biotics and enzymes ???

[Doodlebug]

Does anyone use these TOTAL ZYMES and TOTAL BIOTICS? Teddy and Daisy have been having issues with soft stools and a few accidents in the house lately. Teddy has a sensitive stomach and threw up his food yesterday. He hasn't thrown up in quite a while. A friend of mine recommended these and I was wondering if anyone uses them and if this would help Daisy and Teddy. We recently switched food to California Natural Lamb and Rice and they get a little boiled chicken and brown rice with their meals.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

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[Wylie's Mom]

Did you switch their food slowly and do you think this food is working better for them, or is it worse? If worse, you may want to go back to the old food...or try something different that better fits Teddy's issues....

Pending how you feel about that, this is the enzyme/probio combo I use on my fellas: Nature's Farmacy - Store - Product Details

[Maddie23]

Wylie's Mom, can you explain to me why this is given to your babies? Is this something we should all be doing? Is it given on a daily basis or only when you suspect a problem, diarrhea, etc?

[lil fu fu girl]

I also use Nature Vet Pro-biotics and enzymes. Dromies has a sensitive system and has drainage from allergies, which causes a more acidic stomach, and consequently destruction of her natural intestinal flora. This flora extracts nutrients and water in the excretion process. When they are not working properly, you dog will have diarrhea and other GI issues.
The pro-biotics and enzymes add micro-organisms into the GI tract that are beneficial in reestablishing the healthy flora.
So I try to keep a little in each of her meals just to keep her on track, as she has Lymes and any issue with her GI system essentially weakens her immune system as they are both interrelated.
Hope this helps some..........

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Maddie23

Wylie's Mom, can you explain to me why this is given to your babies? Is this something we should all be doing? Is it given on a daily basis or only when you suspect a problem, diarrhea, etc?

I do think they strengthen the entire immune system, the probiotics more so than the enzymes. I take probiotics myself, and my body does *so* much better with them (and only a certain kind too, bc I tried others first, to no benefit , waste of $). So many things go awry in the intestines, imho.

So, I think dogs can really benefit from digestive support, no matter what kind of diet - but especially from probiotic. The controversy w/ dogs is that their stomachs are so very acidic so the question is, do probiotics really survive their tummy and make it beyond? We don't know *for sure* but some studies seem to indicate that they do survive, depending upon the integrity of the delivery system, and that's why I like the brand I use bc of the way it's delivered.

Just my 2 cents...and not sure what it's worth.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Maddie23

Wylie's Mom, can you explain to me why this is given to your babies? Is this something we should all be doing? Is it given on a daily basis or only when you suspect a problem, diarrhea, etc?

Argh...forgot to really answer your questions, sorry !

I give it w/ each meal, so 2x a day - I sprinkle it on their raw food, every day.

I don't know if this is something everyone should be doing, but I do like it for my fellas.

[Maddie23]

Wylie's mom thanks for your replies... whew, when I got my Maddie a year and half ago, I had no idea there was so much to learn!!!

I grew up in the country where our dogs were whatever "city" people dropped off. They were our pets until they got hit by a car or a coyote or something else got them. They got rabies shots, but that was the extent of their health care! I know, it sounds brutal, but that is just the way of world in a rural setting. Dogs were not allowed in the house for any reason. Of course, I tell my skinkids that none of that matters cause my Maddie isn't a DOG anyway but we do tease that she might like one for a pet!!!

On another note, would you mind telling me which probiotic you found for yourself that worked?

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Maddie23

Of course, I tell my skinkids that none of that matters cause my Maddie isn't a DOG anyway but we do tease that she might like one for a pet!!!

On another note, would you mind telling me which probiotic you found for yourself that worked?

LOL !! I love that!!

I tried so many and none of them did a thing, and I was having some issues. I then did a whole bunch of research on which "species" we need to be taking and I hemmed and hawed on trying this one and that one and the other one. And some are super pricey!

I finally decided on Sedona Labs iFlora Multi-Probiotic from iHerb...and oh my gosh...if this just happens to be what your body is missing, it WILL change your life and I'm not even kidding. There really are not too many supplements I can personally recommend for humans, I mean, really, ya know? I usually don't notice a difference. But this one? Night and day.

[Doodlebug]

Thank you SO MUCH for your responses. I am glad these things seem to be beneficial. I called the vet about this (this is their second time with this problem) and he gave me FortiFlora--10 packs for $13!! It lasted 5 days. The vet said they could be picking something up from other dogs or they have had a treat or something that didn't agree with them.

I did change their food to Cal Natural slowly. Initially I had them on Nutro Lamb and Rice small bites and they seemed to be doing great on that and they loved it. Then I saw on YT that there was a problem with the Nutro so I switched them to Natural Balance Ultra. I don't know if it was the Natural Balance Ultra (chicken flav) or what but they both started itching. Then I saw that NB had the bad preservatives so I got them on California Natural Lamb and Rice.

Teddy's itching was mild and it has stopped. Daisy's itching was worse (with paw biting) and now it is OK. I had to give Daisy Benadryl for quite awhile.

I don't know what to do anymore. They were doing well on Nutro but I am afraid to go back to that.

I did try the raw diet for a bit awhile back and they didn't seem sure about it. Natures Variety (or something like that) medallians. They ate one flavor and didn't like another. I didn't really like the idea of raw so I gave most of it away.

Ann, do you have any comments about the foods I have been giving them? Like I said they seemed to do best on Nutro but my husband and I both agreed that we are afraid to go back to that.

Ann also, can you explain how the probiotics helped you feel better? I may have to check into that too.

Thank you so much for your replies.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Doodlebug

Ann, do you have any comments about the foods I have been giving them? Like I said they seemed to do best on Nutro but my husband and I both agreed that we are afraid to go back to that.

Ann also, can you explain how the probiotics helped you feel better? I may have to check into that too.

Boy, I am kinda stumped here. I just looked at all 3 foods. I can't see much in the Cal Natural that would irritate unless Teddy is sensitive to Rosemary (which is not in either of the other formulas), and of course anything is possible.

If *both* were/are having poo issues, then I'm thinking more of a tummy bug and that they're still in recovery mode...and that sometimes can take some dogs more time than you think (ie, Wylie recovers right way, Marcel can take quite a while).

Btw, the *old* verisons of NB did have the bad preservative called Menadione, but the new ones do not. IF they were too itchy on NB...they may have sensitivities to Flax as NB does have flax in it. Of course, if that was summer time, that could have been a pollen issue too.

Did the soft stool start before the food switch at all?

Is the boiled chicken/rice w/ meals new or have you been doing that a while?

As for the probios for me personally...you may want to PM me about that (LOL) ....

[Doodlebug]

Ann, thanks so much for the info.

The soft stools have been since the last food switch. Teddy is sensative to a lot of foods and can't eat beef or anything fatty at all. He used to throw up his food quite a bit but when we took him off of foods with corn and wheat etc he was OK as long as he didn't get any fatty meats or foods. We give them a bite or two of our table food it if is healthy. They like green beans, peas, cooked carrots, and fruits. Boiled chicken is the only human meats they get.

I started giving them boiled chicken and rice when I heard the Nutro was bad--several months ago. It was an interim feeding until I found a new food. Then we went on the NB Ultra (chicken). You told me in another thread that chicken can cause itching so I cut out the chicken completely to see what happened. They still itched some (Teddy not so much) but the vet thought it might be grasses/pollen. I just thougth it odd that they both started itching at the same time and have never itched before. Daisy is 6 and Teddy is 5 1/2. So I can't figure out why all of a sudden both are itching at the same time.

So now with the latest poopie bout I started them back on chicken and rice (about 3 or 4 days now) to try to stop the poopies. Also the vet gave me FortiFlora. I used boiled chicken because I don't buy that much beef anymore and didn't have any here to give them. Since the itching problem is better, I think the small amount of chicken I have been giving them the last few days is ok.

Picking up a bug from another dog is a possiblity if it isn't the food. We go to the park almost daily and visit with 5 other doggie friends (not a dog park). a few of the 5 other doggies have had some virus type problems, including the poopies. We have all been keeping our doggies home until they are well and only then going back to the park. I think you may be right, we are thinking they are well and they are not over whatever is going around. Daisy and Teddy haven't been around any other doggies for several days now. I plan to keep them away for the rest of the week at least. I do want to try the probiotics and enzymes for them and see if they do better.

I'm going to PM you about the other. LOL

[Ladymom]

I started giving Lady probiotics over a year ago after three attacks of HGE in four months. With that and switching to a home cooked diet, she hasn't had any further problems, thank heavens.

I did some research and decided on Animal Essentials Plant Enzymes and Probitoics. The AE line is highly regarded by holistic vets.

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[Doodlebug]

I forgot to mention that I think some of Teddy's problems with the throwing up were caused by him gulping his food too fast. I got him the bowls with the dividers in them to slow him down and also I sometimes hand feed him a few bites but I try to make sure he is not gulping. He is not throwing up much at all anymore.

The treats we give them are Carvers and we only give them 1/4th of a Carver 3 or 4 times a day.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Doodlebug

We go to the park almost daily and visit with 5 other doggie friends (not a dog park). a few of the 5 other doggies have had some virus type problems, including the poopies.

I think you may have nailed it there . I really do think some doggies recover from tummy bugs really fast. But really, there have been some bugs where my Marcel can take 3 wks where his poo just still is not quite *right*. And this really should not surprise me bc he had giardia twice as a puppy and giardia can really do a number on the small intestine, so who knows what permanent damage was done, ya know?

Maybe just give it a little more time?

Also, I have found w/ issues like what you're going thru - I go to Petco (can't find it at Petsmart) and I go to the Ferret/Small Animal section (or if they have it in Dog) and I pick up Benebac for Ferrets - this is a concentrated Probiotic paste for animals under stress/sickness etc. and can really work fast and re-populate the intestine quickly. I always keep it on hand. The reason I like the ferret size vs. dog is bc the weight seems more appropriate for yorkies, but either would really be fine. It's about $3-4.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Doodlebug

I forgot to mention that I think some of Teddy's problems with the throwing up were caused by him gulping his food too fast. I got him the bowls with the dividers in them to slow him down and also I sometimes hand feed him a few bites but I try to make sure he is not gulping. He is not throwing up much at all anymore.

The treats we give them are Carvers and we only give them 1/4th of a Carver 3 or 4 times a day.

Someone else here has suggested putting a golf ball in the food bowl for gulpers - isn't that brilliant? Have you tried that?

Oh also - on the Benebac...for the Ferret size, you get 4 small tubes, I believe, for $3-4.