and contracts that restrict up to 3 generations of progeny. Unfortunately, there seem to be no winners in this situation. Perhaps it is best left as a learning experience for both parties. As I said, I am new and take no side in the debate, only share my limited experience up to now since you asked for suggestions. My best wishes for a peaceful resolution.

[Abby08]

3furryfaces, Well said!
Abby and me

[treasurebeauty]

Originally Posted by 3FurryFaces

I am very new to this. I have a pet yorkie on limited registration from a highly respected, long term show breeder. After knowing her and attending conformation and AKC events for the last year (some where she and others in her line show as well as shows that other exhibitors were at), meeting and talking to other breeders, I decided to try my hand in the show world. I am waiting for a show bitch - the breeder has taken no deposit. The last litter had one possible bitch but at 6 months developed a hernia. At that time, the hernia was repaired by the breeder, the bitch was spayed and sold as a pet. She says she never breeds a female with a hernia, some breeders do, but she fears the scarring may restrict whelping down the line and won't chance it. This breeder does not let them go out until 6-7 months or more depending on development, bite is correct, and some other things she looks for. She said she doesn't want to give me something that is questionable because it is her reputation and she wants to set me up for success, not disappointment. I respect her for this. I realize, getting the right bitch can take 1-2 years or more, longer if you want a specific breeding. Not every puppy will be show quality. No show quality dog goes to a non-show home on open registration. I may be wrong, but unless the dog or bitch to be bred is of show quality for conformation, it should not be bred. Dogs or bitches of show quality that are not shown but bred are a small minority in a breeding program usually because the breeder does not have the time or resources to show/finish that particular dog. This is not a comment on the quality of any dog in particular, including Duckie, because let's face it, without seeing him in person or putting hands on the dog, it is impossible to tell quality. I empathize with the two people having this dispute, but we as outsiders to the discourse will never know exactly what happened. If everything said here is true by both parties, then there are grievances on both sides. Unless I interpreted the conversation wrong, bottom line is the puppy received wound up costing this person $500 deposit and her time. Maybe it is best to move on. Place the puppy in a loving pet home with full disclosure of the medical condition - or repair it, still telling the prospective buyers. After all, isn't that what this puppy needs most of all? If what the breeder says is true, then she fulfilled her contractual obligations. In my search for a show dog I have seen contracts that provide for refunds and those that do not. They run the gamut from restricting your breeding rights of just the dog you purchased from the breeder and contracts that restrict up to 3 generations of progeny. Unfortunately, there seem to be no winners in this situation. Perhaps it is best left as a learning experience for both parties. As I said, I am new and take no side in the debate, only share my limited experience up to now since you asked for suggestions. My best wishes for a peaceful resolution.

Yes, I do agree continue argue on this back and forth does not do any good to the puppy.

Is just I don't know at this point, do I have the right to find this puppy a good home (with full disclosure of the medical condition)?? What do you people think?