Am I being Unfair? (Warning: Graphic Pics)

[miabellaamoure]

IMHPO...it's really the degree of strength that certain breeds of dogs can inflict with a bite that I think contributes to the idea of locking jaws.

Pit Bull - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Any dog's jaws can be locked in a closed position by surgically-correctable jaw abnormalities,[22] but there is no evidence for the existence of a physiological "locking mechanism" in the teeth or jaw structure of normal pit bull-type dogs[23] so this is not a factor in the number of fatalities attributed to them; however, pit bull-type dogs often exhibit "bite, hold, and shake" behavior and refuse to release when biting,[24] so some pit bull rescue organizations and advocacy groups recommend owners of pit bull-type dogs carry a "break stick" to lever their dog's jaws open if it bites a person or animal.[8][25]

Fatalities reported in the United States (2006-2008)
For more details on this topic, see List of people killed by dogs in the United States.

The following table summarizes the number of pit bull-related fatalities in the United States from 2006-2008 as reported by news organizations.[20]

Dog Bite-related Fatalities in the United States

Year------Total------Involving Pitbull-type dogs
2006------30--------16 (53%)
2007------35--------20 (57%)
2008------23--------16 (65%)
2009------16--------8 (50%)

This is how I would like to see a Pitbull out in public...again, it's my personal opinion and one based on personal experience, too.

[SCramer]

Hello I am an Animal Control Officer I work for the largest Animal Control Agency in the nation. I have read most of the responses ! Unfortunatly this is not TV and we dont all have the pleasure of being visited by the dog whisperer! I have seen many dog attacks, some provoked some not! My thoughts are this there are so many wonderful homeless animals in the nation that we have to put to sleep everyday,why own a vicious dog, these dogs attacked once they will do it again maybe next time a small child and maybe they wont be so lucky! I have seen children and adults loose their lives over attacks such as this, I feel the dogs need to be put down, you are not selfish by feeling that, but you are lucky with the amount of dogs there that you weren't hurt worse than that. You also have to look at the owner should people like this be allowed to raise such dangerous animals, animals like this take alot of time and effort in raising in a positive manner, most people dont have that kind of time, you should make sure that an Officer comes out to where the dogs live, make sure that the confinement is adequate, so the dogs dont get out again, if you see them out dont go outside call the humane society the more complaints the easier it will be to take the dogs from an irresponsible owner, Good Luck!

Sandy ACO I

[LaceyandMuffin]

Originally Posted by SCramer

Hello I am an Animal Control Officer I work for the largest Animal Control Agency in the nation. I have read most of the responses ! Unfortunatly this is not TV and we dont all have the pleasure of being visited by the dog whisperer! I have seen many dog attacks, some provoked some not! My thoughts are this there are so many wonderful homeless animals in the nation that we have to put to sleep everyday,why own a vicious dog, these dogs attacked once they will do it again maybe next time a small child and maybe they wont be so lucky! I have seen children and adults loose their lives over attacks such as this, I feel the dogs need to be put down, you are not selfish by feeling that, but you are lucky with the amount of dogs there that you weren't hurt worse than that. You also have to look at the owner should people like this be allowed to raise such dangerous animals, animals like this take alot of time and effort in raising in a positive manner, most people dont have that kind of time, you should make sure that an Officer comes out to where the dogs live, make sure that the confinement is adequate, so the dogs dont get out again, if you see them out dont go outside call the humane society the more complaints the easier it will be to take the dogs from an irresponsible owner, Good Luck!

Sandy ACO I

I am shocked by some post on this topic but not really. I believe all dogs have a right to a second chance. Who are we to not grant a second chance when we've all at least once been given a second chance. I am especially upset what the fact that in your post you would say that there are a lot of good dogs in pounds so we should kill the bad. If only we could apply that to humans... I am sickened that you think that way. I hope these dogs find themselves in a home that can provide the love and training they need.

Also for the person who posted the muzzled dog. Why don't you show the death rate from other dogs and make your findings more legit.

For the original poster I am sorry you and your son had to go through this. I am glad you found a home for your dog.

[Symph2001]

Originally Posted by LaceyandMuffin

I am shocked by some post on this topic but not really. I believe all dogs have a right to a second chance. Who are we to not grant a second chance when we've all at least once been given a second chance. I am especially upset what the fact that in your post you would say that there are a lot of good dogs in pounds so we should kill the bad. If only we could apply that to humans... I am sickened that you think that way. I hope these dogs find themselves in a home that can provide the love and training they need.

As someone who was mauled, not just attacked, MAULED by a large breed dog I am equally surprised by you. That you can't understand the fear involved. I can no longer be in the same area with a large dog no matter the breed without breaking into a cold sweat. may be the most docile animal ever born but I still freak a little. Irrational fear is irrational for a reason. I wasn't always like this. I had to have my face and neck ripped up first.

Do I think they all need to die? No
Do I think everyone deserves a second chance? Depends on the crime.
In this case it was a puppy BUT it could have been SO much worse considering they were running in a pack.
Should the owner be held responsible? Yes and they should have to have their dogs evaluated by a professional and if found untrained should be giving to someone responsible. Dogs are like children. You don't raise them right and they end up in places you didn't expect like jail or death row.

[livingdustmops]

Originally Posted by miabellaamoure

IMHPO...it's really the degree of strength that certain breeds of dogs can inflict with a bite that I think contributes to the idea of locking jaws.

Pit Bull - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Any dog's jaws can be locked in a closed position by surgically-correctable jaw abnormalities,[22] but there is no evidence for the existence of a physiological "locking mechanism" in the teeth or jaw structure of normal pit bull-type dogs[23] so this is not a factor in the number of fatalities attributed to them; however, pit bull-type dogs often exhibit "bite, hold, and shake" behavior and refuse to release when biting,[24] so some pit bull rescue organizations and advocacy groups recommend owners of pit bull-type dogs carry a "break stick" to lever their dog's jaws open if it bites a person or animal.[8][25]

Fatalities reported in the United States (2006-2008)
For more details on this topic, see List of people killed by dogs in the United States.

The following table summarizes the number of pit bull-related fatalities in the United States from 2006-2008 as reported by news organizations.[20]

Dog Bite-related Fatalities in the United States

Year------Total------Involving Pitbull-type dogs
2006------30--------16 (53%)
2007------35--------20 (57%)
2008------23--------16 (65%)
2009------16--------8 (50%)

This is how I would like to see a Pitbull out in public...again, it's my personal opinion and one based on personal experience, too.

One thing I think we have to keep in mind is where the majority of these types of dogs live and what they were purchased for. Sadly I believe you will find many in the poorer sections of towns (not in all cases but many) and were not purchased to be a loving pet. While your stat's are correct in terms of going up I believe it is because these dogs are going into homes that using them for protection or dog fighting rings. It is so sad but how do we protect these dogs from getting into the wrong hands. These dogs use to be a beautiful breed and are being ruined by lowlife's.

The following website does track dog bites and dog kills in the US. While I am not surprised by the breeds that have killed for the most part (they are trained to do this in many cases) I was surprised by the baby that was killed by a Pom as I did not know they were bred to be guard dogs (I don't know if this is true - just what the website says).

DOG BITE LAW - Statistics about dog bites in the USA and elsewhere

[SCramer]

Originally Posted by LaceyandMuffin

I am shocked by some post on this topic but not really. I believe all dogs have a right to a second chance. Who are we to not grant a second chance when we've all at least once been given a second chance. I am especially upset what the fact that in your post you would say that there are a lot of good dogs in pounds so we should kill the bad. If only we could apply that to humans... I am sickened that you think that way. I hope these dogs find themselves in a home that can provide the love and training they need.

Also for the person who posted the muzzled dog. Why don't you show the death rate from other dogs and make your findings more legit.

For the original poster I am sorry you and your son had to go through this. I am glad you found a home for your dog.

You probably wouldnt say that if you have seen a five year old child thrown like a rag doll till her death from pit bulls, or if you had to rush the family pitbull to the vet to have a 2 year olds ear cut from the belly, or you saw 2 elderly ladies with the flesh ripped from their bodies and not enough flesh to cover their wounds, one who later died from her injuries, you want to give these dogs a second chance! I have seen pitbulls that are very sweet but like I said it takes alot of love and companionship once these dogs attack someone for them to stay in the same enviorment where the behavior was learned sickens me, its not the dogs fault, but it is still a behavior that is learned from where that dog lives, there is no bad dogs only bad people who unfortunatly teach them these behaviors. I not only have stories about pit bulls this goes for all breeds, pitbulls through my experience can do alot of damage because of their strength. Any dog that bites has learned this from somewhere. For the neighbors to be able to continue keeping these dogs after they have attacked a child that sickens me! Until you walk a mile in my shoes don't be to quick to judge, Ive seen things that you cant even imagine in your wildest dreams! People are the most in human animals on the earth! They prove it to me everyday! And whats the chance these dogs wont attack again can you gaurantee they wont attack again, why should we take that chance for a dogs second chance! Ruin a life or end one, Im sorry thats not a chance I am willing to take and to compare people with dogs is absurd! Like I said no bad dogs just bad PEOPLE!

[megansmomma]

Originally Posted by SCramer

You probably wouldnt say that if you have seen a five year old child thrown like a rag doll till her death from pit bulls, or if you had to rush the family pitbull to the vet to have a 2 year olds ear cut from the belly, or you saw 2 elderly ladies with the flesh ripped from their bodies and not enough flesh to cover their wounds, one who later died from her injuries, you want to give these dogs a second chance! I have seen pitbulls that are very sweet but like I said it takes alot of love and companionship once these dogs attack someone for them to stay in the same enviorment where the behavior was learned sickens me, its not the dogs fault, but it is still a behavior that is learned from where that dog lives, there is no bad dogs only bad people who unfortunatly teach them these behaviors. I not only have stories about pit bulls this goes for all breeds, pitbulls through my experience can do alot of damage because of their strength. Any dog that bites has learned this from somewhere. For the neighbors to be able to continue keeping these dogs after they have attacked a child that sickens me! Until you walk a mile in my shoes don't be to quick to judge, Ive seen things that you cant even imagine in your wildest dreams! People are the most in human animals on the earth! They prove it to me everyday! And whats the chance these dogs wont attack again can you gaurantee they wont attack again, why should we take that chance for a dogs second chance! Ruin a life or end one, Im sorry thats not a chance I am willing to take and to compare people with dogs is absurd! Like I said no bad dogs just bad PEOPLE!

I would like to toss my opinion into this debate

The reason that Pitbulls are so dangerous is their lineage. I have read a lot and learned a lot on this forum. I've read many posts in the breeders forum from RESPECTED breeders and they always speak of how you need to know generations back in the dogs lines. This is not only true from a Yorkshire Terrier but ANY dog that is being breed. They look at these things for color, coat, size, TEMPERAMENT...etc. So if reputable breeders are breeding for the good of the breed, disreputable breeders are breeding for just the opposite. They are bred for their strength, power and aggression in dogs like Pit bulls. Many (not all) are bred to be fighting dogs. We have a lot of very sick people out there going horrific things like dog fighting and they are doing this to WIN!

Sadly, this type of breeding has been going on with the bully breed for so long now that IMO the breed has become forever ruined. It is just like when I hear people speak of how people are looking for smaller and smaller yorkies. They are not being bred to standard because of the demands of the public. This argument can also be carried over to this debate as well.

I hear outrage all the time about BYBer and breeding ethics. It makes me stop and ask about the breeding ethics of the owners of these vicious dogs as well. In truth, it really is about taking responsibility for your actions. The BYBer and puppymill many times breed sick dogs without care or concern and only the money in their pocket. The Pit Bull breeder breeds for aggression and the money in their pocket. It is all very irresponsible and disgusting to me.

[SCramer]

Originally Posted by megansmomma

I would like to toss my opinion into this debate

The reason that Pitbulls are so dangerous is their lineage. I have read a lot and learned a lot on this forum. I've read many posts in the breeders forum from RESPECTED breeders and they always speak of how you need to know generations back in the dogs lines. This is not only true from a Yorkshire Terrier but ANY dog that is being breed. They look at these things for color, coat, size, TEMPERAMENT...etc. So if reputable breeders are breeding for the good of the breed, disreputable breeders are breeding for just the opposite. They are bred for their strength, power and aggression in dogs like Pit bulls. Many (not all) are bred to be fighting dogs. We have a lot of very sick people out there going horrific things like dog fighting and they are doing this to WIN!

Sadly, this type of breeding has been going on with the bully breed for so long now that IMO the breed has become forever ruined. It is just like when I hear people speak of how people are looking for smaller and smaller yorkies. They are not being bred to standard because of the demands of the public. This argument can also be carried over to this debate as well.

I hear outrage all the time about BYBer and breeding ethics. It makes me stop and ask about the breeding ethics of the owners of these vicious dogs as well. In truth, it really is about taking responsibility for your actions. The BYBer and puppymill many times breed sick dogs without care or concern and only the money in their pocket. The Pit Bull breeder breeds for aggression and the money in their pocket. It is all very irresponsible and disgusting to me.

I totally agree with you! The problem is people think that just anybody can repair the damage done by these breeders and owners! Which couldnt be any further than the truth! If someone owns a pitbull or any dog for that matter, the dog gets out and attacks someone, that should put up a red flag! First of all a responsible pet owner wont let their dog run at large! I realize sometimes dogs escape! Second of all a responsible pet owner would not own a dog or teach a dog to attack! Its not the dogs fault.............where do you draw the line, and where do you take your dog when he attacks your neighbor? To obedience school, might help, but most obedience training schools do not allow aggressive dogs! These dogs have to be worked with on a DAILY basis! FOR LIFE! Not just anyone can teach a dog not to be aggressive! Remember this is a learned behavior, only a professional can teach an owner to teach the pet to learn a new behavior! The learning process is daily for life, your pet will never forget this past behavior it will only learn new behaviors, and as long as you are there everyday to keep the new behavior a daily way of life, will your pet be a loving pet!

[Sharly4]

We had an incident come out on the news not too long ago where a baby was tore up by two pit bulls. The grandma was the owner and she said they were nice dogs and she never had concern for them before. But she went to get a bottle for the baby and when she came back her dogs tore the baby up. I'm sure there was crying and stuff. They didn't get too much into the story. Just that the grandma said her dogs were sweet and didn't think nothing of it leaving the room. She went to jail for a really long time and they put the dogs to sleep. And that's not the first time sweet pitbulls have attacked. There's been a couple stories on the news about pit bulls.

[lusciouslala]

The dogs should be put down immediately. I love dogs, absolutely. But i'll first consider the safety of my family and other people around me. I hope your son's okay. I hope he's not traumatized. I'll pray for you and your son and pray that you do the right thing. God Bless.

[LaceyandMuffin]

Originally Posted by SCramer

You probably wouldnt say that if you have seen a five year old child thrown like a rag doll till her death from pit bulls, or if you had to rush the family pitbull to the vet to have a 2 year olds ear cut from the belly, or you saw 2 elderly ladies with the flesh ripped from their bodies and not enough flesh to cover their wounds, one who later died from her injuries, you want to give these dogs a second chance! I have seen pitbulls that are very sweet but like I said it takes alot of love and companionship once these dogs attack someone for them to stay in the same enviorment where the behavior was learned sickens me, its not the dogs fault, but it is still a behavior that is learned from where that dog lives, there is no bad dogs only bad people who unfortunatly teach them these behaviors. I not only have stories about pit bulls this goes for all breeds, pitbulls through my experience can do alot of damage because of their strength. Any dog that bites has learned this from somewhere. For the neighbors to be able to continue keeping these dogs after they have attacked a child that sickens me! Until you walk a mile in my shoes don't be to quick to judge, Ive seen things that you cant even imagine in your wildest dreams! People are the most in human animals on the earth! They prove it to me everyday! And whats the chance these dogs wont attack again can you gaurantee they wont attack again, why should we take that chance for a dogs second chance! Ruin a life or end one, Im sorry thats not a chance I am willing to take and to compare people with dogs is absurd! Like I said no bad dogs just bad PEOPLE!

Before YOU judge me take your own advice you don't know what I've seen or been through. I am not going to continue this conversation with you or anyone else on here. If the death of a dog is something you wish for then that is up to you. We all have our own opinions and I have mine. I never said the dogs should be left in the house. I am pretty sure I said that they need to go to a place that can care for them. And lastly you are right to compare people to dogs is absurb because it is an insult to all dogs.

[Symph2001]

Originally Posted by LaceyandMuffin

Before YOU judge me take your own advice you don't know what I've seen or been through. I am not going to continue this conversation with you or anyone else on here. If the death of a dog is something you wish for then that is up to you. We all have our own opinions and I have mine. I never said the dogs should be left in the house. I am pretty sure I said that they need to go to a place that can care for them. And lastly you are right to compare people to dogs is absurb because it is an insult to all dogs.

I understand. It's difficult to debate a point of view where you put the life of an animal above the life of a child. The owner of the animal will never suffer for ruining that animals life and it is the owners fault.

The dog that mauled me was given a second chance but she had to move to another neighborhood where within 2 months he attacked 2 other children. He still wasn't put down immediately or taken from his owners care. He met his demise when one of the fathers of the other victims mowed him down with his truck when the owner let him run the streets in the evening. Did the owner suffer? No. She filed bankruptcy so none of the vicyims could collect damages for all our hospital bills. I personally feel a shot to put her vicious pet to sleep forever would have been kinder than being run down in the street but she wasn't know for either her compassion or kindness.

[BamaFan121s]

Whether or not I would want the dogs PTS would depend on what I felt the likelyhood of them doing the same thing again was. If allowed to stay with their current owner, given the fact that you say their were 7 dogs surrounding your son--seven dogs of any breed, much less one with the potential of doing serious damage, being allowed to run loose, unsupervised, not properly disciplined, is a recipe for disaster and I would think it's a pretty high probability that it would happen again.

Having them taken from the owner and evaluated by professional behavioral specialists and then going from there would be the best option, I would think. If you could know FOR certain that was what was happening and the dogs were not just being passed on to someone else without the issue being properly addressed and corrected. I understand however, that going to that extreme is not often an option and it comes down to a simple, PTS or not. If that's the case, I'm sorry to say, but it would be my opinion that the dogs should be euthanized. I have a high regard for the rights and lives of animals, but I have a higher regard for that of humans.

In any event, it may be that it's out of your hands altogether. If you have not already, make sure that your county's health department and animal control has record of the indident. (If you or your son had to receive medical treatment for your injuries, then the hospital is required by law to report it to both agencies...but regardless, follow up with them to make sure they actually got the info from the hospital.) You and the owners may not have any choice in the matter, depending on what regulations your county has.

Again though, if it came down to them giving the dogs back after their quarrantine, and there was not going to be any regulation by someone other than the owners to have them evaluated, then yes, I would pursue having them PTS. Either way, I would do whatever it took to ensure that the dogs were not living near me anymore.

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by crazydog

And if your yorkie bit somebody, should it be put down too? What's good for the goose...

I would say it depends on the situation. The difference is the amount of damage that a Yorkie can inflict vs the amount a larger, more powerful breed can inflict...and there is a huge difference. But for the most part, if the Yorkie had a history of aggression, was evaluated and deemed a threat, then yes, it should be PTS too.

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by Sharly4

wouldn't let go. It took several blank shots from their pistol for her to let me go. My dad wanted her put down and they some how got her out.

Wow...only firing blanks? Wrong choice of ammo. That would have been an indicator right there if the owners couldn't even get the dog under control. I have to give your dad credit for his self control though...can't say that mine wouldn't have gotten the result he wanted in that situation one way or the other.

Also, I can completely understand and sypathize with how reaction to dogs has been affected as a result.