Originally Posted by Nancy1999 (Post 2989143)

If a small breeder thought that was going to be a huge risk, they should quit breeding. Honestly, they should select homes carefully, and maybe do some health testing. We need to find a way to stop killing millions of dogs. I know people say it's wrong to "cull" puppies, but that's what we are really doing with dogs, breeding them haphazardly, and killing all the ones that aren't healthy or cute enough. This just seems so wrong to me.

Originally Posted by Maximo (Post 2989186)

I wholeheartedly agree with you that something needs to be done, but penalizing breeders if a dog ends up in a shelter might have the unintended effect of bolstering mass-producers who will happily pay fines or find a way to get exempted while discouraging small hobby breeders who don't have $$ to risk fines -- no matter how carefully they screen buyers, there is a risk of getting burned, and all it would take is one bad case.

Originally Posted by livingdustmops (Post 2989192)

Actually many of the mass producers sell to the petshops and they would be the ones hit with the fines...and the amount could go up based on how many of their dogs end up in the shelters or they are not allowed to sell dogs...

Don't get to buried into the small breeder...unless they are willing to take the dogs back then they should not be breeding either.

Originally Posted by Maximo (Post 2989186)

I wholeheartedly agree with you that something needs to be done, but penalizing breeders if a dog ends up in a shelter might have the unintended effect of bolstering mass-producers who will happily pay fines or find a way to get exempted while discouraging small hobby breeders who don't have $$ to risk fines -- no matter how carefully they screen buyers, there is a risk of getting burned, and all it would take is one bad case.

Originally Posted by Maximo (Post 2989131)

Although I like the ideas proposed in several posts, keep in mind the cost of the administration to oversee programs and enforce laws and regulations. The cynic in me also worries that unscrupulous breeders would find their way around the system, while small hobby breeders would suffer or quit because it wouldn't be worth the risk.

Originally Posted by Maximo (Post 2989204)

I like the idea of fines being graduated for the number of dogs ending up in shelters.

Relative to the small breeders, I believe it was Nancy who pointed out that a good breeder requires by contract that the dog be returned to the breeder if the owner cannot take care of it or wanted it rehomed-- hmmm, maybe the contract could be the protection for the small breeder if the one bad egg buyer takes the dog to the shelter or dumps the dog.

Originally Posted by Mardelin (Post 2989207)

Now there is a National Database for this in place.

Yes, it costs for the administration, managing and enforcing said regulations that aren't working today.

A system was put into place in a region in Canada that is working. Rescues are being returned to their owners, no kill shelters, shelter is pretty much empty. They came down and gave a presentation to Los Angeles officials and they opted not to use it.

Originally Posted by Maximo (Post 2989204)

I like the idea of fines being graduated for the number of dogs ending up in shelters.

Relative to the small breeders, I believe it was Nancy who pointed out that a good breeder requires by contract that the dog be returned to the breeder if the owner cannot take care of it or wanted it rehomed-- hmmm, maybe the contract could be the protection for the small breeder if the one bad egg buyer takes the dog to the shelter or dumps the dog.

Originally Posted by Nancy1999 (Post 2989206)

I hear that excuse a lot, it won't hurt the miller, but it will hurt the small home breeder. In this case, I believe that the small home breeder is a large part of the problem. People need to learn that breeding comes with responsibilities, and some of those are financial. If the breeder cannot afford to pay the cost of putting the dog to sleep, he should not be breeding. Maybe if some of the byb understood how many of their own dogs ended up in shelters, they might rethink their "breeding program."

Originally Posted by Mardelin (Post 2989207)

Now there is a National Database for this in place.

Yes, it costs for the administration, managing and enforcing said regulations that aren't working today.

A system was put into place in a region in Canada that is working. Rescues are being returned to their owners, no kill shelters, shelter is pretty much empty. They came down and gave a presentation to Los Angeles officials and they opted not to use it.

Originally Posted by Maximo (Post 2989233)

I oppose backyard breeders and people who breed their pets (unless they keep the offspring themselves).

Originally Posted by PiePiper (Post 2987141)

I know that if I was to get another dog it would be a Yorkie. It is really hard to get the the Yorkies or any other breed from the rescues. My sister wanted another Cairn for a playment for her Vegas. She went through Pet Finder and was able to locate a quite a few rescues. She applied filled out many forms gave her references (which each person was contacted) had phone interviews, house study (someone came to check out home and existing pets). When she selected a Cairn she wanted to rescue the dog was brought to her home to see how he would fit in. My sister did end up with her rescue and has had him for 3 years. He came with a lot of problems since he was a puppy mill breeder and had been crated gor 4 years but now is a great pet and a perfect companion for her dog. She saids it was a lot of work but worth while. Even though I have owned dogs my whole life and a Yorkies for the past 15 years I don't think I would be able to get a dog through a rescue because my yard is not fenced in. We have 5 acres on a country road. My yorkie never runs loose. I have a pen for her or she's on a leash. That wouldn't matter to the rescue. Your yard has to be fenced in. Why do they make it so difficult to rescue when there are alot of good people and good homes out there?

Originally Posted by JeanieK (Post 2988893)

I agree, I think a lot of good potential rescuers rare turned down. I understand why they are strict but one set of rules does not fit everyone.

Originally Posted by ladyjane (Post 2989599)

Who told you that you MUST have a fenced in yard to adopt? We have adopted countless pups to people without fenced in yards!

Rescues, if they are placing pups the way I believe should be done, look at the whole picture.

What people really need to be aware of is that the needs of the pup should always come first. We spend time evaluating the pups before we adopt them out. Some yorkies are runners, some stick to you like glue...each one is different with his/her own needs. While one pup may not need a yard to run and play in and would be content with leash walking, another may want to run and play in a backyard.

Originally Posted by livingdustmops (Post 2989220)

Wow, do you remember the region...I would love to learn more about this...