What are these people thinking?? - YorkieTalk.com Forums

mimimomo · 06-03-2009, 12:50 PM

Sometimes I like to peek in my local pennysaver & see the yorkie puppies for sale (mostly by backyard breeders unfortunately)...once in a while, I'll come up to an ad that just doesn't make sense to me. It's for a stud service, a yorkie...7 lbs! Most of us know that you should always breed a female to a tinier male...They want $300 for his stud services.

Let's leave it to the reputable breeders & show professionals.

MindieRose · 06-03-2009, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mimimomo

Sometimes I like to peek in my local pennysaver & see the yorkie puppies for sale (mostly by backyard breeders unfortunately)...once in a while, I'll come up to an ad that just doesn't make sense to me. It's for a stud service, a yorkie...7 lbs! Most of us know that you should always breed a female to a tinier male...They want $300 for his stud services.

Let's leave it to the reputable breeders & show professionals.

7 lbs is still within standard, and last I heard, the female determines the size of the pups. I guess I would have to know more about this stud than his weight.

xxmxaxrxyxx · 06-03-2009, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MindieRose

7 lbs is still within standard, and last I heard, the female determines the size of the pups. I guess I would have to know more about this stud than his weight.

i agree!

mimimomo · 06-03-2009, 01:32 PM

Yes, 7 lbs is w/in standard. I was referring to backyard breeders & how they carelessly breed w/out the knowledge of the pedigree. From what little I know, the female determines how many pups will be in a litter. The determining factor of the size really depends on the lineage. There's also the occasional 'throw-backs' where a 7 lb stud can produce 3 lb (when full grown) babies & vise versa.
I saw the pic that was posted w/the ad & truthfully, he looks like an average yorkie, but shouldn't be used as a 'stud'.
Forgot to add that the male determines the sex of the pups...from what little I know.

MindieRose · 06-03-2009, 01:46 PM

Yes genetics are going to determine the ultimate outcome as far as size of pups go. In utero, however, the bitch plays a large role in how large the puppies grow inside of her. Not unlike an alligator in a fish tank. I am sure there are some circumstances where that rule is not followed, such as breeding a much larger BREED of dog, like say a 25 beagle with a 5 lb yorkie, but generally it seems, from what I have studied, the smaller males are bred to the larger females to keep the pups smaller as full grown dogs, not in utero.

Jemma · 06-03-2009, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MindieRose

7 lbs is still within standard, and last I heard, the female determines the size of the pups. I guess I would have to know more about this stud than his weight.

mimimomo · 06-03-2009, 02:45 PM

I actually posted this to understand some things happening in the threads. Lately, I've come across some very heartbreaking threads where a yorkie(s) has lost her life giving birth & also some newborn puppies that never had a chance. I guess I'm trying to understand some things I obviously don't & trying to find ways to find some kind of explanation for some things. It just saddened me & I can't imagine what the owners must be going through.

Nancy1999 · 06-03-2009, 03:16 PM

From what I understand, breeding is like lots of things, and much more complicated than a few simple rules. We usually see a few sentences written, to explain some concept, but there are usually exceptions to every rule, and it takes a good amount of study to understand the all exceptions. I have read both things, that breeders likes to use smaller male dogs, and some people have said that the female determines the weight, but I really don't know the exact answer, and maybe it's a combination answer; that's why it's good to really research before you begin breeding.

Most good breeders would want to study the line of a dog, the dog could be the smallest in a line of 15 pounders, or he could be the biggest in a line of 5 pounders, so just knowing his weight gives you very little information. Also, I believe that many breeders "fudge" a little on the weight when they advertise like that, and they usually fudge on the side of less weight. One breeder, I read about, gave the dog's "breeding weight" that was over two pounds lighter than his average weight. She said when he was around females he wouldn't eat for days, but it seemed to me, the weight she should have been using was the weight he normally was. I really agree with you, we should leave the breeding to the experts.

Brooklynn · 06-03-2009, 07:25 PM

My stud male is almost 6 1/2 pounds and was bred to a smaller bitch and I got one larger pup and a smaller pup but personally I love my dogs to average around 6 pounds both in bitches and males.

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

Brooklynn · 06-03-2009, 07:27 PM

[he was around females he wouldn't eat for days, .[/QUOTE]

OH my gosh Radar won't eat for days when I have a bitch in season. He really has other things on his mind and it drives "ME" insane! I have to hand feed him just to get him to eat anything! Just drives me crazy!!!

Donna

bjh · 06-03-2009, 08:21 PM

Yea, I used to think show people kept their dogs thin so they would not go over 7 lbs but I am realizing now that many of the yorkies that go to shows every weekend do tend to loose weight just from all the stress. Add a female in heat to the mix and it can be a problem.

I have heard of several very nice yorkies finishing lately that were well over 7 lbs. My opinion is that being over 7 lbs is a fault just like a bad topline, bad front, etc. I would rather have a dog that is a little over sized with near perfect conformation than a dog that is under 7 lbs but has serious conformation faults. Of course, ideally I would just love to have a perfect yorkie.

Mardelin · 06-03-2009, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MindieRose

Yes genetics are going to determine the ultimate outcome as far as size of pups go. In utero, however, the bitch plays a large role in how large the puppies grow inside of her. Not unlike an alligator in a fish tank. I am sure there are some circumstances where that rule is not followed, such as breeding a much larger BREED of dog, like say a 25 beagle with a 5 lb yorkie, but generally it seems, from what I have studied, the smaller males are bred to the larger females to keep the pups smaller as full grown dogs, not in utero.

However in yorkies, the normal breeding concepts can be thrown out the window. Smaller male to larger female doesn't help keep the pups smaller as they grow. It's based on the line. You can't breed pheno type to pheno type in yorkies and predict what your gonna get as you can in lets say poodles.

I have a male that his normal weight is 4 pounds, a bit overweight now at 5 1/2 pouns, that throws his father, each and everytime. He's father was 7 pounds. You're very lucky if you have a stud that throws his self.

Also, let's say that you see a dog that has everything you absolutely love, the very best chance of you getting that dog is to breed to his father.

Mardelin · 06-03-2009, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjh

Yea, I used to think show people kept their dogs thin so they would not go over 7 lbs but I am realizing now that many of the yorkies that go to shows every weekend do tend to loose weight just from all the stress. Add a female in heat to the mix and it can be a problem.

I have heard of several very nice yorkies finishing lately that were well over 7 lbs. My opinion is that being over 7 lbs is a fault just like a bad topline, bad front, etc. I would rather have a dog that is a little over sized with near perfect conformation than a dog that is under 7 lbs but has serious conformation faults. Of course, ideally I would just love to have a perfect yorkie.

I've never had a problem with my dogs maintaining their weight while on the show circuit and most of my bitches when in heat gain weight, they are chow hounds. In fact most of my dogs when showing seem to gain weight, since they're all on special diets to keep them conditioned. Besides being road worked to keep their muscles toned and build up stamina.

addicted · 06-03-2009, 09:17 PM

Well, I saw one in the pennysaver for a 12 lb stud that did not even look close to standard!

mkbartz · 06-04-2009, 02:03 PM

Ya, I know. There are always people around here that advertised their LARGE unregistered stud for $300. It makes me cringe.

06-03-2009, 12:50 PM	#1
mimimomo Don't Litter Spay&Neuter Donating Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: So Cal Posts: 9,874	What are these people thinking?? Sometimes I like to peek in my local pennysaver & see the yorkie puppies for sale (mostly by backyard breeders unfortunately)...once in a while, I'll come up to an ad that just doesn't make sense to me. It's for a stud service, a yorkie...7 lbs! Most of us know that you should always breed a female to a tinier male...They want $300 for his stud services. Let's leave it to the reputable breeders & show professionals. __________________ Jenny Mimi Momo Princess Turbo Madan Pin Brush: www.toplinepet.com

06-03-2009, 01:32 PM	#4
mimimomo Don't Litter Spay&Neuter Donating Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: So Cal Posts: 9,874	Yes, 7 lbs is w/in standard. I was referring to backyard breeders & how they carelessly breed w/out the knowledge of the pedigree. From what little I know, the female determines how many pups will be in a litter. The determining factor of the size really depends on the lineage. There's also the occasional 'throw-backs' where a 7 lb stud can produce 3 lb (when full grown) babies & vise versa. I saw the pic that was posted w/the ad & truthfully, he looks like an average yorkie, but shouldn't be used as a 'stud'. Forgot to add that the male determines the sex of the pups...from what little I know. __________________ Jenny Mimi Momo Princess Turbo Madan Pin Brush: www.toplinepet.com Last edited by mimimomo; 06-03-2009 at 01:36 PM.

06-03-2009, 01:46 PM	#5
MindieRose Donating YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,280	Yes genetics are going to determine the ultimate outcome as far as size of pups go. In utero, however, the bitch plays a large role in how large the puppies grow inside of her. Not unlike an alligator in a fish tank. I am sure there are some circumstances where that rule is not followed, such as breeding a much larger BREED of dog, like say a 25 beagle with a 5 lb yorkie, but generally it seems, from what I have studied, the smaller males are bred to the larger females to keep the pups smaller as full grown dogs, not in utero. __________________ Proud Mommy of Gavin, Ethan, Morgan, Nia, Olivia, and Kiana and baby #7! Also Mommy to furkids: Cleo ,Lola, Lilly Appletini, and Diesel. and Sunny, Ethan's Golden therapy dog in training.

06-03-2009, 02:45 PM	#7
mimimomo Don't Litter Spay&Neuter Donating Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: So Cal Posts: 9,874	I actually posted this to understand some things happening in the threads. Lately, I've come across some very heartbreaking threads where a yorkie(s) has lost her life giving birth & also some newborn puppies that never had a chance. I guess I'm trying to understand some things I obviously don't & trying to find ways to find some kind of explanation for some things. It just saddened me & I can't imagine what the owners must be going through. __________________ Jenny Mimi Momo Princess Turbo Madan Pin Brush: www.toplinepet.com

06-03-2009, 03:16 PM	#8
Nancy1999 I ♥ Joey & Ralphie! Donating Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Arizona Posts: 25,396 Blog Entries: 2	From what I understand, breeding is like lots of things, and much more complicated than a few simple rules. We usually see a few sentences written, to explain some concept, but there are usually exceptions to every rule, and it takes a good amount of study to understand the all exceptions. I have read both things, that breeders likes to use smaller male dogs, and some people have said that the female determines the weight, but I really don't know the exact answer, and maybe it's a combination answer; that's why it's good to really research before you begin breeding. Most good breeders would want to study the line of a dog, the dog could be the smallest in a line of 15 pounders, or he could be the biggest in a line of 5 pounders, so just knowing his weight gives you very little information. Also, I believe that many breeders "fudge" a little on the weight when they advertise like that, and they usually fudge on the side of less weight. One breeder, I read about, gave the dog's "breeding weight" that was over two pounds lighter than his average weight. She said when he was around females he wouldn't eat for days, but it seemed to me, the weight she should have been using was the weight he normally was. I really agree with you, we should leave the breeding to the experts. __________________ NancyJoey Proud members of the CrAzYcLuB and YAP! ** Just Say No to Puppymills – Join YAP! Yorkshire Terrier Club of America – Breeder Referrals

06-03-2009, 07:25 PM	#9
Brooklynn Donating YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 4,280	My stud male is almost 6 1/2 pounds and was bred to a smaller bitch and I got one larger pup and a smaller pup but personally I love my dogs to average around 6 pounds both in bitches and males. Donna Bird Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

06-03-2009, 07:27 PM	#10
Brooklynn Donating YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 4,280	[he was around females he wouldn't eat for days, .[/QUOTE] OH my gosh Radar won't eat for days when I have a bitch in season. He really has other things on his mind and it drives "ME" insane! I have to hand feed him just to get him to eat anything! Just drives me crazy!!! Donna

06-03-2009, 08:21 PM	#11
bjh Donating YT 5000 Club Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Southeast Texas Posts: 7,959	Yea, I used to think show people kept their dogs thin so they would not go over 7 lbs but I am realizing now that many of the yorkies that go to shows every weekend do tend to loose weight just from all the stress. Add a female in heat to the mix and it can be a problem. I have heard of several very nice yorkies finishing lately that were well over 7 lbs. My opinion is that being over 7 lbs is a fault just like a bad topline, bad front, etc. I would rather have a dog that is a little over sized with near perfect conformation than a dog that is under 7 lbs but has serious conformation faults. Of course, ideally I would just love to have a perfect yorkie.

06-03-2009, 09:17 PM	#14
addicted IheartYorkies Donating Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: SGV, CA Posts: 1,511	Well, I saw one in the pennysaver for a 12 lb stud that did not even look close to standard! __________________ Linda Penny Simba Bella Marley Pink

06-04-2009, 02:03 PM	#15
mkbartz YT 500 Club Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: London, Ontario, canada Posts: 518	Ya, I know. There are always people around here that advertised their LARGE unregistered stud for $300. It makes me cringe.