Brooke, I feel so bad for your family going through all this. Poor Tatum! All the things she's had to go through so close together.

How's her temperature? Maybe she feels feverish... I'm probably completely wrong.

Just wanted to let you know what we're thinking about you! Trying to send strength and love Tatum's way!!

Video.....
 

Hey guys...I took a quick couple of videos of Tatum panting so that you all can see for yourselves just what she is doing...maybe this video will help somehow? Although I'm sure most all of you know what a dog panting looks like anyway :rolleyes: What you CAN'T however see in the video, is her shaking. Here it is though (P.S. - If you turn up your volume, you can actually hear her): Tatum Panting 6/17/09 at One True Media - share slideshows, slide shows, MySpace slideshows, MySpace codes, free video sharing, video montages.

I have GOT to try and get some sleep....my nerves are just consuming me. :cry: I also want to try and get Tatum to lay down and go to sleep because at least when she is asleep she doesn't pant. :( That is just about the only time she stops...so I want her to sleep as much as possible.

I will get on tomorrow and read the replies (only got to read a couple) and reply....I will absolutely for sure be checking into the anal gland thing. Thanks for all of your help everyone...I love you guys so much and would be totally MISERABLE and lost without my YT support system! :ghug:

Oh my..its like she just came in from outdoors playing... she is such a cute little girl. I hope that you are able to figure this out soon! I wish I had the answer for you.

Thank you so much, you are so sweet :hug: You hit the nail on the HEAD! It is EXACTLY like she just came in from being outside. This is how she breaths when she gets back from a long walk...only, she hasn't been on a walk, and she wasn't outside :cry: She has been in a cool house with the air set on 72 and ceiling fans going in every room! It just makes absolutely no sense to me what so ever. :cry:

Hi Brooke,
You probably don't know me, as I have only had my littly Lily for about a week, but I feel like I know you and your little sweetie, Tatum. I have been following this thread for a couple of days, and I wish I had an answer to help you. I don't, but what I do have is support and love for you and your family. You and your family are in our prayers. I'm so sorry! I looked through Tatum's album and fell in love with her little tongue! What a little angel! Please feel free to vent, that's what we're here for, and I don't even know you, but I can tell you are a loving Mommy trying to do the best for your furbaby. Lots of love coming your way!
Leslee

Just saw your video...
 

When Mimi had her puppies, she kept panting & shaking/shivering. I took her to the vet cuz I knew something was wrong & they did a blood panel & she had some sort of infection going on. They gave her amoxidrops (pink), antibiotics & she was fine in a couple of days.
Hope you find out what's wrong w/Tatum...or some sort of explanation why she's doing what she's doing! If she's retained puppy teeth (I think I read that earlier), it can get infected. Hopefully it's just a little infection that can be resolved w/antibiotics & Tatum will be back to her ol self!

I checked out ur videos... in the teeth grinding one, was that after the surgery if so i would think that tooth came loose due to the tube and such they use for anesthetic also i would not give her any bullystix to chew on better to give her a wash cloth to suck and bite on they love it if you put it in the freezer and get it frosty cold it helps with the pain too and possibly the tooth will come out..there are also some people that clean the teeth without anesthetic in the usa maybe you could check that out..
the panting and her tail down would possibly indicate anal gland ..u could try at home to put a warm wash cloth soaked in epsom salts put it on her anal area to help get the anal gland to excrete on its own also fiber helps with this give her a cherry or two as a treat daily...i would also give her about a 1/4 teaspoon of plain real balkan style yogurt for her tummy and the gas issue...these are just a few ideas of things u can try without going to a vet and they will not do her harm.
hope she will be better soon she is such a cutie...

Update
 

Hey guys, sorry that I am just now getting in to do an update but I have been really busy. Tatum is still panting and shaking. It's kind of weird though, because it seems as though she starts doing it in the evening :confused: She wasn't panting or shaking earlier today, and then this evening she started. Same thing for yesterday.

I have a question for you all. How do you know when a dogs anal glands need to be expressed??? By this I mean, is there any way at all that we can feel and check? I was thinking about taking her in tomorrow somewhere (possibly a groomer, as I'm sure my vet will probably charge his almost $60 fee JUST for me to walk in the DOOR - plus whatever it cost to get the anal glands expressed, and I've already spent $500 there this week......:mad:) so anyway, I was wondering if there is any way that hubby and I can feel and check to see if she needs it done? I'm just scared that if I take her to a groomer and ASK if she needs it done, they will just tell me yes, just so they can get paid :rolleyes: Sorry but I just don't trust many people these days....dogs can't speak and you never know if things are REALLY needed, or not. Not to mention, I don't want it done if it doesn't NEED to be done....because once you start, you have to do it for life.

SO, is there any way at all to check and see if it needs to be done? Or do you really just have to ask a vet or groomer? Thanks in advance guys. :hug:

Hi Brooke! I watched Tatum's video & bless her heart......she seems anxious & it is so strange. Is it just me, or do you also notice her eyes seem different? Do they look kind of glassy (for lack of a better term) or larger?Maybe just because she is panting, I guess.
As far as the anal glands, Bella does the scooting thing when it's bothering her. For me, it's not something I could tell without noticing her scooting & different actions while having bm. It would seem after all you've been through, yr vet would do this at minimal charge?:confused: Our vet does & also trimming the nails. What about giving them a call & just inquire what the cost would be? I know others have said it sounds like it could be the problem, but for Bella having the issue....she's never had the panting/shivering symptoms along with anal gland problems? I hope this is all figured out soon & I'm wishing the best for little Tate. Love her! HUGS!

Anals
 

All of her symptoms are Pain. The panting, shaking and also the enlarged eyes. If you take her to the vet and tell them you want them to express her anals they don't charge an office call for thet. Normally it's between 8 and 15 dollars.I would like to know who told you that once you start doing the anals you have to do it all the time(That's Not True) I used to work for a vet and I know all too well the problems small dogs have with anals, this is why I keep telling you to have them checked. Most small dogs, not some but Most have anal gland problems. And if they have never been done that is probably exactly what is wrong with her. So stop waisting time and just do it . The worst thing that can happed is (I could be wrong). And yes you can feel if they are full if you know what you are feeling for. But if you don't know what you are doing you can do more harm then good. Also most groomers only do them from the outside and that's not the best way. You have to actually insert a thumb or finger into the rectum and go up and out at the same time. Tell the vet you want to watch so you can see what comes out.

For $500, I would hope that your vet checked her anal glands as part of the exam.

Here is a great article on anal glands:

Anal Sacs

I have read that very small dogs often have trouble regulating their own body temperature. I wonder if this could be the cause of Tatum's panting?

Symptoms
 

Here are some symptoms of anal problems:
Panting
Shaking
Vomiting
Loss of appetite
Sporadic loss of appetite
Look of desperation
Depression
Scooting
Bouts of diarrhea
Biting at the bottom
Licking at the bottom
Dog appears to be lethargic
The appearance of running from the bottom
Whining or crying
A dog can have any one, some or all of these symptoms when they have full anals. So Please Please Please have them checked. They will either be full or they will not, if they are then they will need to be expressed throughout her life and this is normal. Some dogs more often then others, it just depends on the dog.

Scooting
 

Not all dogs scoot when they have full anals.

Did you get this online? If so, what web site? I have searched and searched the internet over the last couple of days about anal glands and I haven't found anything online that says panting and shaking are a sign of the anal glands needing to be expressed.

I need help
 

You guys, I am at a total loss here. I have no idea what to do anymore. I called one of the local Pet Spa's here and was asking them if they express the anal glands and the lady that I talked to was sooo nice, and most importantly, she was HONEST. She said that they can do it, but she highly recommends that IF I want to have it done, that I take her to the vet to have it done as she has seen so many times that the sac will bust which can be extremely painful. She said that the vets are trained to do this and if a sac SHOULD bust, she would be there in the vet's care. I SO appreciated her honesty.

However, she told me that Tatum's problems do not at all sound like the anal glands need to be expressed. She said she has been grooming for over 20 years and she also told me that if she doesn't REALLY need to have it done that I shouldn't do it, because once you start expressing them yourself, they stop expressing on their own when they go to the bathroom. So if I started this, it is something that I would always have to continue doing. I have also heard this from many other people and have read it online as well.

I am just so confused, I don't know what to do anymore. :( I would take her in to the vet and have him to do it, but I honestly am not sure if that's what her problem is. The isn't licking it, she isn't scooting and her little butt doesn't look puffy at all. She is pooping fine. I just don't know :cry: I have had people PM me and tell me that it doesn't at all sound like she needs them expressed. One person tells you one thing, and someone else tells you another. :cry: It is just so confusing and you don't know what to do. And I do not want to have all these things done to her if she doesn't really need them and if they aren't NECESSARY.

I don't know if I should just wait a couple days and see if everything stops after she has been on the antibiotic a little longer or what. I just DO NOT know what to do :cry: I feel so helpless and last night I actually broke down and started crying because I just feel like I have no answers and I don't know what is bothering her. :cry: My body literally feels like it is shaking inside because she makes me so nervous when she does this....it is just making me a nervous wreck.

I have absolutely no idea what to do anymore. :cry:

Brooke, I am so sorry for ehat you and Tatum are going through. I know what it's like to be worried sick over your furbaby. :big_hug:

I agree with your groomer. Anal glands should be expressed by your vet, but I doubt that is Tatum's problem. You could feel if they were full and she would scoot and lick at her bottom.

If she were mine, I would take her to an internal medicine specialist. Vets are like general practitioners and can diagnose and treat common conditions they see all the time. More unusual and/or complicated conditions often require a specialist.

I feel so horrible for you. I just can sense your pain and frustration!! I have been there and I know what it is like, of course you've been through way more then me but I can still relate to you in so many ways!

I watched her video and I want to say Tatum is absolutely gorgeous!! How couldn't you love that adorable face! Is there any way she is just having some anxiety issues? Has anything changed around her? I wish I had answers for you and could help you in any way I could, I can just offer my support and friendship. If you ever need to let it all out please don't think twice, you can PM me even call me if you'd like, I know how it is to be lost with no answers and just have a sick baby and not know what to do. The vets know us by name as well and I HATE going in all the time, especially so often. I never know if I'm being too careful or if something is wrong and I find myself constantly worrying. I realize though when I am "more calm" Stormy is more calm. Once MY anxiety starts going I find myself looking for answers, worrying and it's like Stormy senses it and starts to react to me? I don't know if that makes sense. Over here the weather has gotten very humid and hot within the last few days and Stormy started panting as well from just laying around, I saw these threads and of course began to worry like crazy, she has stopped though and I did notice she didn't act like herself for about two days but today she is back to her normal self again once we've got the air and fans on. I know you already have yours on. I am just curious if maybe she is getting anxious. I wonder if these two could be connected in any way? Sending lots of hugs your way I hope you find your answers soon.

Personally I think that with all the good intentions and experience, we (people on this forum) cannot asses the situation properly, i.e. medically, because: (a) we're not there with you to see your little baby and her symptoms; (b) most importantly, we're not doctors, at least the majority here.

I think that you need to find a vet that you trust, or an emergency service, and follow their advice. Right now your baby is medicated. The vet saw her, and I am sure had a chance to see her behind + anal glands. If they didn't tell you anything about needing to express them, than possibly there's no need to do it. Frankly, I have no idea. But, no matter what, your Dr. should be the one to answer these questions and solve your baby's medical problems. The vet is the expert, we're only the support team. And I don't mean to offend anyone by saying this.

All of us here can't wait to hear some good news about your little one, and that your baby is feeling well. We're here to emotionally support one another, and often times the advice people give on this forum is solid. But, in this case, which is complicated and people contradict each other, the best bet (in my opinion) would be to go with the vet's advice. And if you don't trust this vet, find one that is better.

I know that you've spent so much money already, and another trip to the vet will make yet a bigger dent in your bank account... I know how it feels, and have no solution for this either. But your baby's health is a priority right now, and you need to know that the vet that's assessing her medical condition is a 100% on it, and is doing the best they can in an honest way. If you trust the vet you're working with right now than let them do their job and follow their advice. Otherwise, seek help of another doctor. And we'll be here to support you, pray for your tiny, and listen to how you feel in the process.

??????????????
 

Ok you spoke to the groomer and felt she was Honest, but you will not do the same for a Vet Tech?????? She was correct in telling you to take her to the vet for the anals, I have seen the damage that a groomer can do , not diong it correctly. That's why I also said to take her to the vet. And no I did not get these symptoms on line , I have seen the symptoms first hand, with my own two eyes. As I said ( Not All Dogs ) will scoot. Some have EXTREME symptoms such as the things I mentioned earlier in my symptoms post. And expressing the anals ( Will Not Cause A Life Long Problem ) If they are full then she already ( Has The Problem ). Who ever told you expressing anals can cause a life long problem was WRONG! Once again they don't always scoot and/or lick the bottom.

Idea
 

Heres an idea if you trust the groomer then take your baby to her and ask her to feel the anals to see if they are full, she can do that without expressing them. If she says they are full then take her to the vet to have it done. If they are full then obviously they are not working properly on their own. Does this make since? And the groomer is not going to charge you for that.

Thanks so much Marj, you are such a sweetheart :hug: I will definitely be letting the vet express them if I feel that it is what needs to be done, but right now I honestly have my doubts about that.

I am going to consider the internal specialist as well, I would have to find one though as I know that there isn't one here :( I will most certainly have to do some research on that.

I think I may call the surgeon that did her LP surgery and just run this over by him and see what he suggests. I have thought to myself, well, maybe the pins broke in her knees (her surgeon said that if this happened, obviously it would be painful)...but then again if that were the case it looks like she would be limping or wouldn't want to walk....and she runs around like a bolt of lightening sometimes, so I just don't see that being the problem.

Then I thought, well, she has Osteoarthritis, maybe that is hurting her. But again, back to limping and not wanting to walk - it seems like she would be doing either or.

I don't know, I'm just plain confused.

Thank you, and thank you for your PM also about thinking that Tatum or I could be jinxed from someone that is jealous of her. My eyes got pretty big when I read it LOL...but I guess you never know. Maybe she is jinxed, sure seems like it with all the problems she's had :cry: and there have been at least a couple of people on these boards that I have not trusted farther than I could throw them.

I know that no one here is a vet and I am not asking for medical advice, I just want peoples opinions. Of course I would never take medical advice without discussing it with a licensed veterinarian FIRST, but it is still nice to get other people's opinions and thoughts. And maybe someone here will tell me something that I hadn't thought of before. You never know. And yes, of course I am here for support as well. There is no better support system than that of YT and all it's members. It has always been that way around here.

Thank you hon, you are SO incredibly sweet :hug: I have tried to think of every single little thing that you can possibly imagine. :( My hubby and I sat down last night and were wracking our brains trying to think of whether or not ANYTHING at all has changed around our house, but honestly nothing at all has changed. I mean.....nothing. :( We haven't had any bad weather so there was no loud thunder or lightening or anything. We don't have any new animals and no new people have been around that Tatum doesn't know or would be scared of. There have been no loud noises or anything like that. It is just a total mystery to us both. :cry: It is really odd though because right now she isn't doing it. She is laying down sleeping in her little pink bed and isn't shaking OR panting. She is just sleeping peacefully :confused: I am going to of course watch her and see if she does it later on in the evening, like she has over the last couple of days. If she does, well then I honestly have NO idea. There is NOTHING going on around here in the evenings that would cause her to do that. I mean....what the heck!! :( :confused: I just do not understand it. :cry:

Oh no, I was hoping to come in here and see a much more positive update. :(

I definitely think the next step should be to call the surgeon who did her LP surgery, even though I agree with your thinking she would be limping or showing reluctance to walk on the leg if the pin broke. Maybe he will think of something your other vet has not come up with.

As far as gland issues go, my last dog had anal gland issues for awhile and he definitely did the "scoot" thing as well as let out a really foul smelling odor. :eek: We had his glands expressed routinely and eventually the problem seemed to clear up on it's own. He had always had a diet high in fiber, but the vet said the placement of his glands was odd making them hard for him to empty himself when he pooped...which to my way of thinking should have meant he'd always have the problem. :confused:

I just watched the video, and the panting and shaking both signal pain in my mind. :( I'm so sorry both you and Tatum (and the whole family) is going through this. :hug:

ETA: I just had one thought. Are you both gone during the day or are the pups alone at anytime where something really random could have scared her without your knowledge? I'm assuming it doesn't matter what room she is in in the house she still does the shaking and panting once the "episode" starts, but I figured I'd mention it.

No one is contradicting anyone else's recommendations or opinions. I believe that Brooke is just asking for advice.....thinking out loud with her thoughts......weighing all the symptoms her little girl is having. For sure, she knows her best. I was just letting her know that with some, the same symptoms do not appear. Brooke & Tate have already been through so much & I know if it was me, I would be so exhausted, sad, & frustrated. Brooke is a Mommie that does all she can for her baby, for sure.

SIGH. I never said that I wouldn't take her in and let the vet do it. In fact, I said that the vet is exactly where I would be taking her TO have it done IF she needs it. I am not just going to jump up and let someone express them if they do not need to be expressed. I know YOU said that just because you do it once doesn't mean that they will need it done for the rest of their life, but that is what everyone else is telling me (including someone that has been grooming for over 20 years) and that is what I am reading on just about every web site I go to. So honestly, if you want the truth, I don't want to take the chance of doing it and have to continue doing it for the rest of her life because they will stop expressing naturally on their own, if she doesn't NEED to have it done in the first place. I am going to do what is best for her.

Thank you SO MUCH girl. Honestly, you have been so sweet, kind and caring throughout this entire thread. And not to mention helpful. You are ALWAYS there for me, always. I so appreciate you. :hug: I am just crying at this point. I mean I just feel....I don't even know anymore. I am just so completely stressed, worried, sad, confused..I feel totally helpless :cry: I feel like she is trying to tell me something when she is doing this...but I don't know what it is. :cry:

I'm so sorry you are going through this, it would make it so much easier if they could talk to us, and tell us what exactly what they are experiencing. Little Tate has needed extra care, but no one can jinx her or you because they are jealous. So put that out of your mind! God just gave her to a home that would be able provide the extra care that this little girl requires. Hope you find out something soon, and try not to stress out too much.

Thank you so much sweetie...and I wish I HAD a positive update to give you all. :cry: I would love nothing more than to say that everything is fine and that all the panting and shaking episodes are over. :cry: But unfortunately, they're not. :cry: Well, we will see how she does this evening.... but I just have a feeling.... :cry:

I would normally think that the shaking and panting are signs of pain as well....but I mean, she just acts so NORMAL otherwise when she does it. I have "tested" her many times to see how she acted towards things WHILE she is panting/shaking. I asked her if she wanted a carrot (she knows the word carrot) and immediately she starts hopping around like a little bunny and whining and trying to jump up on my legs and she acts all nutty when she sees me get out the carrots...which is how she always acts when she sees them (they are her #1 favorite thing to eat, EVER). I asked her a few different other things, things that make her happy and excited, and she responded normally to all of them just like she always does. And I know that when she was in pain due to the LP (before she had her surgery) and when she was in pain so badly when she was teething when she was little, she would act totally out of it and would lay down ALL day and wouldn't follow me around...wouldn't want to be involved in anything at all. Also, when she is hurting or in pain her ears always flop down. I know it sounds crazy but she has done this ever since she was a puppy. Anytime she feels bad, I can tell not only by looking in her eyes, but by her ears. Cause they always flop down. So I just don't know. :(

Also, yeah, she will shake and pant in any room in the house no matter where we are. I don't work, so I am at home with her all day. So someone is always with her. I mean nothing makes any sense at all...

Understand
 

I understand! You have to understand I have seen my share of pet suffering. I also understand your financial point of view and this is so inexpensive to do . If they are not full then the vet will/should leave them alone. As I posted I have seen all of the symptoms I mentioned , thats why I posted them. If this is the problem , how are you going to feel for letting her go through that kind of pain for this long? Some vets will express even if there is a tiny bit of fluid in them. I would take her to the groomer first, as you seem to trust her(not being sarcastic Ok) and she can tell if they are full at no cost to you, then you will have your answer.