Prescription Hills D/D Salmon and Potato

[Yorkieluv]

Originally Posted by RLC12345678

barley is a no no for allergies!

That's true...Thanks for pointing that out. I was thinking more along the lines of lower protein so that it's safe for her liver since she has liver issues...
But the recipes in the liver shunt group do not include grains and may be very beneficial to your baby, Debbie. Check them out if you can.

[Yorkieluv]

Originally Posted by MyFairLacy

Although I think Science Diet (Hills) is better than some things (ie. Old Roy, Dog Chow, Cat Chow, etc.), I think there are so many more better foods. I consider it a grocery store brand and in no way a premium brand of pet food. It's loaded with corn, wheat, fillers, biproducts and other crap.

Their adult original dry dog food:
Chicken, Ground Whole Grain Corn, Ground Whole Grain Sorghum, Ground Whole Grain Wheat, Chicken By-Product Meal, Soybean Meal, Animal Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid), Corn Gluten Meal, Brewers Rice, Chicken Liver Flavor, Soybean Oil, Dried Egg Product, Flaxseed, Potassium Chloride, Iodized Salt, Calcium Carbonate, Choline Chloride, Vitamin E Supplement, vitamins (L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), Vitamin E Supplement, Niacin, Thiamine Mononitrate, Vitamin A Supplement, Calcium Pantothenate, Biotin, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Riboflavin, Folic Acid, Vitamin D3 Supplement), minerals (Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Calcium Iodate, Sodium Selenite), DL-Methionine, preserved with Mixed Tocopherols and Citric Acid, Beta-Carotene, Rosemary Extract.

I'm starting vet school in the fall, and I know Hills donates a ton of money to vet schools and The Veterinary Association. They also teach most of the nutrition classes and tell the students that their food is best. And there is not much about nutrition even taught eat vet school. Also, Hills along with other big companies like Purina, Iams, Eukanuba, etc give vets that sell their products huge kick-backs and a lot of free products. Being a vet student, I can get 80% off any Hills or Purina pet foods if I wanted to. No thanks - I would rather keep spending my money on premium foods for my pets. These companies do this to get vet students hooked on their foods so they recommend it to their clients later on. Pretty good marketing ploy huh? Here is an article I found that basically says what I already did.


An article from the Wallstreet journal:
http://www.simplyschnauzer.net/hills.html

A couple quotes from the article that I think are important:

"Borrowing a page from the pharmaceuticals companies, which routinely woo doctors to prescribe their drugs, Hill's has spent a generation cultivating its professional following. It spends hundreds of thousands of dollars a year funding university research and nutrition courses at every one of the 27 U.S. veterinary colleges. Once in practice, vets who sell Science Diet and other premium foods directly from their offices pocket profits of as much as 40%. "

"But the reliance on vet endorsements has its critics. "Consumers think they're getting a better product because veterinarians are recommending it," says Ann Martin, author of a new book, "Foods Pets Die For, " She notes that many pet doctors are "brainwashed into thinking they have to recommend these commercial foods," having been so heavily exposed to them in vet schools. "

Thanks for posting this!! It's very informative, and I agree whole heartedly...I don't like Hill's products...Their u/d which is supposed to help with ammonium urate stones contains pork liver, which is terrible for a dog with those kinds of stones...The dry foods particularly l/d and k/d which are given to dogs with liver and kidney problems contain BHA/BHT/ethoxyquin( I don't know if it's all of them, but I know at least a few of them do) which are bad in general, but particularly bad for a dog with a compromised liver....

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by MyFairLacy

Although I think Science Diet (Hills) is better than some things (ie. Old Roy, Dog Chow, Cat Chow, etc.), I think there are so many more better foods. I consider it a grocery store brand and in no way a premium brand of pet food. It's loaded with corn, wheat, fillers, biproducts and other crap.

Their adult original dry dog food:
Chicken, Ground Whole Grain Corn, Ground Whole Grain Sorghum, Ground Whole Grain Wheat, Chicken By-Product Meal, Soybean Meal, Animal Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid), Corn Gluten Meal, Brewers Rice, Chicken Liver Flavor, Soybean Oil, Dried Egg Product, Flaxseed, Potassium Chloride, Iodized Salt, Calcium Carbonate, Choline Chloride, Vitamin E Supplement, vitamins (L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), Vitamin E Supplement, Niacin, Thiamine Mononitrate, Vitamin A Supplement, Calcium Pantothenate, Biotin, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Riboflavin, Folic Acid, Vitamin D3 Supplement), minerals (Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Calcium Iodate, Sodium Selenite), DL-Methionine, preserved with Mixed Tocopherols and Citric Acid, Beta-Carotene, Rosemary Extract.

I'm starting vet school in the fall, and I know Hills donates a ton of money to vet schools and The Veterinary Association. They also teach most of the nutrition classes and tell the students that their food is best. And there is not much about nutrition even taught eat vet school. Also, Hills along with other big companies like Purina, Iams, Eukanuba, etc give vets that sell their products huge kick-backs and a lot of free products. Being a vet student, I can get 80% off any Hills or Purina pet foods if I wanted to. No thanks - I would rather keep spending my money on premium foods for my pets. These companies do this to get vet students hooked on their foods so they recommend it to their clients later on. Pretty good marketing ploy huh? Here is an article I found that basically says what I already did.


An article from the Wallstreet journal:
http://www.simplyschnauzer.net/hills.html

A couple quotes from the article that I think are important:

"Borrowing a page from the pharmaceuticals companies, which routinely woo doctors to prescribe their drugs, Hill's has spent a generation cultivating its professional following. It spends hundreds of thousands of dollars a year funding university research and nutrition courses at every one of the 27 U.S. veterinary colleges. Once in practice, vets who sell Science Diet and other premium foods directly from their offices pocket profits of as much as 40%. "

"But the reliance on vet endorsements has its critics. "Consumers think they're getting a better product because veterinarians are recommending it," says Ann Martin, author of a new book, "Foods Pets Die For, " She notes that many pet doctors are "brainwashed into thinking they have to recommend these commercial foods," having been so heavily exposed to them in vet schools. "

I just bought this book food pets die for- can't wait to dig into it and learn more - very informative info - I am going to print out and fax to my derm to go over on wednesday - she is very open to the info i provide her - thanks for your help

[nvnvgirl]

My Max was put on Hill's WD (he had pancreatitis and the vet said he was overweight, which is why he was put on a prescription weight loss food)....he hasn't had ANY problems since he started on it. He gets both the canned and the dry and yes, they told me that most dog foods say to feed them too much. Max would eat as much as I gave him, but he's to get only 1/3 cup a day....that's not very much it seems! But they are small, and you have to think about how small their stomach must be!

And it's not expensive at all. Before, I was feeding either Royal Canin dry and one of those Cesar wet food containers a day (divided into two feedings) and it cost me more to do that than what I'm paying now for the dry and canned Hills.


But I'm open/curious; what would be a better quality low calorie food instead of the Hill's WD? I just don't ever want to have to leave Max at the vets' over the weekend on IV's . that was horrible!

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by nvnvgirl

My Max was put on Hill's WD (he had pancreatitis and the vet said he was overweight, which is why he was put on a prescription weight loss food)....he hasn't had ANY problems since he started on it. He gets both the canned and the dry and yes, they told me that most dog foods say to feed them too much. Max would eat as much as I gave him, but he's to get only 1/3 cup a day....that's not very much it seems! But they are small, and you have to think about how small their stomach must be!

And it's not expensive at all. Before, I was feeding either Royal Canin dry and one of those Cesar wet food containers a day (divided into two feedings) and it cost me more to do that than what I'm paying now for the dry and canned Hills.


But I'm open/curious; what would be a better quality low calorie food instead of the Hill's WD? I just don't ever want to have to leave Max at the vets' over the weekend on IV's . that was horrible!

yeah dexter had pancreatitis and had a plasma transfusion and was hospitalized 3 times - it was horrible and he almost died - he eats purina ha as he cannot tolerate potato now

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by nvnvgirl

My Max was put on Hill's WD (he had pancreatitis and the vet said he was overweight, which is why he was put on a prescription weight loss food)....he hasn't had ANY problems since he started on it. He gets both the canned and the dry and yes, they told me that most dog foods say to feed them too much. Max would eat as much as I gave him, but he's to get only 1/3 cup a day....that's not very much it seems! But they are small, and you have to think about how small their stomach must be!

And it's not expensive at all. Before, I was feeding either Royal Canin dry and one of those Cesar wet food containers a day (divided into two feedings) and it cost me more to do that than what I'm paying now for the dry and canned Hills.


But I'm open/curious; what would be a better quality low calorie food instead of the Hill's WD? I just don't ever want to have to leave Max at the vets' over the weekend on IV's . that was horrible!

how much does yours weigh as dexter is 10lbs and i feed him 3/4 cup a day of purina ha

[nvnvgirl]

Originally Posted by dwerten

how much does yours weigh as dexter is 10lbs and i feed him 3/4 cup a day of purina ha

Max weighs 5 lbs now, give or take a few oz....but when this happened, he weighed 7 lbs . We never really figured out if he actually got into something that made him sick (the place we lived had all sorts of weird stuff under the oleander bushes, and Max found EVERYTHING), or if it was just that he was overweight and that was stressing his pancreas out. All I know is that it was VERY expensive and very upsetting to have my baby so sick.

I previously had been free feeding his dry food, and I'd give him 1/2 of a Cesar container in the am and the other half in the pm. Along with a little scrambled egg whites in the am when I made my breakfast, and when my husband was home on the weekend, Max also got bits of toast and when we went to the Mexican restaurant, instead of his evening Cesar, he'd get some boiled chicken that they made. Max will inhale just about anything I think.
Now, he's only supposed to get 1/3 of a can of the canned stuff a day (or 1/3 cup of the dry) but I have been giving him about 1/6 of a cup of the canned am and pm (so total 1/3 of a can daily), and I put out his dry food too and try to make sure he doesn't eat too much all at once. He does fine if we're getting exercise, but lately it's been so hot and we haven't been walking like we should and I can see he's gained weight; which I'm going to have to start getting out earlier so we don't end up with the same problem again. I feel so badly when I'm eating and he just wants a little taste; he doesn't get chicken anymore b/c the vet told me not to give him any of that stuff anymore, or much of anything other than his regular food. I know it's what's best, but it sure makes me feel lousy sometimes when he's looking at me with those expectant, big brown eyes . I do give him a treat once in a great while when he's really been good (like not begging when I'm eating, LOL), and today I may look for some treats that are low calorie when I go to look for some other stuff for him. I occasionally give him a few bits of apple without the skin on it and sometimes a teensy bit of chicken or bread, but it's not very often. I hope that's ok to give him. He just seems like he's always hungry! Are potatoes not good for them if they've had pancreatitis? Is it b/c they metabolize into sugar? Geeze. so much to learn; I feel like I'm back in nursing school

Dexter weighs 10 lbs and he gets only 3/4 cup a day? Geeze, that doesn't seem like much. I guess some of these foods are high fiber though and more filling. I know that since Max has been on this food, his poops are drier, which is a good thing.

[Yorkieluv]

nvnvgirl, maybe your baby got sick from the oleanders...Oleanders are one of the most poisonous plants that exist. Here's a link...Scroll down to where it says Toxicity. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oleander
That seriously could be the reason your baby was having pancreatitis. The link states that it has been known to be deadly, but that reactions to this plant include: nausea, vomitting, abdominal pain, diarrhea that may or may not contain blood, etc.
I'm glad your baby is doing better though!!

[nvnvgirl]

Originally Posted by Yorkieluv

nvnvgirl, maybe your baby got sick from the oleanders...Oleanders are one of the most poisonous plants that exist. Here's a link...Scroll down to where it says Toxicity. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oleander
That seriously could be the reason your baby was having pancreatitis. The link states that it has been known to be deadly, but that reactions to this plant include: nausea, vomitting, abdominal pain, diarrhea that may or may not contain blood, etc.
I'm glad your baby is doing better though!!

Thanks, Yorkieluv! I knew that oleanders are toxic, and I'm pretty sure that the vet tested for that. But Max didnt' really seem to have any diarrhea or too many other symptoms like that. He just was fine during the morning, but later on, was just not "himself".....and he wouldn't go anywhere near his food...which is VERY unusual for him. So, me being the nurse, was watching him like a hawk, and he hadn't gone to the bathroom that I knew about. So I thought maye he was constipated and gave him some pumpkin. Nothing. Then I figured that he LOVES cottage cheese, so I fed him some of that, and he scarfed it all down. I was relieved at that point...until I went out to the back lawn and found that he'd vomited it all up. Then, it was just him lying on the sofa and he started vomiting some whitish, foamy stuff and it just kept happening. Which is when I took him into the vet. I never noticed him chewing on the oleanders, but I can't really be certain. It's a little aggravating, b/c it would be nice to know if it happened as an accident or if it was a physiological cause .
One other aggravating factor was that Max's sister lived next door at the time, and her owner always wanted me to bring Max over to play with her b/c her other dogs are older and the little girl had nobody to run and play with. The owner also has a huge aviary with exotic birds and also has a couple of cranes that roam the property and flamingoes in a pond.....the point is, they would feed the cranes and flamingoes in large crocks with fresh fruit and veggies and the mixture would sit out in the sun for HOURS....so for all I know, Max got into THAT and that's what did it. Since it was the second time that he wound up sick after being over there, I had to nix his play dates there. For all the help she has, nobody kept an eye on the dogs and she told me that her dogs had been ill after getting into the crocks too . Nice people, just too much on their plate I think.
Wouldn't you know though, that around here, Oleanders are used EVERYWHERE as windbreaks and hedges around properties? A friend of mine told me about a place where they had oleanders planted around a horse corral and one of the horses was of course, eating them......you can imagine what happened .

[Yorkieluv]

Oh no!! That's such a sad story about the horse.

And I totally understand what you mean about his symptoms. It seems like they could be caused by several things. It could have been the oleanders or the neighbors, but it could also just be that he has pancreatitis regardless of those other factors...

How is he doing now??

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by nvnvgirl

Max weighs 5 lbs now, give or take a few oz....but when this happened, he weighed 7 lbs . We never really figured out if he actually got into something that made him sick (the place we lived had all sorts of weird stuff under the oleander bushes, and Max found EVERYTHING), or if it was just that he was overweight and that was stressing his pancreas out. All I know is that it was VERY expensive and very upsetting to have my baby so sick.

I previously had been free feeding his dry food, and I'd give him 1/2 of a Cesar container in the am and the other half in the pm. Along with a little scrambled egg whites in the am when I made my breakfast, and when my husband was home on the weekend, Max also got bits of toast and when we went to the Mexican restaurant, instead of his evening Cesar, he'd get some boiled chicken that they made. Max will inhale just about anything I think.
Now, he's only supposed to get 1/3 of a can of the canned stuff a day (or 1/3 cup of the dry) but I have been giving him about 1/6 of a cup of the canned am and pm (so total 1/3 of a can daily), and I put out his dry food too and try to make sure he doesn't eat too much all at once. He does fine if we're getting exercise, but lately it's been so hot and we haven't been walking like we should and I can see he's gained weight; which I'm going to have to start getting out earlier so we don't end up with the same problem again. I feel so badly when I'm eating and he just wants a little taste; he doesn't get chicken anymore b/c the vet told me not to give him any of that stuff anymore, or much of anything other than his regular food. I know it's what's best, but it sure makes me feel lousy sometimes when he's looking at me with those expectant, big brown eyes . I do give him a treat once in a great while when he's really been good (like not begging when I'm eating, LOL), and today I may look for some treats that are low calorie when I go to look for some other stuff for him. I occasionally give him a few bits of apple without the skin on it and sometimes a teensy bit of chicken or bread, but it's not very often. I hope that's ok to give him. He just seems like he's always hungry! Are potatoes not good for them if they've had pancreatitis? Is it b/c they metabolize into sugar? Geeze. so much to learn; I feel like I'm back in nursing school

Dexter weighs 10 lbs and he gets only 3/4 cup a day? Geeze, that doesn't seem like much. I guess some of these foods are high fiber though and more filling. I know that since Max has been on this food, his poops are drier, which is a good thing.

The vet said give half of what the bag of dog food says to them as they want dogs to over eat to get more food so only half of what bag says and that is what dexter gets. He does not get anything other then his dog food period and it breaks our heart too as he would get all kinds of stuff before but after 10k in hospitalization and watching him so sick i never want to go through this. He was so bad he had to have a plasma transfusion. He was hospitalized 4 times last year and we determined he could not tolerate a potato based diet. Inflammatory Bowel Disease can lead to pancreatitis or a severe pancreatitis can damage the small intestines causing inflammatory bowel disease. We have and allergy girl yorkie and a ibd boy yorkie - not fun at times

I would never feed your little one anything but his dog food as even the hospital said pancreatitis is very expensive to treat and many dogs die from this

Keep me posted