Who should breed Yorkies? - YorkieTalk.com Forums

SnowWa · 12-16-2005, 03:58 AM

I am a little confused as far as breeding goes.

I believe in improving and maintaining the standards of every breed, and am becoming more familiar with many of you who are serious breeders. You have a real passion for breeding. You select and purchase very fine animals, breed them carefully, care for them wonderfully, and whelp litters that are as near the Yorkie standards as possible. You strive for perfection.

And there are people (not breeders in the true sense of the word) who have a pet Yorkie or two (average animals) breed them, care for them very well, and sell them to many of us who are dying to have a Yorkie for a pet.

I am describing two very different types of breeders. One who has the understanding, education, and passion to strive for the very best. The other who loves their pet(s), breeds them, and sends them off to loving homes to be pets.

I believe there is something inherently difficult in breeding Yorkies. I have yet to see a breed that varies as much as the Yorkie. The AKC weight standard is 5 to 7 lbs, and I have seen Yorkies from 2 to 14 pounds. The standard for coloring is especially confusing - but apart from the standard, look at all the different colors there are. This has nothing to do with the standards, but the way different people maintain their Yorkies (haircuts especially) can cause them to look like totally different breeds.

And - leave it to the Yorkie to be loved and adored no matter what size, shape, color, or haircut it has.

Price?? Should we talk about price when we talk about breeders. I think so. There certainly is usually a difference in the quality of puppies that are produced by the serious breeders compared to the backyard (I hate this term) breeders. So, for those of us who care about the difference, we should be willing to pay more for higher quality Yorkies. (I didn't say more loveable - they are all adorable and loveable.) I just mean higher quality in terms of meeting the standards of the breed.

I have stated before that I have the cutest little guy, but I wouldn't breed him. I think he has too many faults. He may get too big, his ears may be too large. His legs might be a little too long, and his coat leaves a lot to be desired. Of course, all my friends say, "Why don't you breed him?" Well - you and I know why. But he is perfect for me because I wanted a pet.

I suppose this happens with all breeds. So many people want their dogs bred and want to have a litter of puppies. But even with the best intentions and wonderful care, and a lot of love, I don't suppose this is always a good thing.

But -- if only the very professional breeders bred dogs, I think they would be too expensive for most people, and there wouldn't be enough to go around.
We can't all have or want a show dog. Most of us want a pet.

I think my post makes no sense at all. I'm not even sure what I'm trying to ask. I guess I am just asking about Yorkies and who should be breeding them. I wonder how some of you feel about this.

I am not talking about puppy mills, bad breeders, or anything like that. We all know where we stand there. I am referring more to the two types of caring breeders that I have mentioned above. Is it acceptable to breed "pet quality" Yorkies. Can this hurt the breed in the long run.

Carol Jean

Doggy Bear · 12-16-2005, 05:44 AM

That a serious question. In a french forum we talk a lot about that and sometimes it because emotional.

I bought my N'Stein from a breeder who was selling his dogs with no papers and extend his breeding to different breed of dogs

. I choose him because it was refered to me by a friend. And the major point because the puppy cost me 450$ instead of 1200$. For the dog I had a budget of 1000$. So I have prefered to put the rest of the money of accessories and vet care (exam, vaccins) for my N'Stein.

So my choice was made regarding how come it want to send my budget.

Put I also recognize the effort that reels breeders put in breeding dogs that meet the standard.

txshopper73 · 12-16-2005, 05:45 AM

Carol Jean, your thread makes perfect sense. I don't approve of the breeder that says they want to breed because their furbaby "is just so cute!" Then, when you look at the pictures they've posted or pictures in their avatar, they have down ears, or long faces, out of the breed standard and I've even seen bad bites. I don't understand it and it's disheartening for the breeders that are trying to maintin the breed standard.

Do I think that JUST show breeders should breed? No, I do not. I know that there are yorkies out there that are beautiful, come from beautiful lines and fit the standard perfectly. If you're going to do something, do it right. Don't just do it because you think you're yorkie is cute. JMHO

Gazou · 12-16-2005, 06:01 AM

JMO.... Peoples should be more careful when they are choosing their Yorkies for breeding . If a breeder sell a pup as pet , this puppy have to be spayed or neutered .

BamaFan121s · 12-16-2005, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by txshopper73

Carol Jean, your thread makes perfect sense. I don't approve of the breeder that says they want to breed because their furbaby "is just so cute!" Then, when you look at the pictures they've posted or pictures in their avatar, they have down ears, or long faces, out of the breed standard and I've even seen bad bites. I don't understand it and it's disheartening for the breeders that are trying to maintin the breed standard.

Yeah...I noticed that too...

Sherry Lynn · 12-16-2005, 06:25 AM

I have one of each, and you're right, there is a BIG difference in their appearance!

My husband got Dublin for me from a breeder that was refered to him by someone that he worked with. The breeder/broker got them from her sister who has a farm in Ireland. (I know now about the puppymills in Ireland, but I really don't think thats the case here, because while she sells several breeds, she rarely has pups. Haven't listed Yorkies since I got Dublin in May.)

My BYB dog, Dublin, is hearty at over 10lbs (paid more for him because he was supposed to be under 7lb

) has what I guess it would be the teddy bear face. And while he still has a short puppy coat, its thick and dark on the back with gray underneath. His face and legs are a reddish gold. AND he has a bad underbite!

My breeder dog,The Widget, is from Sylvan and is a sprite 4+lbs (my adorable WeeMidget!) and has a delicate little face that is more pointed. At a little over a year old her coat is already long fine and very soft and silky. Her back is silver and her face and legs are a beautiful gold.

Its like Jethro Bodine meets Morgan Fairchild!

While I find them both wonderful, and I adore them both with all of my heart, they are almost like different yet similar breeds...

BTW, I paid the same amount for both of them, but Dublin is probably going to cost me more for braces or dental work!

Edited to add, I have absolutely no interest in breeding, I just wanted loving companion pets, given that I'd say I succeeded!

JCarlson2004 · 12-16-2005, 06:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by txshopper73

Carol Jean, your thread makes perfect sense. I don't approve of the breeder that says they want to breed because their furbaby "is just so cute!" Then, when you look at the pictures they've posted or pictures in their avatar, they have down ears, or long faces, out of the breed standard and I've even seen bad bites. I don't understand it and it's disheartening for the breeders that are trying to maintin the breed standard.

Do I think that JUST show breeders should breed? No, I do not. I know that there are yorkies out there that are beautiful, come from beautiful lines and fit the standard perfectly. If you're going to do something, do it right. Don't just do it because you think you're yorkie is cute. JMHO

JUDY's2yorkies · 12-16-2005, 06:30 AM

I have to agree to both posts, after raising maltiese and bassetts, I have the attitude that if you are going to breed,meet the standards, yet also there are people out there that are intrested in a pet,but you can still have both, but I think you can have both from the same breeder..on maltese I have had 3lb dogs and 8 lb in the same litter..the 8 lbers would be pets and nuetered before leaving,the 3-5 were sold as optional...both were loved and cared for,but differant kinds of people got them...if your going to raise show,you sell to people that want show..if you have a pet quality everyonece in a while it would go to someone who needs a pet, I really dont think one treads on the other ...but standard should always be the number one rule of thumb..now this is only my oppenion sp,but even in cars you get what you pay for,some want a new mercedes some want a pinto that is 20 years old...to me as long as they can afford the vet costs and have the love needed there will be homes available for all, but then again,rather than breed pet puppies on porpose,lets get all rescues in great homes first

red98vett · 12-16-2005, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by txshopper73

Carol Jean, your thread makes perfect sense. I don't approve of the breeder that says they want to breed because their furbaby "is just so cute!" Then, when you look at the pictures they've posted or pictures in their avatar, they have down ears, or long faces, out of the breed standard and I've even seen bad bites. I don't understand it and it's disheartening for the breeders that are trying to maintin the breed standard.

Do I think that JUST show breeders should breed? No, I do not. I know that there are yorkies out there that are beautiful, come from beautiful lines and fit the standard perfectly. If you're going to do something, do it right. Don't just do it because you think you're yorkie is cute. JMHO

EXCELLENT way to put it and I agree with this 100% - IF someone is going to do something - DO IT RIGHT.... and way to go Kimberly for a great way of saying this.

Olivier · 12-16-2005, 06:38 AM

All my pet quality puppies are sold spayed or neutered . The future owners know they will not have the opportunity to breed them .

BamaFan121s · 12-16-2005, 06:44 AM

Do I think standards should be followed when breeding?--Yes, I do. However, how do you define 'standard?' A dog that meets weight, color, coat or a dog that is purely show quality? Trixie is a standard Yorkie, no flaws...at least not that we or our vet can find, yet she is not a 'show dog.' Even breeders who have show dogs and breed to produce show dogs will have pups in the litter that will not be 'show quality,' and are hence labeled 'pets.' Not even the most experienced show breeders are going to have litters where EVERY pup meets show requirements. So in a sense of looking at it, even show breeders breed for 'pets' too.

flyorkies · 12-16-2005, 07:44 AM

Im not a breeder. I feel that as a purchaser of two yorkies I would rather have a garentee that when i spend lots of hard earned money that im getting a close replica of the breed standard. I will not breed my yorkies we have an appointment for monday to have my female spayed. Truthfully i spent alot of money on her and i thought i did my research. well then i found yorkie talk and did post some pics i got good honest answers and found that both of my yorkies as cute and loving as they are should not be bred due to haveing too many non standard features. so here i am i have two great yorkies wich is great i love them to death. Now im still researching still reading everyday but ive come to find out that unfortunitly almost every yorkie i see around here is not breed standard. i can now pick out a roach back, hair color and quality, height, weight and their snout size. a lot of people have yorkies here in florida and like i said none of them look like breed standard. So when i look in the news paper and see atleast 4 adds per week" yorkies for sale, teacups, champion lines." none of them say pet quality. Then you have someone that comes along maybe new to the breed and wants one because they have seen someone elses cute yorkie. They are in a way being scammed and contributing to bad breeding situations, im sorry to say most people will not tell you that you are only getting pet quality yorkies. I think this may be the "back yard breeder". I feel there is only like a hand full of honest breeders. I give good breeders alot of credit for striving for breed standard. see I obviously bought my dogs from back yard breeders not knowing it at the time . They both came with full registrations and i was told they would be great breeders because there parents were so perfect. i felt hey spend a little more maybe someday i will breed them. Plainly saying i just wanted that open option at the time. well once agian if i knew more i would have spent the money to have a good representation of the yorkie breed. I think too many people are breeding yorkies that arent standard. Great pets but if you want a dog that looks like mine again as cute as they are then you might as well put your money towards a better cause and adopt from a rescue. This will help wein out those breeders that are just doing it for the money breeding anything they have.As far as people that have acidental litters most of those people tell you that when your buying the puppy and if there honest they wont charge 1000 dollars and upwards. so nothing agiast them. All of those puppies should be spayed or neutered. I guess what im saying is i dont agree with breeding unless you are going to strive for breed stadard only because in my eyes it is ruining the breed and allowing yorkies to become preyed upon by money greedy people that want to make a quick buck. Sorry for the length. Didnt relize i had so much to say.

dawneo · 12-16-2005, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

Do I think standards should be followed when breeding?--Yes, I do. However, how do you define 'standard?'

The standard states nothing as to show standard. It's written as the toy breed yorkshire terrier standard. For any breeder to follow any other standard or claim there are two standards is pure nonsense.

txshopper73 · 12-16-2005, 08:06 AM

Most of the yorkies you see in the papers are pet yorkies. But to call someone a BYB is not right...IMO. I know that you stated your opinion and you're perfectly entitled to do that. However, BYB is a strong word and unless you go and inspect the area, you shouldn't label anyone that.

Now, if you were to be guaranteed that the yorkie you bought would be show potential or show quality and you get a pet quality, then you have every reason to be ticked. A good breeder would not guarantee that until the pup was much older. However, the average people that are looking for yorkies aren't necessarily looking for a show potential dog. They are looking for pets and that's what they get...especially at pet prices.

BamaFan121s · 12-16-2005, 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dawneo

The standard states nothing as to show standard. It's written as the toy breed yorkshire terrier standard. For any breeder to follow any other standard or claim there are two standards is pure nonsense.

OK...let me clarify. When I say 'I think standards should be followed,' I am referring to standards such as size, 4-7 lbs, not to get a 'smaller yorkie.' I don't mean 2 standards: pet and show. I personally consider show dogs to be at the best looking end of the Yorkie spectrum. Therefore, my question was...if the show dogs truly represent the best of the breed, should they be the only ones bred, even though there are non-show dogs that meet standard as well?

12-16-2005, 03:58 AM	#1
SnowWa YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: USA Posts: 2,992	Who should breed Yorkies? I am a little confused as far as breeding goes. I believe in improving and maintaining the standards of every breed, and am becoming more familiar with many of you who are serious breeders. You have a real passion for breeding. You select and purchase very fine animals, breed them carefully, care for them wonderfully, and whelp litters that are as near the Yorkie standards as possible. You strive for perfection. And there are people (not breeders in the true sense of the word) who have a pet Yorkie or two (average animals) breed them, care for them very well, and sell them to many of us who are dying to have a Yorkie for a pet. I am describing two very different types of breeders. One who has the understanding, education, and passion to strive for the very best. The other who loves their pet(s), breeds them, and sends them off to loving homes to be pets. I believe there is something inherently difficult in breeding Yorkies. I have yet to see a breed that varies as much as the Yorkie. The AKC weight standard is 5 to 7 lbs, and I have seen Yorkies from 2 to 14 pounds. The standard for coloring is especially confusing - but apart from the standard, look at all the different colors there are. This has nothing to do with the standards, but the way different people maintain their Yorkies (haircuts especially) can cause them to look like totally different breeds. And - leave it to the Yorkie to be loved and adored no matter what size, shape, color, or haircut it has. Price?? Should we talk about price when we talk about breeders. I think so. There certainly is usually a difference in the quality of puppies that are produced by the serious breeders compared to the backyard (I hate this term) breeders. So, for those of us who care about the difference, we should be willing to pay more for higher quality Yorkies. (I didn't say more loveable - they are all adorable and loveable.) I just mean higher quality in terms of meeting the standards of the breed. I have stated before that I have the cutest little guy, but I wouldn't breed him. I think he has too many faults. He may get too big, his ears may be too large. His legs might be a little too long, and his coat leaves a lot to be desired. Of course, all my friends say, "Why don't you breed him?" Well - you and I know why. But he is perfect for me because I wanted a pet. I suppose this happens with all breeds. So many people want their dogs bred and want to have a litter of puppies. But even with the best intentions and wonderful care, and a lot of love, I don't suppose this is always a good thing. But -- if only the very professional breeders bred dogs, I think they would be too expensive for most people, and there wouldn't be enough to go around. We can't all have or want a show dog. Most of us want a pet. I think my post makes no sense at all. I'm not even sure what I'm trying to ask. I guess I am just asking about Yorkies and who should be breeding them. I wonder how some of you feel about this. I am not talking about puppy mills, bad breeders, or anything like that. We all know where we stand there. I am referring more to the two types of caring breeders that I have mentioned above. Is it acceptable to breed "pet quality" Yorkies. Can this hurt the breed in the long run. Carol Jean __________________ http://tinypic.com/ipxhmb.jpg A Yorkie is worth a thousand words.

12-16-2005, 05:44 AM	#2
Doggy Bear Senior Yorkie Talker Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Posts: 109	That a serious question. In a french forum we talk a lot about that and sometimes it because emotional. I bought my N'Stein from a breeder who was selling his dogs with no papers and extend his breeding to different breed of dogs . I choose him because it was refered to me by a friend. And the major point because the puppy cost me 450$ instead of 1200$. For the dog I had a budget of 1000$. So I have prefered to put the rest of the money of accessories and vet care (exam, vaccins) for my N'Stein. So my choice was made regarding how come it want to send my budget. Put I also recognize the effort that reels breeders put in breeding dogs that meet the standard. __________________ N'Stein - male, 5 years old.....5 pds. Small but adorable and sometimes stubborn has a Yorkie can be.

12-16-2005, 05:45 AM	#3
txshopper73 Donating YT 14K Club Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 14,226 Blog Entries: 1	Carol Jean, your thread makes perfect sense. I don't approve of the breeder that says they want to breed because their furbaby "is just so cute!" Then, when you look at the pictures they've posted or pictures in their avatar, they have down ears, or long faces, out of the breed standard and I've even seen bad bites. I don't understand it and it's disheartening for the breeders that are trying to maintin the breed standard. Do I think that JUST show breeders should breed? No, I do not. I know that there are yorkies out there that are beautiful, come from beautiful lines and fit the standard perfectly. If you're going to do something, do it right. Don't just do it because you think you're yorkie is cute. JMHO __________________ As always...JMO (Just My Opinion) Kimberley

12-16-2005, 06:25 AM	#6
Sherry Lynn Donating YT 3000 Club Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: New Jersey Posts: 3,437	I have one of each, and you're right, there is a BIG difference in their appearance! My husband got Dublin for me from a breeder that was refered to him by someone that he worked with. The breeder/broker got them from her sister who has a farm in Ireland. (I know now about the puppymills in Ireland, but I really don't think thats the case here, because while she sells several breeds, she rarely has pups. Haven't listed Yorkies since I got Dublin in May.) My BYB dog, Dublin, is hearty at over 10lbs (paid more for him because he was supposed to be under 7lb ) has what I guess it would be the teddy bear face. And while he still has a short puppy coat, its thick and dark on the back with gray underneath. His face and legs are a reddish gold. AND he has a bad underbite! My breeder dog,The Widget, is from Sylvan and is a sprite 4+lbs (my adorable WeeMidget!) and has a delicate little face that is more pointed. At a little over a year old her coat is already long fine and very soft and silky. Her back is silver and her face and legs are a beautiful gold. Its like Jethro Bodine meets Morgan Fairchild! While I find them both wonderful, and I adore them both with all of my heart, they are almost like different yet similar breeds... BTW, I paid the same amount for both of them, but Dublin is probably going to cost me more for braces or dental work! Edited to add, I have absolutely no interest in breeding, I just wanted loving companion pets, given that I'd say I succeeded! __________________ Sherry Lynn Dublin and Widget

12-16-2005, 08:06 AM	#14
txshopper73 Donating YT 14K Club Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 14,226 Blog Entries: 1	Most of the yorkies you see in the papers are pet yorkies. But to call someone a BYB is not right...IMO. I know that you stated your opinion and you're perfectly entitled to do that. However, BYB is a strong word and unless you go and inspect the area, you shouldn't label anyone that. Now, if you were to be guaranteed that the yorkie you bought would be show potential or show quality and you get a pet quality, then you have every reason to be ticked. A good breeder would not guarantee that until the pup was much older. However, the average people that are looking for yorkies aren't necessarily looking for a show potential dog. They are looking for pets and that's what they get...especially at pet prices. __________________ As always...JMO (Just My Opinion) Kimberley

12-16-2005, 06:01 AM	#4
Gazou YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Canada Posts: 2,180	JMO.... Peoples should be more careful when they are choosing their Yorkies for breeding . If a breeder sell a pup as pet , this puppy have to be spayed or neutered .

12-16-2005, 06:30 AM	#8
JUDY's2yorkies YT Addict Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Logan Utah Posts: 280	I have to agree to both posts, after raising maltiese and bassetts, I have the attitude that if you are going to breed,meet the standards, yet also there are people out there that are intrested in a pet,but you can still have both, but I think you can have both from the same breeder..on maltese I have had 3lb dogs and 8 lb in the same litter..the 8 lbers would be pets and nuetered before leaving,the 3-5 were sold as optional...both were loved and cared for,but differant kinds of people got them...if your going to raise show,you sell to people that want show..if you have a pet quality everyonece in a while it would go to someone who needs a pet, I really dont think one treads on the other ...but standard should always be the number one rule of thumb..now this is only my oppenion sp,but even in cars you get what you pay for,some want a new mercedes some want a pinto that is 20 years old...to me as long as they can afford the vet costs and have the love needed there will be homes available for all, but then again,rather than breed pet puppies on porpose,lets get all rescues in great homes first

12-16-2005, 06:38 AM	#10
Olivier Donating YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Canada Posts: 2,999	All my pet quality puppies are sold spayed or neutered . The future owners know they will not have the opportunity to breed them .

12-16-2005, 06:44 AM	#11
BamaFan121s Donating YT 10K Club Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Alabama Posts: 11,432	Do I think standards should be followed when breeding?--Yes, I do. However, how do you define 'standard?' A dog that meets weight, color, coat or a dog that is purely show quality? Trixie is a standard Yorkie, no flaws...at least not that we or our vet can find, yet she is not a 'show dog.' Even breeders who have show dogs and breed to produce show dogs will have pups in the litter that will not be 'show quality,' and are hence labeled 'pets.' Not even the most experienced show breeders are going to have litters where EVERY pup meets show requirements. So in a sense of looking at it, even show breeders breed for 'pets' too.

12-16-2005, 07:44 AM	#12
flyorkies Senior Yorkie Talker Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: florida Posts: 177	Im not a breeder. I feel that as a purchaser of two yorkies I would rather have a garentee that when i spend lots of hard earned money that im getting a close replica of the breed standard. I will not breed my yorkies we have an appointment for monday to have my female spayed. Truthfully i spent alot of money on her and i thought i did my research. well then i found yorkie talk and did post some pics i got good honest answers and found that both of my yorkies as cute and loving as they are should not be bred due to haveing too many non standard features. so here i am i have two great yorkies wich is great i love them to death. Now im still researching still reading everyday but ive come to find out that unfortunitly almost every yorkie i see around here is not breed standard. i can now pick out a roach back, hair color and quality, height, weight and their snout size. a lot of people have yorkies here in florida and like i said none of them look like breed standard. So when i look in the news paper and see atleast 4 adds per week" yorkies for sale, teacups, champion lines." none of them say pet quality. Then you have someone that comes along maybe new to the breed and wants one because they have seen someone elses cute yorkie. They are in a way being scammed and contributing to bad breeding situations, im sorry to say most people will not tell you that you are only getting pet quality yorkies. I think this may be the "back yard breeder". I feel there is only like a hand full of honest breeders. I give good breeders alot of credit for striving for breed standard. see I obviously bought my dogs from back yard breeders not knowing it at the time . They both came with full registrations and i was told they would be great breeders because there parents were so perfect. i felt hey spend a little more maybe someday i will breed them. Plainly saying i just wanted that open option at the time. well once agian if i knew more i would have spent the money to have a good representation of the yorkie breed. I think too many people are breeding yorkies that arent standard. Great pets but if you want a dog that looks like mine again as cute as they are then you might as well put your money towards a better cause and adopt from a rescue. This will help wein out those breeders that are just doing it for the money breeding anything they have.As far as people that have acidental litters most of those people tell you that when your buying the puppy and if there honest they wont charge 1000 dollars and upwards. so nothing agiast them. All of those puppies should be spayed or neutered. I guess what im saying is i dont agree with breeding unless you are going to strive for breed stadard only because in my eyes it is ruining the breed and allowing yorkies to become preyed upon by money greedy people that want to make a quick buck. Sorry for the length. Didnt relize i had so much to say.