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-   -   Question about coat color (https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/yorkie-showing-information/223389-question-about-coat-color.html)

BiewerDiva 03-06-2011 06:37 PM
2 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjh (Post 3452620)
You said your girl has a lot of champions in her pedigree. Do you know what her lines are and what generation the champions start?
Okay, I've got some info - Pepper's (and new dog, JayJay) sire's name is "JOJO"

JoJo's sire is Ch. Heavenly's Father Abraham and he has 19 total champions in 4 gen (I think it's 4 gen)

JoJo's Dam's SIRE is Exmoor's Exuberant and has 41 total champions 4 gen.

So, the champions start as early as the grandparents. I found a few pictures of Exmoor's Exuberant and Father Abraham - I'm sure you've seen them already, but it fills me with pride everytime I see them. I've got stars in my eyes. :wink:

TexasKat08 03-06-2011 06:53 PM
From what I understand, you are looking only 3 generations back, as that is where all the genetics come from. Mary?

Mardelin 03-06-2011 07:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BiewerDiva (Post 3453059)
Thank you for the tip! This would be perfect.
Remember show dogs are born but, you have to able to bring out that Champion in them. They must have that not afraid of the devil, outgoing attitude. If you don't have that, you could have the most beautifully structured dog in the world and if you have to drag it around the ring, with it tucking it's croup....doesn't make for a pretty picture.

Mardelin 03-06-2011 08:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasKat08 (Post 3453197)
From what I understand, you are looking only 3 generations back, as that is where all the genetics come from. Mary?
Yes, the first 3 generations. Dam and Sire contribute 50%, Grandsire and Granddam 25% and Great Grandsire and Great Granddam 12%. That is unless you have one particular great dog repeated throughout the pedigree repeatedly.

One also has to consider if the dog comes from a long line of unbroken Champions on both sides from strong pedigrees.

Mardelin 03-06-2011 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BiewerDiva (Post 3453183)
Okay, I've got some info - Pepper's (and new dog, JayJay) sire's name is "JOJO"

JoJo's sire is Ch. Heavenly's Father Abraham and he has 19 total champions in 4 gen (I think it's 4 gen)

JoJo's Dam's SIRE is Exmoor's Exuberant and has 41 total champions 4 gen.

So, the champions start as early as the grandparents. I found a few pictures of Exmoor's Exuberant and Father Abraham - I'm sure you've seen them already, but it fills me with pride everytime I see them. I've got stars in my eyes. :wink:
Exmoor/Jim Hupp and Brett Walker have excellent lines. I'm not very familiar with Heavenly lines, but they also come from Exmoor.

It's very important that a breeder knows how to continue on how to breed those lines correctly to continue breeding great dogs.

BiewerDiva 03-06-2011 08:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mardelin (Post 3453279)
Exmoor/Jim Hupp and Brett Walker have excellent lines. I'm not very familiar with Heavenly lines, but they also come from Exmoor.

It's very important that a breeder knows how to continue on how to breed those lines correctly to continue breeding great dogs.
I have so enjoyed yours and bjh's wisdom. Thank you so much for your patience. I suppose in the first three generations she has altogether 4, equaling ... 74%? (In the words of Charlie Sheen .. WINNING DUH!) We'll see how she turns out.

I will stop harassing for now. Once again, thank you for all your knowledge. I really appreciate it.
-----------------------------------------------
Grandsire: Ch. Heavenly's Father Abraham

Grandsire: Exmoor's Exuberant
Great Grandsire: Am/Can Ch. Durrer's High Falutin
Great Granddam: Ch. Exmoor's Elixir

Mardelin 03-06-2011 08:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BiewerDiva (Post 3453316)
I have so enjoyed yours and bjh's wisdom. Thank you so much for your patience. I suppose in the first three generations she has altogether 4, equaling ... 74%? (In the words of Charlie Sheen .. WINNING DUH!) We'll see how she turns out.

I will stop harassing for now. Once again, thank you for all your knowledge. I really appreciate it.
-----------------------------------------------
Grandsire: Ch. Heavenly's Father Abraham

Grandsire: Exmoor's Exuberant
Great Grandsire: Am/Can Ch. Durrer's High Falutin
Great Granddam: Ch. Exmoor's Elixir
Don't think of it as harassing, but attempting to learn. It's a long hard journey, but worth it.

If you decide to show, have fun. But, keep in mind the AKC definition of why we show "To Gain Approval of Our Breeding Stock". So, if you decide to breed, not only is the temperament and a good representation of the breed is important. But, first and foremost is the health....so, don't forget about the required testing.

FlDebra 03-06-2011 11:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasKat08 (Post 3452528)
I'm not an exhibitor, but I also noticed her tail is down. I wonder just how accurate that eye shine theory is. My Nicco also shines blue/green and he is cottony coated. I look forward to watching your progress with her! I'm also going to my first show - this Friday in San Antonio! Can't wait!
All new puppies have a bluish eye shine so this concept works as the pup gets a little older. The only picture in your album that I saw with eye shine had a very yellow eye shine and I would guess cotton coat although some of the yellow/gold do wind up modified as BJH mentioned, it would be unusual to be truly silky with this color eye shine. Pictures sometimes do not show correct eye shine. Some of the new camera features to reduce red eye distort pup eye shine color. You can take them outside at night and shine a flashlight at them to see true eye shine color if you think your camera might be changing the reflected color.

The eye shine idea has worked 100% for me with all of my yorkies. If someone says their dog does not match the eye shine concept, it is usually due to camera distortion or them not understanding what true silky and cottony coats are all about. These are actually genetically-linked characteristics -- that explains why this is so -- it is no wives' tale but actual science.

BiewerDiva 03-07-2011 04:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mardelin (Post 3453327)
Don't think of it as harassing, but attempting to learn. It's a long hard journey, but worth it.

If you decide to show, have fun. But, keep in mind the AKC definition of why we show "To Gain Approval of Our Breeding Stock". So, if you decide to breed, not only is the temperament and a good representation of the breed is important. But, first and foremost is the health....so, don't forget about the required testing.
Testing .. which testing should I have done? Bile, Patella, am I missing anything? Thank you for that suggestion, I hadn't thought of that. I am not 100% sure I want to do any breeding. That wasn't my original intent. I'll cross that bridge when I get there, but my interest in this started because I wanted to get involved in something super special, and of course Yorkies are always going to be my top choice.

Mardelin 03-07-2011 05:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BiewerDiva (Post 3453462)
Testing .. which testing should I have done? Bile, Patella, am I missing anything? Thank you for that suggestion, I hadn't thought of that. I am not 100% sure I want to do any breeding. That wasn't my original intent. I'll cross that bridge when I get there, but my interest in this started because I wanted to get involved in something super special, and of course Yorkies are always going to be my top choice.
Bile Acids, CERF, OFA, Temperament Testing, etc.

Showing is costly; There is of course the cost of the dog, tests run on the dog, Equipment, traveling expenses.

I suggest that while you are attending shows that you search for your mentor. One that is well versed in everything yorkie. Someone that has the knowledge and strong love for the breed. This person will guide you through everything; Training, nutrition, presenting a dog, what shows to attend, what classes/seminars to attend, teaching you pedigrees, and much, much more.

hugz4all4 03-07-2011 10:58 AM
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjh (Post 3452857)
I think the eye shine can change to some degree as they grow. Like Mary said it is not a proven science. As for myself, I am happier to see the green shine vs the red shine. If if a dog has the green shine, they might have a silky coat but they can still go to light.

Here a picture of my Rebel at 4 months, you can easily see the shine in his eyes.

very cute pup...Tucker is a yorkie mix and his eyes have always reflected green and his coat is cottony...wierd eh?? Must be the yorkie in him..:)

Here he is with my toy poodle..:)

bjh 03-07-2011 12:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hugz4all4 (Post 3453776)
very cute pup...Tucker is a yorkie mix and his eyes have always reflected green and his coat is cottony...wierd eh?? Must be the yorkie in him..:)

Here he is with my toy poodle..:)
Tucker looks like a sweetie. Obviously the green eye shine does not apply to all dogs and all breeds.


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