Two months and still having issues :(

[deonk1]

Originally Posted by Taryn0405

Can you get some canned as well? I know my vet put Giz on Science Diet W/D canned and dry and my vet let me warm up some chicken broth and pour it over the food. This helped it be more appealing.

I wouldn't recommend you do it without asking your vet first.

With regards to asking a vet about IBS, I would track bowl movements, when the happend, what they looked like, how much/little, etc. So you can bring it to your vet.

When your baby had bloodwork, was anything elevated? I see they didn't do an xray which I'm kind of shocked at. I thought an x-ray would be done to simpl rule out a blockage.

It was the canned he refused to eat. I couldn't get dry food yesterday of the Medical, so I got a can, knowing that he needed something to eat for the weekend until I can get to a vet Monday that carries the dry food. At least they have both a canned and dry which are the same formula, so it shouldn't upset him to switch between that.

I have a book that sits next to his toilet system, so I mark down everything now. I track when he eats, exactly how much, how much poop comes out, it's consistency and color. I'm weighing him weekly, and checking his temp periodically. I also have Zantac on hand which I've been instructed to give if he needs some tummy settling. I give him the occasional syringe of pediatric electrolytes too if he's not drinking much and his gums loose color. I record all of this in his "dog log". I also keep track of giving him Hi-Cal too. I've been doing this consistently for 2 weeks, I got tired trying to guess things while at the vet.

In the blood work, the first set, just his white blood cells, which I think the vet said was from bacteria. They went down after being given an antibiotic. The most recent blood test we tested everything, and it all came back normal. I believe she said that one thing, possibly the kidneys or liver (not sure) was off a bit, but she said the second parameter was perfect so it wasn't a sign of anything wrong. Which makes sense, every dog's levels are different, I know he usually has a slightly lower temperature than the range (only by a small decimal and it's consistent when he's healthy).

[BabyGirl Rosie]

Originally Posted by deonk1

Did you do any testing to confirm the IBS? I was told the only way to know for sure was a biopsy, which is too difficult to do on a small dog.

My vet did not do a biopsy on Rosie. He did blood work each time to rule out pancreatis. When her issues continued, she was put on the Science Diet and diagnosed with IBS.

[BabyGirl Rosie]

Originally Posted by Taryn0405

Gizmo is on perscrption food for his stomach issues. It seems to be common in smaller dogs and dogs in general. Many of the holistic and organic dog foods have a very high fat content which can cause belly trouble in even the most well bred dog.

I know there's alot of controversy about vets selling things like Science Diet and they get kick backs from it. But, it's hard for me to reason that theory when they too feed their dog SD. On that note as well, I tried every diet for Gizmo: Raw, Orijen, NB, TOTW, Blue, and the list goes on. He has done so much better on SD then any of those foods. Little to no eye matter, poops well, and literally scarfs his food with no tummy troubles.

I'm not preeching that every owner should put their dog on RC or SD, no. But, I don't think people give it the credit that it deserves. Especially if they don't have a dog that has a sensative stomach.

I'd try the RC, be sure to give it at least 10 days. Because, like you said, you've switched this dogs system 3 times with different food, which can cause more problems if there are GI issues.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Very well said. The EXACT reasons my Rosie stays on Science Diet. It is what works for her and her issues.

[Ellie May]

A clean biopsy rules in IBS (different from IBD). A biopsy with inflammatory cells makes IBD possible. It can be done in small dogs. When symptoms are present, it is sometimes considered best to go ahead with it if they can't be controlled quickly because some scary things can be ruled out this way. And also some intestine cases are treated with prednisone, but on the off chance that a lymphsarcoma is present (highly doubtful), giving pred like this would make chemo less effective. Because it's been going on for so long, this is very very likely not the issue. There are some other serious intestinal problems they can get that can be dx'ed with biopsy, but if bloods are perfect, most vets won't rush into it. And you can do it on small dogs.

The fecal was run out-house?
Lipase/amylase always normal and/or cPL done just in case?
When treating for the bacteria, what drug was given and did it improve symptoms?

[deonk1]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

A clean biopsy rules in IBS (different from IBD). A biopsy with inflammatory cells makes IBD possible. It can be done in small dogs. When symptoms are present, it is sometimes considered best to go ahead with it if they can't be controlled quickly because some scary things can be ruled out this way. And also some intestine cases are treated with prednisone, but on the off chance that a lymphsarcoma is present (highly doubtful), giving pred like this would make chemo less effective. Because it's been going on for so long, this is very very likely not the issue. There are some other serious intestinal problems they can get that can be dx'ed with biopsy, but if bloods are perfect, most vets won't rush into it. And you can do it on small dogs.

The fecal was run out-house?
Lipase/amylase always normal and/or cPL done just in case?
When treating for the bacteria, what drug was given and did it improve symptoms?

I'm not entirely what was done with the fecal sample, I brought in a baggie which I believe they tested (this was at emerge during the first episode) But they kept him for 2 days so it's possible they ran one on a sample they collected. I don't know what the second thing you asked is. I think this is what's frustrating me is some of the vets aren't telling me what they're testing for exactly or what the results mean.

When he came home from emerge during the very first episode he was given metronydazole and liquid Zantac, which worked until it was clear from his system. He got sick about a day after his last dose.

The second eipsode (that night when he got sick again) he came home 2 days later after being on IV's, plus the following: Metronydazole, Panacur, Batril, Fortiflora, and some gastro protectant with 3 very long names. They gave the Panacur as a precaution in case the fecal came back showing something. The Batril and Metro cleared him up for about 2 weeks after his last dose, but when we arrived back home and started to switch his food he got sick again.

He's had the metro once again two weeks ago, and three weeks ago the vet saw him and gave him a shot of something. This most recent batch of issues happened about 1 week after his last dose.

Also about 2.5 weeks ago we discovered he had fleas. He was on Sentinal, because I asked the vet to give me something to cover worms and fleas, and that's what they gave me. No one explained that I should also use a topical, and that Sentinal is just flea birth control. He's now on Revolution, and we wash the bedding every 3 days. The vet admitted that the fleas could have caused some of the above problems. But we don't know how long he's had fleas for, cause we thought his itching was allergies until we found a flea crawling on him. Now we don't know if he has allergies or not.

Sorry for the ramble. Figured I'd give the full story.

[deonk1]

Ugh, food transition doesn't appear to be sitting well. It's only day 2, so I'm going to give it a week before I panic, but he's got pretty bad diarrhoea... I hope it levels out after a day or so, maybe the hard food will help once I get a hold of that tomorrow.

He was super gassy last night, and it was a similar gas from when he used to eat these chicken dental chews... I just hope that's not his tummy saying he's allergic to the chicken in it. If this doesn't sit well I'm calling the vet tomorrow for one more opinion. After that unless she says something brilliant, I'm consulting a new vet.

[BabyGirl Rosie]

Originally Posted by deonk1

Ugh, food transition doesn't appear to be sitting well. It's only day 2, so I'm going to give it a week before I panic, but he's got pretty bad diarrhoea... I hope it levels out after a day or so, maybe the hard food will help once I get a hold of that tomorrow.

He was super gassy last night, and it was a similar gas from when he used to eat these chicken dental chews... I just hope that's not his tummy saying he's allergic to the chicken in it. If this doesn't sit well I'm calling the vet tomorrow for one more opinion. After that unless she says something brilliant, I'm consulting a new vet.

If the pup still has diarrhea I think I would pull the food until you talk to the vet. Mine always suggests that so the tummy can "rest". Still give water of course. I know many don't like Science Diet, but why don't you ask about the Science Diet I/D. It really works for Rosie and her IBS. Just a suggestion. I would call the vet as soon as you can. Sending prayers and hugs for your little one. Keep us updated.

[Taryn0405]

I agree. If this is IBS or sensative tummy, SD seems to be what my dogs have done good on. Cammie was on I/D for a form of acid reflux and Giz is on W/D...

I'm not a vet, but maybe some white rice would do good by his belly tonight. That and some canned pumpkin.

[BabyGirl Rosie]

Originally Posted by Taryn0405

I agree. If this is IBS or sensative tummy, SD seems to be what my dogs have done good on. Cammie was on I/D for a form of acid reflux and Giz is on W/D...

I'm not a vet, but maybe some white rice would do good by his belly tonight. That and some canned pumpkin.

Pumpkin can do wonders! I know from previous experience! BTW, isn't it you that freezes it? I need to know what you do?

[Taryn0405]

Originally Posted by BabyGirl Rosie

Pumpkin can do wonders! I know from previous experience! BTW, isn't it you that freezes it? I need to know what you do?

We put it in a microwavable tupperware container and freeze it. That way, since we get it organic, it still has a shelf life for emergencies.

[deonk1]

Originally Posted by BabyGirl Rosie

If the pup still has diarrhea I think I would pull the food until you talk to the vet. Mine always suggests that so the tummy can "rest". Still give water of course. I know many don't like Science Diet, but why don't you ask about the Science Diet I/D. It really works for Rosie and her IBS. Just a suggestion. I would call the vet as soon as you can. Sending prayers and hugs for your little one. Keep us updated.

Ok well he's feeling worse.. so I'm pulling the food. I noticed last night he was SUPER gassy, which smelled similar to his gas last time he ate a dental chew (which contained chicken). I've ruled that this food ISN'T going to work, cause of the chicken. He's his health has declined since he's been on this food.

My vet only sells the Medical (RC) and I don't see her suggesting SD, only because she's very closed minded. I'm still considering it but really don't know which to choose, only that it MUST NOT have any chicken in it.

I talked to someone today who told me about their little yorkie who had IBS which was caused from allergies. They told me the foods that their little girl couldn't eat and what food they selected. The dog she described sounded identical to Harley. They told me that they did 2 years of trial and error until they found this food. I'm considering trying this one, but am now really confused. I'm mad cause I trusted the vet and now she's made him sicker.

I don't know what to do now. My gut is telling me to try this food by Versus. My brain is saying call the vet... but I don't trust her anymore.

[deonk1]

Originally Posted by Taryn0405

I agree. If this is IBS or sensative tummy, SD seems to be what my dogs have done good on. Cammie was on I/D for a form of acid reflux and Giz is on W/D...

I'm not a vet, but maybe some white rice would do good by his belly tonight. That and some canned pumpkin.

I'm torn whether to give him pumpkin, because he's never had it before. I've heard it does good, but seeing my goal was to only give him one thing and one thing only, I'm scared to try it. He's had rice before, doesn't like it much, but I think I'm going to fast him for the night anyway, and let his tummy clear.

My poor boy.

[BabyGirl Rosie]

Originally Posted by deonk1

Ok well he's feeling worse.. so I'm pulling the food. I noticed last night he was SUPER gassy, which smelled similar to his gas last time he ate a dental chew (which contained chicken). I've ruled that this food ISN'T going to work, cause of the chicken. He's his health has declined since he's been on this food.

My vet only sells the Medical (RC) and I don't see her suggesting SD, only because she's very closed minded. I'm still considering it but really don't know which to choose, only that it MUST NOT have any chicken in it.

I talked to someone today who told me about their little yorkie who had IBS which was caused from allergies. They told me the foods that their little girl couldn't eat and what food they selected. The dog she described sounded identical to Harley. They told me that they did 2 years of trial and error until they found this food. I'm considering trying this one, but am now really confused. I'm mad cause I trusted the vet and now she's made him sicker.

I don't know what to do now. My gut is telling me to try this food by Versus. My brain is saying call the vet... but I don't trust her anymore.

This is only my opinion. But if you don't trust your vet any more than it is time for a new one. To me, trust in your vet is vital. Do you have an ER vet you could go to? If he is that much worse I think a vet visit is imperative at this point. I am so sorry you are dealing with all this. It is hard I know. If you have the organic pumpkin I think you would be ok if you give a teaspoon or so. It really does help my Rosie girl.

[deonk1]

Originally Posted by BabyGirl Rosie

This is only my opinion. But if you don't trust your vet any more than it is time for a new one. To me, trust in your vet is vital. Do you have an ER vet you could go to? If he is that much worse I think a vet visit is imperative at this point. I am so sorry you are dealing with all this. It is hard I know. If you have the organic pumpkin I think you would be ok if you give a teaspoon or so. It really does help my Rosie girl.

Sadly I trust the ER vets less. They have recently done a few things that were really wrong and really dangerous with a friend of mine's yorkie. The dog nearly died because the vets do not specialize in small dogs (or have common sense as it appears). Their choices were terrible. It's a bit lawsuit battle now.

I'm in the process of shopping for a new vet that I put my trust in, but feel it's useless to throw my money away on consulting another vet until I know I want to stick with them (I've run out of insurance money and my emergency fund). Can you see why I'm frustrated and confused. I don't know who to trust anymore, and I'm not knowledgable enough to make decisions.

I don't think he's at a point that the vet can do anything for him, other than send him home with recommendations for food, so I'm going to try the pumpkin and stabalize him. (I've gotten good at that sadly). I've got a bit of Zantac, so I'm going to give him that too. That'll buy me time to pick my next choice in food. If he gets worse even still, well then I'll have to bite the bullet tomorrow and take him in.

I feel like I'm back at my mom's barn where we had 3 vets refuse to travel to us (they were too far away for emergency response) so we had to learn all the equine first aid ourself. I thought I'd be able to find a vet I trust in the city but I guess I was wrong.

[BabyGirl Rosie]

Originally Posted by deonk1

Sadly I trust the ER vets less. They have recently done a few things that were really wrong and really dangerous with a friend of mine's yorkie. The dog nearly died because the vets do not specialize in small dogs (or have common sense as it appears). Their choices were terrible. It's a bit lawsuit battle now.

I'm in the process of shopping for a new vet that I put my trust in, but feel it's useless to throw my money away on consulting another vet until I know I want to stick with them (I've run out of insurance money and my emergency fund). Can you see why I'm frustrated and confused. I don't know who to trust anymore, and I'm not knowledgable enough to make decisions.

I don't think he's at a point that the vet can do anything for him, other than send him home with recommendations for food, so I'm going to try the pumpkin and stabalize him. (I've gotten good at that sadly). I've got a bit of Zantac, so I'm going to give him that too. That'll buy me time to pick my next choice in food. If he gets worse even still, well then I'll have to bite the bullet tomorrow and take him in.

I feel like I'm back at my mom's barn where we had 3 vets refuse to travel to us (they were too far away for emergency response) so we had to learn all the equine first aid ourself. I thought I'd be able to find a vet I trust in the city but I guess I was wrong.

That is just terrible. I don't trust the ER vets as much as my regular vet but I can not even imagine not trusting my regular vet. That is a hard call. I hope Ladyjane sees this thread and can give you some advice. As far as right now, I would pull the food and let the pup's tummy rest. I would be glad to send you some of the I/D food to sample if you would like. Just PM me. I have can and dry both. I am just not sure if it has chicken in it or not. But we could find out. It really has worked for Rosie. Also, do not give treats or anything else. I do understand your frustrations. I don't know anything about the Zantac. Hopefully someone here will have some experience with that as well. It will be very important that the pup does not get dehydrated. Is Harley drinking water? Keep a check on his gums to make sure. Again, I am so sorry. I would start looking for a new vet ASAP!