Anyone have advice on vaccine allergies?

[ladyjane]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Since the likelihood of reaction increasing after 2-3 vaccines, I'd be extremely nervous to give her anymore at all. Next time, full blown anaphylaxia and even death are possible. She should absolutely be premedicated before vaccines now (should have been after the first reaction), but that may not be enough. It is a very tough call and I'm sorry you have to make it. I would lean towards stopping altogether, but since there wouldn't be a one year booster for DHP and no more rabies, she may end up needing to be an indoor girl (could do titers to see if the pup vaccines "took", but that is really no guarantee that the one year booster can safely be skipped).

And while it may be a preservative bothering her, I'd be concerned that she reacted to DHP and rabies. While I don't want to scare you, personally I'd bile acids test her. That is in no way saying that she has a problem, but Yorkies with liver problems tend to not do well with drugs... Since it's so common in the breed and she reacted to more than one vaccine, it may be worth checking.

[bribunny]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Since the likelihood of reaction increasing after 2-3 vaccines, I'd be extremely nervous to give her anymore at all. Next time, full blown anaphylaxia and even death are possible. She should absolutely be premedicated before vaccines now (should have been after the first reaction), but that may not be enough. It is a very tough call and I'm sorry you have to make it. I would lean towards stopping altogether, but since there wouldn't be a one year booster for DHP and no more rabies, she may end up needing to be an indoor girl (could do titers to see if the pup vaccines "took", but that is really no guarantee that the one year booster can safely be skipped).

And while it may be a preservative bothering her, I'd be concerned that she reacted to DHP and rabies. While I don't want to scare you, personally I'd bile acids test her. That is in no way saying that she has a problem, but Yorkies with liver problems tend to not do well with drugs... Since it's so common in the breed and she reacted to more than one vaccine, it may be worth checking.

She was examined by the vet for all major problems right after I got her from the breeder. Is this something that could come up all of a sudden? The puppy vaccine reactions were what the vet said at the time as "common" symptoms. She had a lump where the vaccine was given for 2.5 weeks and had little appetite. The final puppy vaccine was the same reaction. We had never had any reaction like this. This time she was swollen and sick.

[Ellie May]

Originally Posted by bribunny

She was examined by the vet for all major problems right after I got her from the breeder. Is this something that could come up all of a sudden? The puppy vaccine reactions were what the vet said at the time as "common" symptoms. She had a lump where the vaccine was given for 2.5 weeks and had little appetite. The final puppy vaccine was the same reaction. We had never had any reaction like this. This time she was swollen and sick.

Ok. Then it was probably considered safe not to pre-med. Personally, I'd still have it done. It's just a blood test (right after eating and then two hours later). Symptoms can show, but it's not really something that is usually picked up on in a puppy visit. I'm guessing she will be spayed soon and I'd want to make sure that she is going to be able to metabolize the anesthesia and pain meds properly.

[bribunny]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Ok. Then it was probably considered safe not to pre-med. Personally, I'd still have it done. It's just a blood test (right after eating and then two hours later). Symptoms can show, but it's not really something that is usually picked up on in a puppy visit. I'm guessing she will be spayed soon and I'd want to make sure that she is going to be able to metabolize the anesthesia and pain meds properly.

Okay, thanks! I'll do some research and call and talk to the vet. I may even get another opinion. Not that I don't trust you, I just research everything! I just would hate for her to be sick and not know it. Thank you for bringing this up.

[Ellie May]

Originally Posted by bribunny

Okay, thanks! I'll do some research and call and talk to the vet. I may even get another opinion. Not that I don't trust you, I just research everything! I just would hate for her to be sick and not know it. Thank you for bringing this up.

I actually had my girl tested on the recommendation of a YT member (she had a vaccine reaction also) and she did end up having a problem. If I wouldn't have gotten it done, she would have been subject to drugs that could have really hurt her. So that is why I tell people to consider it.

Be prepared for your vet to tell you it isn't necessary...

[bribunny]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

I actually had my girl tested on the recommendation of a YT member (she had a vaccine reaction also) and she did end up having a problem. If I wouldn't have gotten it done, she would have been subject to drugs that could have really hurt her. So that is why I tell people to consider it.

Be prepared for your vet to tell you it isn't necessary...

Okay, thanks! What exactly do I want to look for?

[gemy]

Originally Posted by bribunny

Okay, thanks! What exactly do I want to look for?

The test is called BATS Bile Acid Test - I thought there was a stickie on here about it, but I went to the library and couldn't find it. If you do a search here on Liver Shunt or LS you will find lots of information, both on the proper way to test, and also some of the signs and symptoms.

The recommended time for the test is I believe 14 wks and repeat at 6 months.

There are some stickies about vaccinations which are very good reads, and something I've printed out too, and took into my vets prior to vaccinating Razzle. Also about titers etc.

I with the other poster who suggested you get this done The test is not expensive, and will help to show how the liver is functioning right now.

I'm sorry that you had such a scarey experience with the rabies shot.

[Raymond's Mom]

Originally Posted by YorkieSue

I don't know where you live but if your dog is not going to be in the wild, STOP VACCINATING FOR RABIES. Vaccinations are probably the most intrusive and harmful poison you can put into your dog--esp one so tiny. I am amazed that you allowed it to be done at all after her reaction to her second shot. This really told you a story and I'm sorry ou went ahead with the vaccine. Vets are there to MAKE $$$$--THEY will do and say anything to get you to vaccinate. From now on TITER you dog. I don't have time to explain titering but if you want your pup to live a long and healthy life, STOP VACCINATING. It breaks my heart that she now has that rabies vaccine in her after that reaction she had to that other shot. From now on, do your own research on what vaccines do to our dogs and use common sense. Will your teeny Yorkie be running free? In the wild? Near dangerous rabid wildlife? If the answer is no, then why are you vaccinating. Does this vet of yours recommend yearly vaccines too? The law states every three years in NY. Please research this topic and never allow such an already compromised Yorkie to be vaccinated again.

I don't find this post to be bashing, just giving some excellent advice. Vets make their "bread and butter" giving yearly vaccinations to everyone's dogs. That's how they pay for the pretty new clinics that most have to have. And are most of the shots necessary...no. Can they harm your dog...yes. And rabies is the worst for potential harm. So weigh the pros and cons. Is the yorkie outside and around wildlife? Do you have small children around that the dog might bite? If not I would NOT give rabies. And the number of vaccinations that the little yorkie in question had received was starting to border on ridiculous. That vet was into making as much money off the customer as possible and at the dogs expense.

[jp4m2]

I'm sorry your pup had this happen, but I'm glad for you that it was caught and treated. The rabies vaccine is one of the most potent vaccines and the one that carries the greatest risk for reactions. If the pup had a reaction the probability is the reactions will increase in severity with each additional vaccine...So you are right in being worried about this.....This link might be of some help.....

The Rabies Vaccine for Dogs: Side Effects and Precautions You Can Take

I don't know if where you live if they allow for exemptions but it maybe something to think about.....This is a link for each state.....

RABIES LAWS IN THE UNITED STATES as of 6/16/10

[ladyjane]

Originally Posted by Raymond's Mom

I don't find this post to be bashing, just giving some excellent advice. Vets make their "bread and butter" giving yearly vaccinations to everyone's dogs. That's how they pay for the pretty new clinics that most have to have. And are most of the shots necessary...no. Can they harm your dog...yes. And rabies is the worst for potential harm. So weigh the pros and cons. Is the yorkie outside and around wildlife? Do you have small children around that the dog might bite? If not I would NOT give rabies. And the number of vaccinations that the little yorkie in question had received was starting to border on ridiculous. That vet was into making as much money off the customer as possible and at the dogs expense.

I was about to ask if you are serious; but clearly you are, as well as being very misinformed. There is not that much money to be made with vaccines. They give them because they are educated and understand the risks of not vaccinating. Yes, many fail to stay up to date on the most recent guidelines but that is just a vet stuck in his old way of doing things and thinking he/she is doing right. Personally, I only go to AAHA vets because they have to maintain a level of education for themselves and their employees. Does it always make them great vets...no, not necessarily. But, I am not ever going to buy greed as the reason vets vaccinate pets.

Sorry, but it is people like you that can create public health hazards. I think you seriously need to read more about rabies!

[ladyjane]

Please take a look at this CDC website link:

Human Rabies --- Indiana and California, 2006

Just two cases from 2006....note the following from Indiana:


Public health investigation. The patient's mother reported that in mid-June, the girl had awakened her during the night and said that a bird or bat had flown into her bedroom window and bitten her. The mother saw a small mark on the girl's arm, which the mother washed and treated with an over-the-counter first aid treatment. The mother then went to the girl's bedroom to see whether an animal was present. Finding none, she assumed that the incident was a nightmare, not uncommon for the girl. Approximately 2--3 days later, an older sibling took a dead bat away from the family cat; however, the mother did not associate this event with the previous incident and did not seek rabies PEP for the girl. The mother later reported that at the time of the incident, a bedroom window was probably open without a screen in place.

[Raymond's Mom]

Originally Posted by ladyjane

I was about to ask if you are serious; but clearly you are, as well as being very misinformed. There is not that much money to be made with vaccines. They give them because they are educated and understand the risks of not vaccinating. Yes, many fail to stay up to date on the most recent guidelines but that is just a vet stuck in his old way of doing things and thinking he/she is doing right. Personally, I only go to AAHA vets because they have to maintain a level of education for themselves and their employees. Does it always make them great vets...no, not necessarily. But, I am not ever going to buy greed as the reason vets vaccinate pets.

Sorry, but it is people like you that can create public health hazards. I think you seriously need to read more about rabies!

I know quite a bit about small yorkies and reactions to vaccinations. I know that vets are instructed how to maximize the profit when people bring their poor dogs into the clinics yearly for unnecessary shots. I know that a customer rarely leaves the clinic being charged for just the vaccination but instead has a lengthy bill that includes a myriad of charges.

I also know that we live in a country of increasing numbers of laws and decreasing freedoms. And I consider it my right to decline a vaccination that will cause a bad reaction and possibly kill the dog, as is the case with this ladies little yorkie. Again, with a tiny toy dog I most certainly suggest that all owners weigh the pros and cons of both rabies and yearly vaccinations. Dead dog....big con.

[ladyjane]

Yet another interesting link:


http://www.dshs.state.tx.us/idcu/dis...reports/us.pdf


Have any of you seen bats in your area? They don't just live in the wild. And, honestly, I have seen all sorts of wildlife in the suburbs. Dogs cannot tell you if they have been exposed to an animal that might have rabies. We usually know if we have been exposed to one. Just not something I would play with.

[ladyjane]

Originally Posted by Raymond's Mom

I know quite a bit about small yorkies and reactions to vaccinations. I know that vets are instructed how to maximize the profit when people bring their poor dogs into the clinics yearly for unnecessary shots. I know that a customer rarely leaves the clinic being charged for just the vaccination but instead has a lengthy bill that includes a myriad of charges.

I also know that we live in a country of increasing numbers of laws and decreasing freedoms. And I consider it my right to decline a vaccination that will cause a bad reaction and possibly kill the dog, as is the case with this ladies little yorkie. Again, with a tiny toy dog I most certainly suggest that all owners weigh the pros and cons of both rabies and yearly vaccinations. Dead dog....big con.

I am not talking about ONE dog. I am talking about this misinformation that is being spread.

Of course we all need to be educated consumers. I actually did mention that to the OP. My vet, by the way, does not do yearly vaccines. We are all responsible and should be educating ourselves and questioning our vets...just as we should our own doctors. But, to make a blanket statement about a dog not being in the wild and not needing a rabies vaccine was not cool at all. Certainly not an informed person making such a statement imho.

I don't think you could find many vets who want to risk killing dogs just to run up a bill. What percentage of dogs die from vaccines? Do you know the stats?

[ladyjane]

Oh, and by the way, rabies is NOT just spread by a bite. It is spread through saliva and a bite is not necessary. It could enter the body through a tiny crack in the skin.