Ellie's blood work is not good.

[Yorkieluv]

If their concerned with her clotting time, I would def have a coagulation test done...Vitamin K, which helps with clotting, can be low in dogs with an array of problems like liver disease and chronic pancreatitis...Also, if she has a vitamin k deficiency, remember that fish oil and vitamin e are somewhat of anticoagulants..

[TLC]

Originally Posted by Yorkieluv

If their concerned with her clotting time, I would def have a coagulation test done...Vitamin K, which helps with clotting, can be low in dogs with an array of problems like liver disease and chronic pancreatitis...Also, if she has a vitamin k deficiency, remember that fish oil and vitamin e are somewhat of anticoagulants..

hmmm....THANKS for posting this. Help me understand, so are you saying that Vit E and Fish Oil would be 'bad' in the case of a Vit K deficieny?

[RMKC]

I am sorry little Ellie is soo sick, sending you and her hugs and prayers that you get your answers to make her feel better !

[Yorkieluv]

TLC,
Experts recommend that fish oil and vitamin E be discontinued about 2 weeks before any surgery (people and animals) because of the anticoagulation effects. If an animal is deficient in vitamin K and has clotting issues, vitamin E and fish oil are probably not optimal during this time of deficiency.
If there is a vitamin K deficiency, it needs to be addressed. I think the vet can give vitamin K injection...
Romaine lettuce and parsley are both high in vitamin K.

[Ellie May]

Originally Posted by Yorkieluv

If their concerned with her clotting time, I would def have a coagulation test done...Vitamin K, which helps with clotting, can be low in dogs with an array of problems like liver disease and chronic pancreatitis...Also, if she has a vitamin k deficiency, remember that fish oil and vitamin e are somewhat of anticoagulants..

I will ask the vet about coagulation testing.
Ellie isn't on a mega dose of vitamin E and she isn't on fish oil at all.
I am uneasy with both and have put it off...I guess it's a good thing I did.

If the CBC comes back normal but the vet is still concerned abot clotting, I wouldn't be surprised if it was an issue caused by her liver her pancreas having to do with low vitamin K. I wonder if MSU can check for that.

[Ellie May]

Ellie saw the vet today.
I was concerned that with the soft stool not going away and it possibly being a flare-up of pancreatitis and with her platelets in question that she would want to hospital her. But thankfully Ellie looks great and that never even came up. Her stool is fine and negative for giardia. She is on Metro for 10-14 days (I know...not great but fasting her and giving a bland diet didn't work and this is okay for her liver and pancreas, so I'm good with that). We will get the lab results tomorrow or Friday. There was no bleeding issue this time, so we are hopeful that her platelets are okay!

We had an interesting discussion about her bile acids being up possibly from pancreatitis. Nobody can say for sure but it is possible.

Ellie's diet is now 18% fat which is considered low and the vet is hesitant to have it lowered much more (Ellie's metabolism is quite fast), so we will see about the diet in the next few days I guess.

[marcerella02]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Ellie saw the vet today.
I was concerned that with the soft stool not going away and it possibly being a flare-up of pancreatitis and with her platelets in question that she would want to hospital her. But thankfully Ellie looks great and that never even came up. Her stool is fine and negative for giardia. She is on Metro for 10-14 days (I know...not great but fasting her and giving a bland diet didn't work and this is okay for her liver and pancreas, so I'm good with that). We will get the lab results tomorrow or Friday. There was no bleeding issue this time, so we are hopeful that her platelets are okay!

We had an interesting discussion about her bile acids being up possibly from pancreatitis. Nobody can say for sure but it is possible.

Ellie's diet is now 18% fat which is considered low and the vet is hesitant to have it lowered much more (Ellie's metabolism is quite fast), so we will see about the diet in the next few days I guess.

Oh Good Crystal! glad things are looking up!!! I was thinking of you both today!

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Ellie had her wellness check the other night and the vet just called.
Her ALT, BUN, etc. are normal. Her urinalysis and T4 are perfect.

Her lipase is up to 907 (high normal is 750). She did have pancreatitis and apparently it may have gone chronic. We will do more blood testing now and probably lower the fat in her diet.

Now to what really concerns me.
Her hemoglobin is up slightly which the vet isn't really concerned with.
Her platelets are 94,000 when they should be between 164,000 and 510,000. There could've been an issue with the blood sitting around and going to the lab and the people at the lab said the platelets looked okay, but this may not be good. Something else that is crossing the vet's mind is that Ellie took a long time to stop bleeding after her blood draw the other night. She wants her rechecked in less than a week.

Her titers aren't back yet but I told the vet that I am refusing all vaccines until the CBC is normal. With low platelets we have to start talking about tick-bourne illness (she went down South this year but I saw ZERO ticks on her) and immune mediated diseases. It may not be this because I think the vet said hemoglobin usually drops first if that were the case but we just don't know.

Now Ellie is sick. She threw up last Friday and then seemed fine. A couple days ago she started getting diarrhea and still has it. She has had a bit of a cough but nothing major. The vet is going to be out of town for a couple days and said if she gets worse, go to our back-up vet. It sounds like she is concerned.

I can't believe we might have more problems.

We are just hoping that the CBC will go back to normal and that a diet change will bring the lipase down.

I would recommend having dr. jean dodds at Animal Blood Bank and Restore Health Cente review blood work as well as she has been studying blood for 42 years. If your baby was not real sick going in to vet and just a wellness check then treat the dog not the blood work -- lipase is not accurate for pancreatitis at all - i had a yorkie that had it and only if amylase and lipase are both elevated would it be cause for concern but even then not very accurate at all only cpli and tli are accurate for pancreatitis so that does not worry me at all-- has a pre and post bile acid ever been done to rule out mvd since a yorkie as my dd has elevated lipase like yours about the same number and jean dodds was not concerned at all about it. She does have mvd which is not a big deal as dd is just on a low protein diet. The platelets being high is from stress of blood draw i learned but low could be like she said sitting around. I know the globulins being high is due to gum disease or periodontal disease -- not sure on hemoglobulins-- have jean review it as she is the person i trust most with blood work as she is a pathologist and endicronolist who studies blood and she will not charge you much i am sure -- she is very nice -- if just slightly elevated i would not stress too much if she was fine before vet visit.

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

I will ask the vet about coagulation testing.
Ellie isn't on a mega dose of vitamin E and she isn't on fish oil at all.
I am uneasy with both and have put it off...I guess it's a good thing I did.

If the CBC comes back normal but the vet is still concerned abot clotting, I wouldn't be surprised if it was an issue caused by her liver her pancreas having to do with low vitamin K. I wonder if MSU can check for that.

do not do any fatty acids on a yorkie that has had pancreatitis as while it it rare fatty acids can trigger pancreatitis in a dog prone to it. Yorkies have a higher content of fat in their blood and is why if on high fat treats, supplements or food can trigger the pancreatitis alot easier than in other breeds with less fat content in blood -- my dex almost died of pancreatitis so i am very familiar with this disease

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Isn't the protein cottage cheese?
I think dairy is questionable for pancreatitis.

What's another $160 for Ellie's nutritionist anyway???

If the numbers don't come down on the CBC and treatment needs to start (which hopefully isn't the case), I might see if I can talk to/email Dr. Dodds since she runs a blood bank and I'm sure she has extensive experience with this and she might know how to treat without damaging the liver.

she is the best -- we live in california and see her two to three times a year for dee dee mvd and hypothyroid condition -

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

I don't know but it is frustrating.
So it looks like on top of lower protein, Ellie now needs lower fat than she is already getting. What is she going to eat? All vegetables and carbs probably.

Jean dodds liver cleansing diet is low in fat and protein and she recommends cod - i have my dex and dee dee on purina ha which has worked well for mvd as dd post biles went from 76 to 26 on this food and dex has ibd and pancreatitis and it is real low in fat and low in protein as it is a hydrolized soy diet -- dex was sick for a year until i got him on this food and no vomitting for 2 years now

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Yes, the vet is going to do a PLI.
Ellie has already been diagnosed with pancreatitis by her internist. It showed up on ultrasound. We decided to not do any blood testing at the time because we already had the diagnosis but it appears to be chronic, so further testing has to be done now. Ellie's hemoglobin wasn't low, it was high. I really do wonder if the abnormal CBC could be from pancreatitis. The vet is about to get a lot of questions.

the most accurate test for pancreatitis is CPLI AND TLI and much cheaper than ultrasound which will just show it inflamed but not how bad the pancreas is so i personally thought the ultrasound was a total waste of money and paid for 4 of them -- after 10k in vet bills realized most accurate test is that above and amylase and lipase meant nothing as when dex was real sick his amylase and lipase were normal and when he was feeling ok the amylase and lipase were real high so this is when i learned it was not accurate at all --- and the dermatologist we see for dee dee said in vet school they taught them that those figures were not very accurate at all so if dex ever has any issues again -- I will do full cbc and chemistry and add on cpli and tli before doing any ultrasounds as if that test comes back off you know it is pancreatitis and start fluid therapy and restrict food for 48 hours

[Yorkieluv]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Ellie saw the vet today.
I was concerned that with the soft stool not going away and it possibly being a flare-up of pancreatitis and with her platelets in question that she would want to hospital her. But thankfully Ellie looks great and that never even came up. Her stool is fine and negative for giardia. She is on Metro for 10-14 days (I know...not great but fasting her and giving a bland diet didn't work and this is okay for her liver and pancreas, so I'm good with that). We will get the lab results tomorrow or Friday. There was no bleeding issue this time, so we are hopeful that her platelets are okay!

We had an interesting discussion about her bile acids being up possibly from pancreatitis. Nobody can say for sure but it is possible.

Ellie's diet is now 18% fat which is considered low and the vet is hesitant to have it lowered much more (Ellie's metabolism is quite fast), so we will see about the diet in the next few days I guess.

I agree, Crystal...The liver and pancreas issues are likely linked..I've read that many times pancreatitis, liver disease, and IBD occur together..Milk thistle would probably be beneficial for Ellie, as it is recommended for all 3 of those issues...

Pancreatitis
"When the pancreas becomes inflamed, digestive enzymes can spill into the abdomen, which can damage nearby organs, such as the liver, bile ducts, gall bladder, or intestines. Pancreatitis can occur suddenly in either a mild or severe form..."

[dwerten]

yep this correct as dex has ibd but no liver issues that i am aware of but they think he got ibd from pancreatitis or had it before as his is in small intestines i believe as only vomitted and never diarhea and cannot tolerate any potato diet or he vomits as his small intestines cannot digest it so he ends up vomitting it up as he gets backed up -- white potato is inflammatory so i believe it inflames the small intestines and then he gets backed up and if it gets bad it triggers the pancreas as well

[Noellie]

I hope Ellie feels better.