Bile acid tests results came back.

[janetvav]

My vet just called me with Tuckers blood test results and she said that the bile acid test was not normal. Pre low and after food was 34. She suggested that we go to the University here in Iowa to do more testing. What would be the next step to take? Do they do an ultrasound or do they usually suggest a biopsy. This weekend he has started making a gagging sound and seems to be having a hard time chewing what little food that I can get him to eat. Don't know is this is all associated together or not. Why do I have such bad luck with my yorkies? I just had to put my last yorkie down with liver failure just last July and now I am starting again with another one with liver issues. I suppose I better get signed up with care credit because I am sure that the next step isn't going to be cheap. If they would happen to find a liver shunt do you really suggest going to UT? In the back of my mind I have been thinking that this may be our vacation but I guess I should wait and find out what they tell me here first.

[kjc]

Those are great numbers! Dogs who test that far under 100 have MVD, not a Liver Shunt. Just get him on a low protein diet, and as long as he has no symptoms, he can live a long , happy life. No further testing is needed, unless you feel the need to pursue a definite diagnosis, many owners choose not to put their pups through the additional testing. There are many MVD pups and owners on YT that manage this problem through low protein diet alone (18-22% protein).

This site explains it better:

Portosystemic Shunts FAQ

From the U of Tenn:

Do all dogs with high bile acids have shunts?
Bile acids can be increased with any liver disease. Bile acids can also be mildly increased in normal dogs, particularly in some breeds (such as Maltese) where chemicals in their blood interfere with the test. Most dogs with liver shunts have fed bile acids over 100 (normal <15-20). If the bile acids are only mildly increased or the animal seems normal, many veterinarians will simply rerun the test in 3-4 weeks.

[mojo]

So he is still barely eating? I'm glad you saw your vet. I have no advice as I have no experience with these issues.

Kjc - what is she supposed to do as her dog hasn't been eating well and if I remember correctly has excessive panting? I don't think just a change in diet is going to help (not being argumentative). Any thoughts?

[janetvav]

Right now I am hand feeding him to get him to eat. I have been boiling ground beef and mixing a little of that with his kibble but he isn't eating a lot of it. The last couple days he hasn't been quite as active and had that gagging sound like he has something going on in his throat. Even when he is eating he is having a hard time chewing and swallowing his food. He just ate a little bit and now he is just sitting in the chair which is very abnormal for him. I am going to call the University in the morning and make an apt for him to be seen.

[mojo]

Originally Posted by janetvav

Right now I am hand feeding him to get him to eat. I have been boiling ground beef and mixing a little of that with his kibble but he isn't eating a lot of it. The last couple days he hasn't been quite as active and had that gagging sound like he has something going on in his throat. Even when he is eating he is having a hard time chewing and swallowing his food. He just ate a little bit and now he is just sitting in the chair which is very abnormal for him. I am going to call the University in the morning and make an apt for him to be seen.

I think that is a really good plan and I wish you luck!

Has your pup lost any weight throughout this ordeal? Seems it's been going on for at least several - three weeks?

[4doggiemama]

Just want to let you know that I feel for you. Going through the same thing. ~Joanne~

[107barney]

Originally Posted by janetvav

Right now I am hand feeding him to get him to eat. I have been boiling ground beef and mixing a little of that with his kibble but he isn't eating a lot of it. The last couple days he hasn't been quite as active and had that gagging sound like he has something going on in his throat. Even when he is eating he is having a hard time chewing and swallowing his food. He just ate a little bit and now he is just sitting in the chair which is very abnormal for him. I am going to call the University in the morning and make an apt for him to be seen.

Red meat including ground beef can be tough on MVD dogs. Many of us feed a vegetarian diet for our MVD babies. Many people use the Hill's L/D diet or a home cooked diet. However, elevated bile acids may indicate something other than MVD - so it is important you talk with your vet and find out the correct diagnosis before making diet changes. For example, my Barney had elevated bile acids when he had a recent bout of pancreatitis yet he does not have shunt and does not have MVD. He therefore does not need to have a diet that is low in protein and in fact he is doing well on moderate protein.

My dog Daisy's readings were over 100 post - with diet changes to home cooked, her post number is now 13 and her blood work shows a dog that is not liver compromised so this condition can improve. My baby is almost 10 and she is in the best condition of her life.

As for cost of managing a dog with MVD (if your dog is found to have MVD), I pay twice annual visits with the specialist, twice a year blood work to check her levels, and home cooking costs me more than dog food would but it is not ridiculously high - I think I spend about $30-40 per month on her diet.

[Ringo1]

How about a bland diet of chicken and rice for a few days to see how that goes since he is not eating? Chicken is usually a better protein for MVD dogs than beef.

[107barney]

Originally Posted by Ringo1

How about a bland diet of chicken and rice for a few days to see how that goes since he is not eating? Chicken is usually a better protein for MVD dogs than beef.

My MVD dog would be puking and having bloody diarrhea if I gave her chicken and rice. I think maybe you should limit the protein if the dog is not eating and is showing signs of mental dullness and get to a vet. Chicken is not always good for MVD dogs. Mine cannot eat ANY meat AT ALL or we get deathly ill.

[Ringo1]

Oh. Lucy can eat chicken just fine with no problems . . . beef is another story. Perhaps her vet could make suggestions as to how much/what kind of protein she should be feeding.

[kjc]

Originally Posted by janetvav

Right now I am hand feeding him to get him to eat. I have been boiling ground beef and mixing a little of that with his kibble but he isn't eating a lot of it. The last couple days he hasn't been quite as active and had that gagging sound like he has something going on in his throat. Even when he is eating he is having a hard time chewing and swallowing his food. He just ate a little bit and now he is just sitting in the chair which is very abnormal for him. I am going to call the University in the morning and make an apt for him to be seen.

Sorry, you asked about BAT results... I wasn't aware of his other problems.

My thoughts: Did your vet check his teeth? Dogs with Liver problems are usually picky eaters, but trouble chewing may indicate a problem with his mouth. Does he eat soft food more readily, and have you checked for any hair in his mouth, as it can get stuck and go partially down the throat causing symptoms similar to what you described. Panting can be indicative of pain/discomfort either from the mouth or abdomin.

What kind of food does he get fed? What is the protein content? If it's 30-50% protein or higher, I would definitely find a food with a lower amount of protein just to ease the load on his liver, regardless of what problem he is having, but definitely check with your vet before making any changes. Adding a little low fat cottage cheese would be a way to entice him to eat and it is an easier protein for his liver to break down. (as long as he doesn't have allergies/intolerance to dairy) until his BAT values return to normal, if that is possible. Even when the liver is having a temporary problem, it will only help to ease the protein load on the the liver, so it can focus on regeneration instead of having to try to eliminate excess nutrients from the blood supply. You could try wetting his kibble to soften it, if you're not doing so already, to see if it's any easier for him to eat. This will help keep him hydrated too, if he's not drinking as much.

Rechecking him, or getting a second opinion would be a good thing to do at this point. I wouldn't put it off for too long.. either. If you can't get him in right away at the University, I would have my regular vet check his mouth at least, ASAP.

Originally Posted by 107barney

My dog Daisy's readings were over 100 post - with diet changes to home cooked, her post number is now 13 and her blood work shows a dog that is not liver compromised so this condition can improve. My baby is almost 10 and she is in the best condition of her life.

Do you recall just how far over 100 Daisy's post BAT result was?

[janetvav]

We are headed to ISU in the morning to get Tucker evaluated at the unniversity. Hopefully we can figure out what is actually going on with him and what we can do to make it better. He is eating Royal Canine with a little wet food mixed in and I hand feed him to get him to eat it. He loves string cheese but I try to limit him not knowing exactly how much potein is in it. He was rubbing his face with his paws tonight so I am not sure about that. My other dog has starting having some coughing now to so not sure what is going on other than they went to the groomers last week. Oh no hopefully not Kennel cough. Tucker still makes that gagging sound when we come home and he gets excited to see us. I guess tomorrow will hopefully give us some answers. Praying for some good news!

[Patti]

Praying you get good news tomorrow.

[kjc]

Prayers for good results tomorrow.... watch regular cheeses, they are rich and can bring on Pancreatitis.

[janetvav]

Originally Posted by kjc

Prayers for good results tomorrow.... watch regular cheeses, they are rich and can bring on Pancreatitis.

Are the low fat cheese any better?