Whinning Yorkie

[matese]

You're saying "THEY" so I assume you have more then one dog. For potty send ONE dog out only, tell the dog what you want him to do, pee-pee or poo-poo (whatever words you call it). If you let out more then one dog, they WILL play. My now passed girl would rather hunt then pee, I had to give the command for what she was outside for. Try letting just one out for say a week (7 days). Dog will be bored without his partner in crime. When that one does his business let the other out alone. Then you can let all your dogs out for play.

[Farleys]

Originally Posted by matese

You're saying "THEY" so I assume you have more then one dog. For potty send ONE dog out only, tell the dog what you want him to do, pee-pee or poo-poo (whatever words you call it). If you let out more then one dog, they WILL play. My now passed girl would rather hunt then pee, I had to give the command for what she was outside for. Try letting just one out for say a week (7 days). Dog will be bored without his partner in crime. When that one does his business let the other out alone. Then you can let all your dogs out for play.

This is great advice! We have 4 dogs and we got each one seperatly.. And while potty training we always took that one out individually. We now can let all 4 out, but if we are in a hurry i still go out and watch to make sure they actually go. And two are 9 years old.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by gemy

Ann I respect you immensely. But are you sure it is just not yourself and your beliefs about crating that has you with three dogs not liking or getting used to crating. You don't as far as I understand believe in crating. Well I do for a whole host of reasons. All and I repeat all of my dogs have open crates that they frequently go into on their own for what ever reason (s) they decide. They all travel in the car in crates = great stuff at the end of car travel, Nobody barks n whines while travelling. How ever when we get to the lake or the park - wow we have a lot of vocalization. I do believe dogs will reflect your own beliefs..

You seem to want to guide this person to giving up on their dog and their commitment rather than help them to find a way through. JMO

No, I don't believe it's me. I followed my dogs' lead on crates...they're the ones who taught me about crates and being confined. When you put a living being in a confined space that basically fits them just so - and they proceed to cry and go nuts - that tells me to evaluate whether or not it is fair/right/ethical to *force* them into that confined space. I wish mine were okay w/ a crate, but they're not. Wylie especially doesn't do well w/ confined spaces - he once chewed through a baby gate - I kid you not!

I hear of so many people here on YT (this OP included) FORCING their dogs into tight confined spaces - meanwhile being able to hear their dog's cries even from outside the house ---> and then they just keep doing it to them. Why is that okay, for goodness sake...? Bc it's convenient for us? Bc at the end of the day, that's really why most people do it/force it - convenience. For me, convenience takes a back seat when an animal hates being tightly confined.

I personally don't find it okay to do things to animals that causes them *extreme* distress. I feel that across the board, with all animals. If someone is causing extreme distress to an animal, then stop, and find another way. There is no good reason to cause extreme distress to an innocent, vulnerable animal who is at your mercy for their care.

For dogs who happen to do fine/well w/ crates - all power to you, go for it! However, if a dog cannot handle tight confinement...then no, I do not believe in tight confinement in those cases.

[Farleys]

For me, crating never had to do with convenience. It had to do with training, and for their own safety. there will be times, at the vet clinic for example.. if your dog is ill it will have to stay in a kennel. For a well adjusted kennel trained dog this makes a stay at the vet far far less stressful. Same for if your dog ever has to have surgery, when you bring them home they often have to be kept confined, a kennel trained dog is easy to do this with. Because at some point in our lives there will be a time when we cant be right there with our dog. And none of their kennels are anywhere near a "tight" space. ITs just a safe space to put them in when Needed! They are so well adjusted I have never had any troubles with separation anxiety. I start kennel training from the day I get a dog. My black lab does not even use a kennel now. But I still kennel trained him when he first came home. But for the times he has had to be at the vet clinic, I was sure thankful that he is comfortable with a kennel.
My cousins little dog was never kennel trained and when he got sick last year and had to have a lot of treatment at the vet he was under sooo much distress it was awful!!! Being in a kennel was the worst part for him. If he had been kennel trained it would have been far less stress on him.
I believe if started early any dog can be trained to like a kennel.

[ladyjane]

Originally Posted by Farleys

Maybe she is just being kept in a kennel too much. They have alot of energy to burn. I am for kennel training. All 4 of mine are well kennel trained and go in easily by themselves.
But they are only in when needed!
Have you been giving her lots of play time? To tire her out?

I love this post! Puppies need lots of exercise!

The only thing is that I actually have had pups who never adjusted to crates. Dogs, just like humans, are individuals.

Crating as a whole is not necessarily a bad thing if used properly... BUT, that said, it does not work for every pup. I have seen pups totally flip out when crated and I have seen some who find it a very secure place.

I also would have to ask the OP why, when they are home, is she being crated at another part of the house? She very well may be crated too much.

A pup with severe separation anxiety, in my opinion, should not be crated if it stresses him/her out. There are so many other ways to deal with them. Putting them in x-pens can sometimes work, but usually a separate room works better. Even then, they sometimes cannot handle being left. Yes, you can help some to be more secure, but that will not happen unless you have the time to be with them to work through it. To put them anywhere and go out for hours simply will not work out well. I actually know of a story where a pup was left in a crate for 1 hour and she was dead when the people got home. They knew she was horribly stressed when left alone yet they crated her anyway even though she had flipped out in the crate previously. Crate was upside down...poor baby must have stressed herself to the point of dying, It made me sick to my stomach.

My suggestion to the OP is to try to work with this puppy gradually. Perhaps she will adapt to an x-pen better than a crate? Start out leaving her for a few minutes and work up to longer periods. Maybe you should enroll in a training class...for you and her! It would be a fun experience for both of you.

[ladyjane]

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom

No, I don't believe it's me. I followed my dogs' lead on crates...they're the ones who taught me about crates and being confined. When you put a living being in a confined space that basically fits them just so - and they proceed to cry and go nuts - that tells me to evaluate whether or not it is fair/right/ethical to *force* them into that confined space. I wish mine were okay w/ a crate, but they're not. Wylie especially doesn't do well w/ confined spaces - he once chewed through a baby gate - I kid you not!

I hear of so many people here on YT (this OP included) FORCING their dogs into tight confined spaces - meanwhile being able to hear their dog's cries even from outside the house ---> and then they just keep doing it to them. Why is that okay, for goodness sake...? Bc it's convenient for us? Bc at the end of the day, that's really why most people do it/force it - convenience. For me, convenience takes a back seat when an animal hates being tightly confined.

I personally don't find it okay to do things to animals that causes them *extreme* distress. I feel that across the board, with all animals. If someone is causing extreme distress to an animal, then stop, and find another way. There is no good reason to cause extreme distress to an innocent, vulnerable animal who is at your mercy for their care.

For dogs who happen to do fine/well w/ crates - all power to you, go for it! However, if a dog cannot handle tight confinement...then no, I do not believe in tight confinement in those cases.

No, it's not you. As you said, they are individuals. I totally agree with you and won't put my pups through anything that causes extreme distress. They are part of my family and I work with each one to see what works best.

I have pups who love crates and I have one puppy who hates it. She cried and cried and actually learned how to open crates. Once I left her in a room instead of a crate, she was a happy girl. Mind you, I never leave for longer than 5 hours max and that is not often. She just hates crates....I have another who is a foster who runs to a crate when I go out. She is a bit testy with my pups, so I would put her in the bathroom. She actually prefers a crate...when it is her time to be put up, she runs and gets into a crate. I have open crates all over...some love them..some don't.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Farleys

I believe if started early any dog can be trained to like a kennel.

Totally agree on this...IF the individual dog is amenable to the kennel. If not, it's then not the right thing to do for the dog.

Originally Posted by ladyjane

No, it's not you. As you said, they are individuals. I totally agree with you and won't put my pups through anything that causes extreme distress. They are part of my family and I work with each one to see what works best.

I have pups who love crates and I have one puppy who hates it. She cried and cried and actually learned how to open crates. Once I left her in a room instead of a crate, she was a happy girl. Mind you, I never leave for longer than 5 hours max and that is not often. She just hates crates....I have another who is a foster who runs to a crate when I go out. She is a bit testy with my pups, so I would put her in the bathroom. She actually prefers a crate...when it is her time to be put up, she runs and gets into a crate. I have open crates all over...some love them..some don't.

Exactly. If I've learned one thing here at YT, and with my 4 dogs, and volunteering at the shelter so much -- it's that like people, dogs have personalities and preferences and are ALL different. Some will love a kennel, some will hate it, some in between.

And just to show I've never been "against" crating....I'm an adoption counselor at my shelter and one of the things I always cover w/ new adopters is the potential benefit of crating for dogs...I always counsel and recommend on that - BUT, I also always cover that the dog has to be amenable to it.

[ladyjane]

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom

Totally agree on this...IF the individual dog is amenable to the kennel. If not, it's then not the right thing to do for the dog.





Exactly. If I've learned one thing here at YT, and with my 4 dogs, and volunteering at the shelter so much -- it's that like people, dogs have personalities and preferences and are ALL different. Some will love a kennel, some will hate it, some in between.

And just to show I've never been "against" crating....I'm an adoption counselor at my shelter and one of the things I always cover w/ new adopters is the potential benefit of crating for dogs...I always counsel and recommend on that - BUT, I also always cover that the dog has to be amenable to it.

This is why I love rescue. We get a chance to get to know the pups and their individual needs prior to placing them. That really does help to get a perfect fit. I have found that if you find what works for a pup, it will also work for the family.

You simply cannot rubber stamp them.

I am working on an adoption right now for a pup who has been the biggest challenge of all my years in rescue. It has taken time ... she has been with me for almost two years...but I am sure this is it! Her perfect home where she will be loved and give love for the rest of her life. Very exciting!

[gemy]

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom

No, I don't believe it's me. I followed my dogs' lead on crates...they're the ones who taught me about crates and being confined. When you put a living being in a confined space that basically fits them just so - and they proceed to cry and go nuts - that tells me to evaluate whether or not it is fair/right/ethical to *force* them into that confined space. I wish mine were okay w/ a crate, but they're not. Wylie especially doesn't do well w/ confined spaces - he once chewed through a baby gate - I kid you not!

I hear of so many people here on YT (this OP included) FORCING their dogs into tight confined spaces - meanwhile being able to hear their dog's cries even from outside the house ---> and then they just keep doing it to them. Why is that okay, for goodness sake...? Bc it's convenient for us? Bc at the end of the day, that's really why most people do it/force it - convenience. For me, convenience takes a back seat when an animal hates being tightly confined.

I personally don't find it okay to do things to animals that causes them *extreme* distress. I feel that across the board, with all animals. If someone is causing extreme distress to an animal, then stop, and find another way. There is no good reason to cause extreme distress to an innocent, vulnerable animal who is at your mercy for their care.

For dogs who happen to do fine/well w/ crates - all power to you, go for it! However, if a dog cannot handle tight confinement...then no, I do not believe in tight confinement in those cases.

No Ann because it is for many reasons the safety of the dog in question. Be they have to go to the vets office - or you have large n small dogs - or you have workmen over - or if you ever want to do performance sports your dog needs to be crated after competing and before competing.

Dogs don't like their nails trimmed - does that mean we do not trim them? Some dogs scream out even when the nail trimming is very mild - so causes extreme distress then we don't do?

Dogs will cry initially in the crate. Certainly Dara did - but now she goes into her crate with bed on her own. When ever she wants to. And she is crated easily when that is necessary ie the door is closed. It is a matter of training just like leash walking and basic obedience commands.

My dogs for safety reasons travel in a crate in the car. And they are more than okay with that for most journeys end in tasty enjoyable outings.

You talk about *forcing* all obedience is I guess in some respect *forcing* a dog to obey commands - many of which are for their safety - which they don't understand. We can call it treat n reward for good behaviour -but in essence we are molding behaviour and calling the shots on what we will accept. Why? Because we know many of those commands could save their life one day. Dogs well socialized trained and adjusted to humans, dogs and other animals say cats that is our duty as dog owners.


there may be the occasional dog that goes continually over time despite training nutso over a crate fine use an expen or a very large crate. You confine a dog in a room or a kitchen that is still confinement!!! They are not free to roam at their will.

So does the dog hate confinement or just the crate is too small for them? If you confine a dog in a kitchen and they go nutso - what then?

I see little difference between a kitchen and or an expen and or a crate - it is all confinement.

[ladyjane]

Originally Posted by gemy

No Ann because it is for many reasons the safety of the dog in question. Be they have to go to the vets office - or you have large n small dogs - or you have workmen over - or if you ever want to do performance sports your dog needs to be crated after competing and before competing.

Dogs don't like their nails trimmed - does that mean we do not trim them? Some dogs scream out even when the nail trimming is very mild - so causes extreme distress then we don't do?

Dogs will cry initially in the crate. Certainly Dara did - but now she goes into her crate with bed on her own. When ever she wants to. And she is crated easily when that is necessary ie the door is closed. It is a matter of training just like leash walking and basic obedience commands.

My dogs for safety reasons travel in a crate in the car. And they are more than okay with that for most journeys end in tasty enjoyable outings.

You talk about *forcing* all obedience is I guess in some respect *forcing* a dog to obey commands - many of which are for their safety - which they don't understand. We can call it treat n reward for good behaviour -but in essence we are molding behaviour and calling the shots on what we will accept. Why? Because we know many of those commands could save their life one day. Dogs well socialized trained and adjusted to humans, dogs and other animals say cats that is our duty as dog owners.


there may be the occasional dog that goes continually over time despite training nutso over a crate fine use an expen or a very large crate. You confine a dog in a room or a kitchen that is still confinement!!! They are not free to roam at their will.

So does the dog hate confinement or just the crate is too small for them? If you confine a dog in a kitchen and they go nutso - what then?

I see little difference between a kitchen and or an expen and or a crate - it is all confinement.

You could include your home in this. There IS a difference....I guess you have never had a pup with a kennel/crate issue. Believe me, once you see one you "get it".

[JasmineNoelle]

Our two fur babies, poodle and yorkie, that we raised from pups we crate trained without any problems. We wanted them crate trained for safety reasons as they arose, i.e. travel, surgery, etc. We keep the door open on the crates in the den and they both enjoy them. They are now 14 and 7. Jasmine, our precious little yorkie, had to have double surgery on each back leg when she was 6. After the surgery she had to stay in a crate for a couple of months. We were very relieved that she was comfortable in her crate at this time.
Our other is a 3 yr. old adorable yorkie which we got at 6 1/2 months. The first time I held her she immediately put her paws around my neck and looked into my eyes. She was and has been mine from then on. When we got her home we could tell from the get-go she had/has separation anxiety (bad). She will NOT got into a crate! We have tried. She will scream forever and thrash. I never really knew a dog could scream or cry until Maggie Mae. We can not leave her in a Hotel....same response. We can confine her to the den....this is where I mostly stay after chores, so it has my scent. We also bought a camper, instead of staying in hotels. I know some people will say this is extreme, but for us it works and our fur babies are a part of our family.
So, some of ours like their crate and one doesn't and it is ok. We just work with it and find a way to accommodate to make all comfortable and it works for us.

[matese]

Cody's prev. owners had him crated ALL day, adults went to work, child went to school. Cody was let out at 4PM. Then hurricane Sandy flooded their home, they had to evacuate, Cody was in a shelter for 16 days, CAGED. He CANNOT be in a crate, he tears at it with his teeth and claws at it to get out. My groomer knows this, I wait for him, it takes one hour to groom him. Vet, when Cody went in for surgery he was there for 4 days, back again for another 3 days, I was told by the techs that cared for him, he did very well.
Crates work well for dogs that will accept them, for a dog like Cody I will never FORCE crate him nor will my groomer, she saw his reaction the first time she groomed him.

[JakeysMama]

This baby would probably do best with someone who wants a constant companion. I couldn't have kids so I have two little dogs, they are with me all the time and when I leave the house, they are fine without being crated, though sometime my Yorkie Jake has little pee accidents, but he usually hits the pee pad.
My other dog is a Maltipoo. They both bark, at people outside, UPS truck, garbage truck, motorcycles etc. it doesn't bother me. I never crate them.

I have a neighbor down the street, he has a Maltese, he keeps her crated all day even though he's retired and home. I don't understand it. And the little dog is mean and hates everyone, but I can't blame her with an owner and life like that.

Maybe just stop taking RV trips, there problem solved.
Or get a good trainer, but if your baby is a talker/barker, it may be part of their personality and you have to love and accept them or give them to someone who will.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by ladyjane

You could include your home in this. There IS a difference....I guess you have never had a pup with a kennel/crate issue. Believe me, once you see one you "get it".

Totally agree.

For me, there is a big difference btwn claw clipping, obedience training etc...vs being confined in a crate. The psychological effects of confinement in a small space is not an imagined thing...in both dogs and humans for that matter. Geesh, they use confinement in small spaces as a method of torture...pretty sure they don't use claw clipping etc for that.

I stand firm by my opinion that confinement to a crate is not for all dogs. I've learned this from experience, not from pulling an idea from thin air.

And like I said, for those dogs who love their crates - wonderful! Keep at it!

[aweitzm1]

My yorkies are crate trained but I don't use it unless they go in their carrier for travel which they love.


They were my first dogs so I nervous about the crate as I felt it was too confining when I was at work all day and then to confine them again when I went to bed. Mine also would not go in there if I was home as they literally follow me around the house and only want to be next to me.


In addition, I felt I got some bad advice from the rescue group as she wanted me to purchase a really big plastic crate for them, which in hindsight was probably too big. They would pee in it all the time. After about a month I ended up just gating them in the kitchen and they prefer that much better.