"Maggie Was Turned Away"

[hockeymom]

I don’t think any of these posts were directed to anyone with a legitimate disability, it seemed to me, in my opinion, it was directed to people who were being dishonest in claiming they had a disability just so they could get their dogs into certain establishments. If you have a legitimate disability, by all means a service dog is perfect, but if you are dishonest with no legitimate disability………….WELL, then the shoe fits.

[SoCalyorkiLvr]

Originally Posted by diva pup

No one on this forum is suggesting that we use our animals as service dogs if we are not disabled. The fact is that the law is quite broad on purpose and allows anyone with a condition which prevents them from living their daily lives in a completely normal way to be considered disabled for the purposes of having a trained service animal who is allowed access to all public places.


I beg to differ Kim, i think that is exactly what you have done. I do not believe the law is intentionally that broad.I just do not think they thought people would abuse it in such a way that everything from a migraine to ADD would be considered a disability that altered the every day life of some people. If that were the case then almost everyone could claim a disability. I would find it almost laughable if it were not so sad.

Quote//To suggest otherwise is not just expressing an opinion but impugning the integrity of the members here and this is distressing.

I would be truly interested to know how many members here can actually claim a disability. You can try to turn this around to make it sound like I am attacking the members here, I certainly am not, but it does baffle me how many of them suddenly need a service dog or have had the idea of needing one suggested to them.THAT distresses me.

Dawn~ You are wrong. The law is that broad and migraines are included as a disability, and for good reason!

I am glad that you do not suffer from this debiilitating condition, but, if you did, I know you would change your mind. Migraines are so painful that many people have contemplated suicide rather than suffer throught them. To be able to have an animal who can detect the changes in body chemistry to allow you time to take the meication to prevent one is indeed a life saver!

There are many members here who suffer from this condition and many others, and if I have assisted them in their knowledge of the law such that they can now train their dog, or have it trained to assist them with their disability then I have performed a valuable task.

As an attorney, I have great respect for the law and I would never encourage anyone to abuse it. For you to suggest such a thing is more than unfortunate, it is deplorable.

[jackandjill]

A friend of mine bought me that sign when she kept hearing me complaining about the lack of parental supervision in the store. Please don't think that I don't love kids, have 4 of my own, and 15 grandchildren.My shop cat even comes in once in awhile if a customer lets her in, and she will follow them around and then go out when they leave. She has never knocked anything over. I am from England where dogs can go just about everywhere, and I wish it was like that here.

[minniemn]

I know it was upsetting for them not to let your yorkie in, even though you had the pup in a stroller.

But... if you let one person do it everyone will want to do it... and then you will have lawsuits for allowing small dogs, but not large ones... and the list goes on and on.

Many people are allergic to dogs, not just the hair but the dander, which goes airborn and can and will leave the mesh you have around the stroller... some kids are very afraid of animals ect.

I don't see a store changing their policy due to one person taking their business elsewhere, not even 100 people when it is a store the size of cabellas.

You really are a "guest" on any store owners property, and there are certian rules you need to follow.

As for service dogs, well they are another story... I don't agree with someone having their dog become a "service dog" for migraines, anxiety, or conditions that many, many people have... because then everyone will be running out to have one, and eventually that will ruin it for the serious medically disabled.

I am also disabled, and I don't use my disability to "get my way" or anything, I never thought to have my dog become a service dog, but they do help me out when I need it.

The dog we just had put to sleep, knew when I was going to fall (I use a scooter/wheelchair in public) and she would get in front of me and "break" my fall (she was a rotty) she knew when the nerve pain in my legs was too much to bear and she would lay across them, and the pain would subside. I could of used her in stores to pick up what I dropped, (which was often from the weakness I have) But I found out that there are many caring people out there who will do the same.

Could I use a service dog- yes, BUT not as bad as many others need them... I CAN function without one, and do... SOME PEOPLE CAN'T... and those are the ones that NEED service dogs... if we all ran out and got our dogs registered as Service Dogs, then I can gaurentee that eventually the laws would change, and those in REAL NEED would be left hanging.

I don't agree with working around the system to get what we want. Sure we want to bring our dogs in everywhere, but there are rules to follow.. and lets not ruin it for those in real need.

just my (probably unwanted .02)

[SoCalyorkiLvr]

Here is the beginning of an article on the tasks a dog can be trained to do to assist a person with a psyciatric disorder like depression or panis attacks. These are qualifying disabilities under the ADA:

IAADP
International Association of
Assistance Dog Partners

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SERVICE DOG TASKs for PSYCHIATRIC DISABILITIES
Tasks to mitigate certain disabling illnesses classified as mental impairments under the Americans With Disabilities Act

Author: Joan Froling
Trainer Consultant
Sterling Service Dogs

SERVICE DOG TASKS FOR PANIC DISORDER, PTSD and DEPRESSION
According to the Americans With Disabilities Act (ADA), a service animal must be individually trained to do work or tasks of benefit to a disabled individual in order to be legally elevated from pet status to service animal status. The following list identifies a number of tasks a service dog could be trained to do that would serve to mitigate a disabling condition classified as a psychiatric disability. In particular, the tasks were developed for those who become disabled by Panic Disorder, Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome ( PTSD), or Depression, conditions attributed to a brain chemistry malfunction. The author, a mobility impaired service dog trainer who has been deeply involved in the assistance dog field for the past decade, initiated research into this new kind of assistance dog in 1997. She became familiar with these disorders through the input of early pioneers of the psychiatric service dog concept. Subsequent research has involved garnering input from experts in psychology and psychiatry and from patients to gain a better understanding of the symptoms, treatment goals, and ways in which partnership with a service dog might become a valuable adjunct to conventional therapy.

In addition to task training, it should also be recognized that housebreaking, basic obedience training and mastering the behaviors of no nuisance barking, no aggressive behavior, and no inappropriate sniffing or intrusion into another person or dog’s space are an essential part of educating any dog for a career as an assistance dog.

Assistance Work or Tasks for Psychiatric Disabilities

I. Assistance in a Medical Crisis

II. Treatment Related Assistance

III. Assistance Coping With Emotional Overload

IV. Security Enhancement Tasks

I. ASSISTANCE IN A MEDICAL CRISIS

A service dog can learn a number of helpful tasks to assist his partner to cope during a sudden flare up of symptoms, medication side effects, or in a situation requiring outside help.


(The limit on the post makes it impossible foer me to list the tasks identified but I will list them in another post or you can read by going to the website yourself)

[jackandjill]

Minniemn, You are one great lady, and I commend you for being such a wonderful person. I wish the whole world thought like you.

[SoCalyorkiLvr]

Here is a description of some of the actual tasks which a dog can be trained to perform.
Bring Medication to Alleviate Symptoms

Dog assists partner to cope with nausea, cramps, dizziness, other medication side effects or the fear paralysis of PTSD or the sudden waves of terror, chest pains and respiratory distress of a severe panic attack by fetching antidote medication to alleviate the severity of the symptoms.

Dog trained to fetch medication from another room if kept in a cupboard in a basket.

Dog trained to fetch purse with medication in the home ( will search and drag.)

Dog trained to bring purse with medication from a specific place, such as the outer office, closet or bathroom vanity where it is usually kept.

Dog trained to locate a heavy purse sitting on hotel room dresser or desk or chair by following directional commands and drag-deliver it to his partner.




Bring a Beverage So Human Partner Can Swallow Medication

This complex task involves a sequence of skills, takes four to six months to master.

Dog trained to fetch a beverage to enable the human partner to swallow the medication.

Must master the skills of: 1) going to the kitchen from another room to pull open a refrigerator door or cupboard door with a strap, 2) picking up the beverage from refrigerator shelf before the door swings shut, 3) carrying an ice cold beverage to the partner in another room, 4) going back, if need be, to shut the refrigerator door or 5) fetching a basket containing a beverage, plastic glass, possibly other small items that may spill out if the basket is not properly carried by it’s handle from the cupboard shelf to the partner in another room.




Bring The Emergency Phone During a Crisis

Enables the human partner to contact a doctor, therapist or other in a support system when experiencing alarming medication side effects, terror or respiratory distress from a panic attack, or a flashback. An individual suffering from depression, possibly with suicidal ideation, also needs to be able to reach a supporting person or agency. Retrieval of the portable phone can be very useful in other situations too. (Training Note: this should be made a “place command,” as asking a dog to visually search the house is unreliable, especially if the phone is left on a counter or piece of furniture above the dog’s line of sight. It is best to locate the charger unit on the floor in a room with two entrances. If possible, the emergency phone should never be used except during practice sessions. This will help ensure its availability during a crisis.)

Dog is trained to bring the handler a portable phone. If the room where the emergency phone is located has two entrances, the dog should be specifically taught to find the second entrance in case the first is blocked so the task can be completed. The end goal is to successfully train a service dog to bring the phone to any room in the house when needed.




Answer the Doorbell

When situations occur in which the handler urgently needs help but cannot get to the front door to let someone into the home due to physical incapacity from drug interactions, injuries that occurred due to lightheadedness, fainting, other side effects, or illness, the service dog could assist by opening the front door and escorting emergency personnel or a member of the support system to the handler’s location.

Dog trained to tug strap to open lever handle of the front door to let in emergency personnel or members of support system on command or in response to doorbell itself.

Dog trained to escort the person to the handler’s location.




Call 911 or Suicide Hotline on K-9 Rescue Phone

People with physical disabilities have reported going through periods of severe depression and not a few admit they’ve contemplated suicide. Those with a mental disability like PTSD are equally susceptible to developing this mood disorder or experiencing a sudden exacerbation of its symptoms. Scientists view it as a biological problem, not purely psychological. With some the condition becomes a lifelong struggle. A service dog can improve the safety of its partner whenever the mood disorder becomes life threatening. One task to consider is schooling the dog to operate the K-9 Rescue phone to summon help during a crisis. [available at www.ablephone.com]

Dog trained to call 911 / any preprogrammed number by depressing the huge white button on a K-9 Rescue speaker-phone.




Bark For Help in an Emergency

This task could be useful if someone has close neighbors willing to respond if they see the front door wide open and the dog in the doorway or on the porch barking his head off. Can work well in multi-family housing units. Many handlers tell the neighbors that if they hear the service dog barking, to immediately assume they are “in trouble” and respond accordingly. Handler will have to prevent the dog from doing nuisance barking, otherwise like the boy that cried “wolf,” no one will pay any attention to the service dog barking in a crisis. Lacking a K-9 Rescue phone, unable to afford Lifeline or an alarm company service, this task offers a low budget alternative if partner falls down, injures self, has an alarming drug interaction crisis or needs assistance for another reason and happens to be home alone.

Dog trained to open front door anytime of day or night and bark for help.

[REDFROG]

I don't mind if someone tells me I can't bring Asia into a store. As long as they are polite about it. I keep Asia confind behind the counter at my job because I know that some people do have a problem with dogs. ( I know, hard to believe someone can be scared of such a lovable, cute puppy) But most of my customers love to meet her.

[SoCalyorkiLvr]

Here is an article from a migraine sufferer whose Doberman detects her migraines:

In 1986 I purchased my first home for one reason only - to have a fenced yard so I could buy a Doberman. I moved into my house in April, and in July I brought my little puppy "Chelsea" home. It also happened to be the same year I suffered an injury that left me permanently disabled. Little did I know the impact "Chelsea" would have on my life. She was my best friend, and a few years down the road became my service dog.

But one other great thing came out of our relationship. I became a DRU volunteer. I first started by doing home checks and of course, "Chelsea" always came with me. People fell in love with her and she helped many Dobes get adopted.

"Chelsea" gave me a reason for living and became the center of my life. As I could not bend, she learned to pick up things even as small as a dime, and also to bring me my walker. She loved to go grocery shopping and would help pull the cart and get items off the shelves for me. In the house she got clothes out of bottom drawers, even helped carry laundry and learned to fold sheets. She also was able to predict my chronic migraines and alert me so I could take medication to lessen the attack. We visited many schools and groups, showing people what service dogs could do, and even helped some get dogs. She also changed the thoughts of many in regard to Dobermans, as everyone just gravitated toward her.

When "Chelsea" was five, I fostered my first Dobe for DRU - an abandoned and abused young dog. I named him Zephyr, because despite his abuse, to me he was A Gentle Breeze as is the definition of Zephyr in the dictionary. Well, we just couldn't let him go and I adopted Zephyr. He and "Chelsea" were the best of friends. When we would do home checks, I would bring both of them and Zephyr, having natural ears, made many who had put "cropped only" down on their applications, change their minds and adopt natural eared dobes. He also became both a therapy and service dog and would join us when we visited various places.

Little did I know that 18 months later "Chelsea" would be diagnosed with terminal liver disease. Without Zephyr I don't know if I could have handled it. He gave me strength and comfort.

Zephyr had learned everything "Chelsea" could do as a service dog just by watching her. He was amazing. He even could take the socks off my feet without touching my toes. During "Chelsea's" illness, Zephyr began to take over the house duties, giving "Chelsea" a rest. He could pick up anything, get the cordless phone, carry bundles, helped with the laundry - he was a godsend. I don't know what I would have done if he was not with us.

"Chelsea" survived 15 months after her diagnosis. She passed away in my arms on a rainy and windy Friday night, 4 months to the day after celebrating her 8th birthday, knowing it would be her last. Zephyr and I grieved together.

Zephyr continued to be my inside helper and demo dog, visiting many schools and community groups, as well as Children's Hospital. He came with me on our DRU home checks, often sitting in the laps of prospective adopters. He won many hearts and helped many Dobes get adopted.

Zephyr is almost 9 now and retired, but he still helps in the house, and he loves to show off at DRU's annual picnics. His favorite place is on the loveseat, and he loves to watch TV. Although I have a new service dog, he and Zephyr are the best of friends, and Zephyr likes his job of being the house protector when Keefe and I are out. Life would not be complete for Zephyr if he didn't get his apple everyday and have DRU's picnics to look forward to so he can show off to everyone just what a great service dog a Doberman can be.

Ann & Dobes

[hockeymom]

SoCalyorkieluv, Lighten up, this is not a court room, it is just people giving different opinions on a subject. They are entitled to their own opinion. It is not necessary to beat them over the head with your point of view. Some of us just don't agree with you.

[Sydney'sMom]

I had a friend once who's mother is in a wheelchair and was very soap-boxy in her way of thinking about people with disabilities. For example she would get spitting mad if an able-bodied person used the automatic door button that opens building doors for those in wheelchairs. Now...personally...I generally pull doors open with my hands...but if I am carrying a large box I may be tempted to push the handicap door button to assist me. The flaw in my friend's theory is that by using that button, I (an able bodied person), are in no way ruining that button for those in wheelchairs. The button will work just the same for them whether I touched it or not.

I believe (just my opinion) that this is the same situation. There is no limit to the amount of service animals in circulation at any given time. If Joe Smo decides to falsely register his dog as a service animal...he may be doing something unethical...but he isn't keeping a handicapped person from getting one. We should be at a day and age when we realize that not all handicaps are visable. A deaf person doesn't look any different...sometimes neither does a blind person. Many diabetics use a service animal to sense their blood sugar before it becomes too low for them to function. All of these people would look as if they are not disabled.

I don't believe that this law will be tightened up due to abuse because it can't be. That would be crossing the fine line into discrimination. If some of our memebers need service dogs...I say more power to them. For those of our members that do not need/and would never consider a service dog...then don't register your pet.

[Carters Mom]

I think members are getting tired of having service animal statements crammed down their throats. I don't think there is a single member on this forum that hasn't seen at least one statement somewhere from one of the members saying that "my dogs are service animals." Its wearing thin. Get a t-shirt.

[minniemn]

Originally Posted by SoCalyorkiLvr

Here is an article from a migraine sufferer whose Doberman detects her migraines:

In 1986 I purchased my first home for one reason only - to have a fenced yard so I could buy a Doberman. I moved into my house in April, and in July I brought my little puppy "Chelsea" home. It also happened to be the same year I suffered an injury that left me permanently disabled. Little did I know the impact "Chelsea" would have on my life. She was my best friend, and a few years down the road became my service dog.

But one other great thing came out of our relationship. I became a DRU volunteer. I first started by doing home checks and of course, "Chelsea" always came with me. People fell in love with her and she helped many Dobes get adopted.

"Chelsea" gave me a reason for living and became the center of my life. As I could not bend, she learned to pick up things even as small as a dime, and also to bring me my walker. She loved to go grocery shopping and would help pull the cart and get items off the shelves for me. In the house she got clothes out of bottom drawers, even helped carry laundry and learned to fold sheets. She also was able to predict my chronic migraines and alert me so I could take medication to lessen the attack. We visited many schools and groups, showing people what service dogs could do, and even helped some get dogs. She also changed the thoughts of many in regard to Dobermans, as everyone just gravitated toward her.

When "Chelsea" was five, I fostered my first Dobe for DRU - an abandoned and abused young dog. I named him Zephyr, because despite his abuse, to me he was A Gentle Breeze as is the definition of Zephyr in the dictionary. Well, we just couldn't let him go and I adopted Zephyr. He and "Chelsea" were the best of friends. When we would do home checks, I would bring both of them and Zephyr, having natural ears, made many who had put "cropped only" down on their applications, change their minds and adopt natural eared dobes. He also became both a therapy and service dog and would join us when we visited various places.

Little did I know that 18 months later "Chelsea" would be diagnosed with terminal liver disease. Without Zephyr I don't know if I could have handled it. He gave me strength and comfort.

Zephyr had learned everything "Chelsea" could do as a service dog just by watching her. He was amazing. He even could take the socks off my feet without touching my toes. During "Chelsea's" illness, Zephyr began to take over the house duties, giving "Chelsea" a rest. He could pick up anything, get the cordless phone, carry bundles, helped with the laundry - he was a godsend. I don't know what I would have done if he was not with us.

"Chelsea" survived 15 months after her diagnosis. She passed away in my arms on a rainy and windy Friday night, 4 months to the day after celebrating her 8th birthday, knowing it would be her last. Zephyr and I grieved together.

Zephyr continued to be my inside helper and demo dog, visiting many schools and community groups, as well as Children's Hospital. He came with me on our DRU home checks, often sitting in the laps of prospective adopters. He won many hearts and helped many Dobes get adopted.

Zephyr is almost 9 now and retired, but he still helps in the house, and he loves to show off at DRU's annual picnics. His favorite place is on the loveseat, and he loves to watch TV. Although I have a new service dog, he and Zephyr are the best of friends, and Zephyr likes his job of being the house protector when Keefe and I are out. Life would not be complete for Zephyr if he didn't get his apple everyday and have DRU's picnics to look forward to so he can show off to everyone just what a great service dog a Doberman can be.

Ann & Dobes

But this lady had more issues going on than mirgraines... she could not bend ect... this dog did ALOT more than detect migraines, she got things off the shelf when shopping ect... Some migraines are terrible, with intense pain.... and I am not denying the fact that some anxieties are debilitating... and having a dog to detect them, comfort them ect is great- but service dogs are so much more than that... they help disabled people do normal everyday functions... answer the phone, pick up things, detect seizures, alert the owner to many things, open the fridge, be eyes for the blind and ears for the deaf.

I think the above story isn't just about a dog who could detect migraines, it is about a dog who helped a lady live life, and aided her in activities of daily living.

I don't know if you are finding story after story to change my mind, or if it is for general knowledge... but there is a HUGE difference in someone who NEEDS a service dog for daily function, and one who may be able to find some disability they have to get their dog licensed so they can take their dog with them into stores.

We all have some sort of disability if we look hard enough, but we all don't NEED a service dog- like I tell my kids there is a HUGE difference between a NEED and a WANT.

I have a handicap parking sticker, BUT there are days I don't NEED it, do I use it anyways? NO WAY, there is no way I am going to take a spot when I know there is someone else who will need it more than me that day. There are days I do need it, and I use it- (I mean really need it, not just because it is raining or I only have a couple things to get, or I am running late- there is a difference in this sort of need and a real need)

There are people who abuse every sort of system out there to help those in need, which unfortunatly takes away from those in real need... hopefully people here will consider twice before running to get their dog licensed as a service dog for a "disability" that chances are, 50-60 percent of people here have, just so they can "legally" bring their dog into stores.

I am not talking about disabilities that affect your daily life, to a point where you can not perform activities of daily living.

Thanks JackandJill, I didn't expect to read that... I appreciate the compliment.

[Carters Mom]

Originally Posted by minniemn

But this lady had more issues going on than mirgraines... she could not bend ect... this dog did ALOT more than detect migraines, she got things off the shelf when shopping ect... Some migraines are terrible, with intense pain.... and I am not denying the fact that some anxieties are debilitating... and having a dog to detect them, comfort them ect is great- but service dogs are so much more than that... they help disabled people do normal everyday functions... answer the phone, pick up things, detect seizures, alert the owner to many things, open the fridge, be eyes for the blind and ears for the deaf.

I think the above story isn't just about a dog who could detect migraines, it is about a dog who helped a lady live life, and aided her in activities of daily living.

I don't know if you are finding story after story to change my mind, or if it is for general knowledge... but there is a HUGE difference in someone who NEEDS a service dog for daily function, and one who may be able to find some disability they have to get their dog licensed so they can take their dog with them into stores.

We all have some sort of disability if we look hard enough, but we all don't NEED a service dog- like I tell my kids there is a HUGE difference between a NEED and a WANT.

I have a handicap parking sticker, BUT there are days I don't NEED it, do I use it anyways? NO WAY, there is no way I am going to take a spot when I know there is someone else who will need it more than me that day. There are days I do need it, and I use it- (I mean really need it, not just because it is raining or I only have a couple things to get, or I am running late- there is a difference in this sort of need and a real need)

There are people who abuse every sort of system out there to help those in need, which unfortunatly takes away from those in real need... hopefully people here will consider twice before running to get their dog licensed as a service dog for a "disability" that chances are, 50-60 percent of people here have, just so they can "legally" bring their dog into stores.

I am not talking about disabilities that affect your daily life, to a point where you can not perform activities of daily living.

Thanks JackandJill, I didn't expect to read that... I appreciate the compliment.

A M E N !!!

[pixiepooh]

Originally Posted by red98vett

I had to comment one more time - I can understand the rule about dogs in stores where food is sold....but in CABELA'S it's HUNTING stuff - no food so I don't see the reasoning of the employees thinking about a yorkie in a stroller at all....I think you did the right thing contacting them and your hubby was GREAT to say what he said !! Way to go hubby !

I totally agree. If it were a grocery store or perhaps a deli, I wouldn't mind if an employee would ask me not to bring my dogs in... As long as they say it nicely. The last time I was asked not to bring my baby with me was at Fry's electronics. I was told that because they have a cafe' in the middle of the store, bringing a dog in the vicinity would be considered a health code violation. I would've understood that if he didn't stretch his arms out blocking my way to enter the store as if I was some filthy animal trying to get in.... I was furious!!! I just said "Excuse me, I understood what you said. You don't have to do that." If I wasn't carrying my baby with me, it wouldn't be pretty