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As far as more taxes, fees etc it will affect only those breeders who do comply with the laws. Puppymillers are notorious for ignoring "rules". |
ladyjane, I find your answer kind of confusing. I see some of what you are saying, but I also see statements that most application rescues aren't that great (meaning, presumably that at least some of us here were turned down because WE'RE not so great), that it IS hard to get a rescue pup, but that not all rescues use the same criteria (so maybe it's easy? Or is it hard?). I see your point about not telling people why they've been rejected, but at them same time, how can people improve their situation if they don't know what's wrong? Of course you can't just turn dogs over at will to make people happy - but making it really hard and mysterious and disappointing basically means rescue is not a viable option. Which is it? |
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Rescues have the luxury of being able to review things more thoroughly. There are some rescues who up front will say a fence is required. We don't do that and I know a lot of rescues do not. What is important to me is how the person has handled previous pets. If they don't have a fence and never did....and have pups that have lived for many years then chances are they do not allow their pups to roam freely. There are some parts of the country where fences seem to be less common. |
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Regarding your last statement, it was VERY unfair. I went and bought my pups from a breeder for 2 reasons... there was NOT 1 YORKIE in ANY shelter in my area for 50 or 100 or 200 miles away from me. I live in a suburb of Boston and little dogs do not last in the shelter for more than a day IF they even make it to one. Little dogs in my area are VERY trendy these days sadly. I wanted YORKIES and if that is the breed I want, then that is the breed I'm going to buy, love and take care of. I should not have to take what the shelter offers because there are no yorkies and other careless people in the world just relinquished or abandoned their pet. I really wish I could rescue a whole bunch of dogs. But I can't afford more than 2 and my passion is with the Yorkie. The other reason is because I tried to rescue and got denied. Those are the facts. I was not looked at on a case by case basis. I was just flat out denied by a rescue. Well where do I turn when rescues deny and shelters don't have? I am in no way meaning to imply that I am taking your posts literal and as a personal attack on me. I know they are not, nor do I mean a personal attack on your. I hope you don't feel that way. I admire you. :) I just mean someone that was in my situation, what do they do? |
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I believe some do give excuses. I am SO against that. That is just stupid because a person can just come back and say they will put a fence up if you use that as an excuse. We reserve the right to refuse anyone and we don't often give a reason. We have a standard letter and we don't give individual reasons. We let them know that if they are being considered, we will contact them. Most of the time people do understand. Now, in a case where someone is not giving Heartworm preventatives, we do tell the person. This is a chance for education! It is also something they cannot hide on another application. Either you have proof that you have been purchasing it...and have proof that your pups are tested yearly or you don't! Or, in a case where there are unaltered pets. We discuss this with them. Sometimes they end up altering and then adopting from us. I once told a person who swore that they were just not aware about Heartworm preventatives and said they would start to give them to do it for a year with their pup and reapply after they have proven themselves. |
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Sorry to have offended you. I did not mean to. I like that you have clarified it. And...honestly, I have NO problem with people buying pups! I don't like to see them buy them from byb'ers and pet stores....but a good breeder is another thing. Yes, it is hard to get yorkies in the Northeast. I lived in NJ for many years and ended up adopting a yorkie mix from a shelter for that reason. I was also turned down by a rescue, so trust me I understand. I was not upset with them as I am sure they had reason. I did not have a fenced in yard and no previous pets to show consistent vetting. I had waited until my son was older and we had the time to properly care for a pup. If the rescues you went to had a policy of fences required, then you would not have been reviewed as an individual; and no, that does not mean you do not provide a wonderful home for your pups. |
Hey Ladyjane, I've got a question. I am posting it here because someone else may be wondering, or I may be alone:D Hypothetically, I find a rescue I trust and submit an application to rescue a dog. Let's say at the time they do not have a dog that I am approved for becasue thier dogs to not match my home. Will rescues continue considering me or will I be denied and that's it? (Does that make sense?:confused:) I mean if I wanted to rescue and already had one Yorkie, but maybe the rescue only has dogs that need to be an only, or dogs with health problems I am unable to take care of financially, is it possible that I may be matched with a rescue later? I don't know if I am making any sense:confused::rolleyes: |
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We hate to lose good applicants....the pups need them! |
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I guess for me, I do think that rescues should be less stringent than breeders. Here is my thinking: As a breeder, you have the option of bringing more pups into the world or not. If you don't have good buyers, you don't have to breed. You can make sure that every pup gets a perfect home. In the case of rescues, it's more of a triage situation. Even though I think the rescue I volunteer at is very nice, it is still somewhat stressful for the dogs to live in a place with other strange dogs nearby they may not like, and have very limited contact with. Everyone has a nice little room with their own toys, bedding, food, etc, and they get walked a minimum of 100 minutes / day - but it's still hard for the dogs to be handled by a lot of strangers, and also just to have prospective adopters looking into their runs all day. A foster situation is generally not ideal either. And of course, there are literally millions of other dogs waiting to take their place and get rescued as well. So in the case of a rescued dog, I think the criteria for a home should go from "it must be perfect" to "this will probably be a great place." Not that rescues should throw dogs at whoever happens to walk in, that would not be right either. But a rescue is trying to make the best of a bad situation, rather than create a perfect match. IMO. Also, I know from having way more interview experience than I care to, you can have a good screening process, and you can have a very stringent one - one doesn't necessarily imply the other. You can make it impossible for your dogs to get adopted by requiring the wrong things. |
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I have too many dogs as it is :rolleyes:, however if the decision was to come up I might consider being a foster home and help with the rehoming process. |
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Sure, there are more needing rescue. I save what I can. I won't lower my standards. I believe in quality over quantity. . Rescues are NOT the solution for homeless pups. They can only save so many. While I may make it difficult, it is never impossible to adopt one of my fosters. I make no excuses for making it difficult. My fosters are my babies and when they leave my home I want them to have the best possible chance of never being uprooted again. Often I take in the hard ones .. the ones that really need that extra care...to me that is what rescue is. Cherry picking just to get numbers up is not rescue imho. As to your first comment, I am really shocked. IF breeders were more stringent maybe there would be less need for rescues! |
I'm sitting here with no cable due to a storm and reading - I have to say this is all so interesting. I've learned quite a few things I didn't know & I applaud those involved in helping AND interested in adoption/rescue It must get very hard though to be in charge of who gets a dog and who doesn't - probably as hard as it is to be turned down and more so - without knowing why (though I Do understand the reasoning for that) ... I've wondered why they usually don't tell people why they've been turned down so thanks... it makes total sense. in a way I wish it was easier to place dogs because there ARE great people out there that can provide a good life ....but then again - I understand why they're stringent. No matter what - It's good to know how many are out there making a difference - it must be a full time job just screening people |
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We have a couple of people who review the apps. So many are deleted just at that step. You would be mighty surprised if you saw some of the things people tell us. Mind boggling. One that stands out in my mind (and I do believe the person was serious) was a person who had two other dogs that slept under their mobile home. They went on to say that they provided a nice bed of hay for them.) I have been bathing pups this evening and Matty was running around barking. I should have known why. He hates storms! I had NO idea it was storming until I read this. DUH Does not seem so bad here, though. Gotta go check weather.com to see where it is going. |
ladyjane, I think you misunderstood at least part of my post. I didn't say breeders should be less stringent. Fosters are often not ideal for pets for a variety of reasons, the simplest being that some of the dogs may not like each other. Almost by definition, if you are rescuing, you are not "family planning" the way you would if you just have just a few dogs, and you're planning to stick with those for the next fifteen years +. And generally, I think dogs are happiest when they are in a permanent situation with a stable number of family members. So for me, while a dog can stay in permanent foster, I do not see that as a success story. Obviously it can be a different story if you are picking the really hard luck cases that need major rehab work and are not likely to ever be adopted. There's a continuum between a high volume shelter and a permanent home. It sounds like you are a lot closer on the scale to a home. I'm not saying this as a personal criticism in any way, which appears to be how you have taken it. I'm simply trying to explain my perspective on how a rescue should operate to do the most good. They don't all have to have the same goals. However, IMO, it's not helpful for people to get rejected over and over by rescues, and I was trying to explain part of that. |
I really do respect good breeders and people who do rescue work! I guess it's a side effect of being a computer programmer - I'm always looking for "bugs" and potential system improvements. |
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I am not taking anything personal at all. I make no apologies for how I rescue. I am curious though.....have you volunteered and/or fostered for a rescue? You say you have a perspective about how rescues could operate to do the most good. You also mention that it is not helpful for people to get turned down ....... are you saying that we should feel sorry for people and let them have a pup even knowing that they have perhaps never vetted their dogs properly, they let their dogs run free, they don't provide heartworm preventatives? The list goes on and on. If you have done rescue, surely you do know about the vast numbers of irresponsible pet owners?? Trust me, I don't want to make a home for the rescues I take in. I have my personal pets. I want to FIND a home for each of my fosters...a good home where they will stay for the rest of their lives. Those I want to keep have already been adopted by me. There are many people who feel as you do and many who do not. Our group is composed of a group of the latter. You and I obviously feel differently about how rescues should operate. And......I believe that anyone who is turned down over and over by a rescue or rescues has something going on that they are not sharing. |
Okay, just going to say one more thing, lol. I posted a while back because I was upset to see super-nasty reviews of the rescue I love on Yelp!, most of which were along the lines of, "I'm a really irresponsible person and they didn't give me a dog." At the same time, I've seen people go through the process trying to get a rescue dog, and truly, some rescues are ridiculous. Of course the priority has to be the dog's welfare, but at the same time, when there are so many unwanted dogs in the country, I feel like rescues should consider the kind of publicity they are putting out there. It is human nature to be hurt by rejection, and of course rescues are going to be rejecting people - so I think it's really important that it's done sensitively and if at all possible, in a way that doesn't leave people bitter about the experience. I think sometimes there's a double message from rescues - please come consider us first, but we'll have no problem treating you like crap. But you really should rescue. Even though we reject most people because they could not possibly be good enough. Also, even though this is a weird example, Temple Grandin is the woman who designs humane slaughter houses - she's an austistic woman who "thinks like a cow". She wrote something that really struck me, that most factories have hundreds and hundreds of checklist items that have to be passed, which she has... ten. Her grading system is super simple, and much more effective (at least according to her) than trying to control for every detail. I'm probably not explaining it well, but that's the gist. |
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Okay, done. |
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But...yes...quite done. :rolleyes::) |
I agree w/ladyjane in respect that adopting should be strict. When I adopted Tabitha (from shelter), one question on applic. was....What do I think the dog feels if I were to return him/her if it didn't work out for me? My answer was...."I think he/she would cry, he/she has feeling, their little hearts can break just like us humans". (rehoming is "very" hard on pets) I think thats what alot of shelters/rescues are looking for. Your true hearts compassion. And that can't be learned or taught. I don't have a fenced yard. I do have another breed dog. The shelter did call my vet. My other dog had to meet Tabitha. Two other rescue clubs (out of state) had excepted my applic. It was just a matter of me picking out which one I wanted. Had no problem finding yorkies, so I don't understand when someone says, "they can't find a yorkie other than from a breeder". Had one picked out from Indiana, I'm in Ks. Just happened to go to local shelter one Sunday (out of boredom), low & behold they had Tabitha. Her litter of 5 was there, too. I chose Tabitha knowing she would be hard to adopt. She's some where 6-8 yrs old and looked soooo sad. People would come & check out the pups but wouldn't even look at Tabby. I chose her over the male from Indiana. He was still a pup & would adopt out quickly. And he did. As far as the Boston area, I looked it up & found alot of shelters/rescue in that area (w/yorkies) Course I don't know what area of Boston were talking about, nor the miles YT is willing to travel. I can understand not wanting to adopt to a full time working person. You have to agree, little yorkies, especially the first year needs to be monitored closing as they can get sick really fast. Sometimes just a few hours can mean life or death. I read somewhere on internet a lady came home from work & found her 5.7 lb baby on kitchen floor.....dead. :cry8: Only comment I have on laws/fines is: If there has been at least 3 complaints to any one place, than any Shelter, Rescue, Law enforcement should be able to go in, check the place out, & shut them down on the spot. Then fine w/possible jail time for the owner. Pictures & vet check should be enough for the courts. I believe in keeping it simple (kiss rule). |
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Unfortunately there are no yorkies for adoption in my area so I will buy my 2nd and final yorkie as I am about to turn 54, an og,lol. Vicki |
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Not sure where you are in MA, but there are yorkies in rescues in MA and surrounding states. Do a search on Petfinder! :) |
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I'm not saying our views are right over yours. I'm just saying that if rescues did work on a case by case basis, i'd have 2 of them right now. Because anyone who walked into my home and spoke to me and saw my boys, would know they can trust a pup to my care for the long term. |
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If you think that implications are not nice, then why are you implying that all rescues are as you see them? I think that you and Quicksilver need to start your own rescue. :) |
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Derry, NH: Adoptable Pets: Petfinder Also to the other poster, 4 years ago when I bought my boys, there were NO yorkies or small dogs to be found in shelters and I was denied by the local Yorkie rescue. |
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Thats a very black & white statement.... There is a middle ground of people... they are not IDEAL, but they are far from 'just tossing a dog out to anyone' ... those people fall into a gray area that rescues need to examine more closely. Or fit with alternative dogs when the one they applied for might not be a fit to HELP free up space in the rescue for MORE dogs... there is and sadly probably always will be another one behind that one waiting for a home. :( Ok... thats it .... :) |
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Yes ma'am that is "it". And, as I said, you might want to start your own rescue. :) Seems to me you need to "walk a mile". :) |
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