I agree that they should not cost more money and neither should "teacups" but most people who are looking to buy a puppy have not been told this. And sadly....most people buy from a pet store because they don't know how to or don't try to find a breeder themselves. Some go in to buy pet food for another pet in the home and fall in love. It's hard not too.
Thats why we need to inform more people on the streets about the puppy mills and pet store link.

Good luck with the puppy if you choose him. He will be different just try not to believe everything you're told at the pet store about him being worth more.

Don't let it get to you. Those who oppose them have a right to their opinions too.

This issue comes up over and over again. I don't understand, how breeding chocolates, goldens or partis etc is going to RUIN the breed.

The traditionsal yorkies will always be there and nothing is going to RUIN them. The untraditional colored yorkies, will make their own way, just as the Yorkshire Terrier breed made it's own way.

I believe there is room for all of them. And I would consider myself a very lucky person if I had 2 of each color. Variety is the spice of life.

A rose by any other name is still a rose.

chocolate yorkies
 

Yep, I am opinionated when it comes to "rare" colored Yorkies being produced over and over and over again just for the $$$$$. Has anyone ever read the AKC standard for the Yorkie??? Let me know where it says chocolate and partie colors are acceptable!! If it werent for the indescriminate back yard breeders, there would be no need for the AKC standard. All breeders would be responsible enough to have "rare" color producers and the offspring spayed and neutered. All Yorkies produced would look like Yorkies, shaded tan and gun metal blue silk hair, being of prime importance. I dont think chocolate or partie was mentioned anywhere. If we didnt have an AKC standard, breeders would just breed willy, nilly and there would be no Yorkie. It took generations for breeders to get the standard where it is today. It will only take one generation to ruin it. And Im not saying that these "rare" colored puppies dont deserve love. All puppies need love and companionship. Its great when I hear of puppies finding loving for-ever homes. THEY JUST DONT NEED TO BE BRED!!! Im am glad to hear that the Biewer breeders are coming together and forming their own breed club with its own standards for that breed. I notice its different than the Yorkie standard. I wonder when people will be selling "rare" solid black Biewers?? As with the Yorkie, the "rare" color producer and offspring should be spayed or neutered. I am not writing this to hurt any feelings or stomp on any toes. but to hopefully educate breeders about the importance of standards and why we should all strive to enforce them. Just think, everytime someone buys a "rare" colored puppy, the breeder is being rewarded for poor breeding practices. And I am not just talking about puppy mills that fill the pet stores.

And to the person who wants a chocolate yorkie, I am sure the puppy is as cute as a bugs ear!!!!! Make your own decision and buy what ever pleases you. Just dont buy form a pet store. Do your homework. Dont just buy color, buy for good health also.

Ok, you can all slam me now!!!!! Lynn

Please Do Not Buy From A Pet Store!!!!!!!

I just want to know how the standard yorkie is going to be RUINED.

I would imagine way back when, when breeders were mixing all those different breeds together, that make up the yorkshire terrier, the breeders of all those other breeds were just as appaled. And were just as determined that their BREED was going to be RUINED.

Nothing got RUINED and we ended up with the beautiful little yorkies that we love today. These off colors cannot be shown, the standard is not going to change, so where is the harm?

I doubt anyone is going to slam you at all. It's and opinion and we all have one.

I just wonder how the Yorkie itself started?? I thought I read somewhere that noone really knows exactly where the Yorkshire Terrier came from, but the do know the breed is a result of intermingling of the Waterside Terrier, English Terrier, and Paisley and Clydsdale Terrier. Maybe more!! I guess all AKC breeds started somewhere.
I wonder if any of those dogs carried the white we see coming up today? Who knows....I just hope every puppy out there, even if it's purple gets a loving home.

That standard will not be ruined. It stands as it is, and as you say the off colors cannot be shown. As, long as there is a public that will purchase these off colored dogs, there will be breeders, breeding to sell for exhorbant prices to the unsuspecting public.

Yes, there were various breeds that were used to breed the Yorkshire Terrier. However, it was done with a reason. In the 1700 and 1800, serfs were not allowed to have larger dogs. It was English Law and they could be punished for having such. Therefore, they performed various breedings to develope smaller dogs that would serve a purpose....ratters, rabbit hunters, etc. They did not do it for the purpose of the almighty $$$$. Most of the breeds that were used to make up the Yorkshire Terrier are now extinct.

Thank you! I agree :thumbup:

I read that they were bred to keep Millers, Miners, and factory men company and were small enough to fit in their duffle bag! Then the wealthy women took them over raising the price making them highly sought after....Not sure though I just wasnt there. Well whatever reason it was i am glad they did it!

Huddersfield Ben, known as the Grandfather of Yorkies...was not a small dog.

It's true they were breed by millers and factory men for ratting. They really didn't become popular, if you could call it that, until the late 1800, early 1900.

Have you seen pictures of Little Sir Model.....my gosh his coat looked like a brillo pad. As a matter of fact even in the seventies, black soft coated dogs were being shown and didn't evolve to the type of coat that is described in the standard until the eighties and early ninties.

chocolate yorkie
 

If I am not mistakened, I thought that reputable, responsible dog breeders were only breeding to IMPROVE the breed, not just create puppies to sell. I also thought that reputable, responsible dog breeders used the AKC standard for the breed as a guidline when breeding a litter.(or Canadian Kennel Club standard, etc) So, if many breeders are not following the standard in order to create "rare" colors, then arent they "breeding down" and in a sense, "ruining" the breed by purposely not following the standard? Isnt it the same if someone started breeding Yorkies with the "rare" curley hair or the "rare" blue eyes or the "rare" short hair? How about a "rare" top-line like a Bedlington Terrier? HMMMMMMM.................

IF YOU CAN BREED IT THE $$$$$$ WILL COME

Well, you all know how I feel about "rare" Yorkies now!! Sorry if I dont agree with all of you, hope I educated some of you, and I didnt mean to step on toes and hurt feelings. I know all of you LOVE your "rare" yorkies more than life itsself and I know you spoil them rotten!!!!! Just as it should be. I will get off my soap box now. Lynn

Amen!

i actually own a chocolate and would love to find a Parti.i have to wait for my Parti because of their current price.what i see is a bunch of people basically lying because they are too afraid to just say that these colours are rare.yes i said it!they are rare-no way around it.here'e the definition of rare
rare 1 (râr)
adj. rar·er, rar·est
1. Infrequently occurring; uncommon: a rare event.
2. Excellent; extraordinary.
3. Thin in density: rarefied.
i do not get why so many people are aganst saying that they are rare.its a fact-plain and simple!how many of these different colours have you seen?how many of you have ever seen a chocolate or Parti in person?i can't personally afford the cost of a Parti right now but can understand why they cost what they do.a little thing called supply and demand.that's where the word RARE comes into play.the cost is high because the supply is low.i spent quite a bit on my chocolate but this was my choice.i don't think that a person should be knocked for wanting to buy a yorkie that is a different colour than what others are used to seeing.

I don't know why I am going to bother trying to get through to people but I guess I will give it a try.
If you happened to have noticed, purebreds have a breed standard regardless of the breed you are talking aobut. Colour in some breeds can vary, in others it doesn't. There are parameters of what you would expect that purebred to look like.
The Yorkie of today was developed to look like what we have today including the colour parameters. Chocolate, Parti colour and blue born are not inlcuded. Therefore, as in any other purebred, the responsible Yorkie breeder would not try to breed for wrong colours.
I have known one reputable breeder that ended up with one chocolate coloured puppy and went back into the pedigree contacted the kennels involved and they were able to figure out how it happned. Not for the purpose of try to produce it again but for the purpose that it will never happen again. The chocolate coloured puppy was raised with the rest and once he was old enough he went to a lovely pet home of a friend of a friend and is very much loved and cherished as a neutered pet. He was not sold, he was given free of charge to someone that could be trusted to give good care to this dog.
It is not unusual in any breed of dog to end up with a very wrong colour or mismark in the spotted breeds. Rare is always used to describe a wrong colour for the purpose of charging outrageous prices. Any reputable breeder of any breed will not PURPOSELY produce a wrong colour. When it happens, it certainly can go to a nice pet home but not for big bucks because it is 'rare' and that is providing health issues haven't gone along with it which from what I understand is always the case with blue born Yorkies.
The YOrkie was not meant to be a Potpourri of colours. There are other breeds that are and they are not 'rare' colours.

It seems no one ever mentions that black and gold, black and tan and Blue and gold are also not included in the breeds Color Standards. I only hear people complain about chocolate, parti, golden and blue? The Black and gold, black and tan and blue and golds who once entered the show ring and won, are now automatically disqualified because they are considered "off colored" too as per the new YTCA ruling.

Well in a perfect world (which this is not) NO ONE would be allowed to breed until every dog in this world and in every shelter found a home...on the other side of the coin not everyone cares about breed standards or improving a breed..not saying its right...its just the way it is. Luckily humans dont have to live up to a standard way to look..lol..we could only be a certain height, weight..have a certain eye colour, hair colour etc..to me a dog is a dog and every dog deserves a loving home. So if a chocolate yorkie is what you want I say go for it...BUT..check your local rescue group too!! If I could have been approved from our local rescue group ALL my yorkies would be rescued ones.

Good luck!!

Dawn

So let me see if I understand you right. You don't believe that breeders should breed to sell. they should only breed to "improve" the breed.

Now I can see someone breeding to improve their own line, but to improve the breed??? What needs to be improved???? There are champions galore out there.

And if you think yorkies are expensive now, take all of the casual breeders out of the picture and imagine what they would cost if only show breeders sold puppies.

Oh that's right, they wouldn't cost more because show breeders "GiVE AWAY" , or sell for a nominal fee, their puppies that don't meet the standard.

Do I have it right???

I will say that most of us breeder/exhibitors breed for ourselves first. And I will say that most would be surprised those that we do sell, are sold for much less than those breeders that are breeding only to sell puppies.

I know I wouldn't want to sell heartache, and not knowing if some underlying problem existed in a wee one, I wouldn't sell it for an astromical price, I'd place it in a home that knew how to care for a dinky.

Would I sell a rare colored puppy.....no, I'd spay/nueter it and place it.

Oh My! This Thread Has Gone Crazy Lol

what was the original point of this thread???

The Person Just Wanted To Know What We Though About Chocolate Yorkies Because He/she Was Thinking About Buying One (from A Pet Store) But I Think We Scared Whoever It Was Away Anyways.


I Think A Lot Of People Have Kept Their Mouth Shuts On This One Because I See No One (that I Have Read) That Has A Chocolate Yorkie Has Jumped In.

I don't think it's gone crazy.

There is a bit of debate going on, but no screaming, yelling or name calling going on.

What you definately see is breeders from both sides of the spectrum discussing their point of views. Another educational process....each person must make their own decision when breeding and/or purchasing a puppy.

I don't think that is true. Acceptable colors are Blue/Gold, Black/Gold, Blue/Tan, Black/Tan. Can any of you show breeders verify this?

You might be the exception to the rule. From what I understand, show breeders set their prices according to how many champions there are in the pedigree. The more champions, the higher the price.

I would not want to sell heartache either. I researched my breeder before I bought from her and I believe my dogs to have come from good healthy stock. I want to develop my own line and work on improving it for my own satisfaction, I have no interest in showing.

Just because a dog is not of show quality, does not mean that it has health issues. In fact from what I understand many champion lines develop health issues just because of the selective breeding. Which is not to say that all show dogs have health issues.

On this forum, the term reputable, responsible breeder is used synonomously with show breeder. Not all show breeders are reputable and honest, and not all non show breeders are disreputable and irresponsible.

I enjoy breeding but do not have the desire or the money to show, does that make me a bad peron.

Not any more. It is now Blue/tan only. So there are a lot of Champions out there that no longer meet the standard.

Yes, there are 4 boxes when registering a yorkie pup. And Parti yorkies can be AKC registered. The difference is that only what is identified in the standard is able to be shown. In a perfect world this would be true, however, as an exhibitor, I've seen so many yorkies in the ring, from black to the very pale platnium. What I do know is the Standard has been opened up, a Disqualification written in to prevent the Parti from being shown, but in doing so it has really added emphasis on the coat. When emphasis should be added on, health, structure and temperament.

Lynn, like you, I try to educate people.

The chocolate gene works the same way the Parti gene works and it can remain hidden in our yorkies for many, many generations. Just because you don't see it, doesn't mean the gene isn't there; it's a recessive gene. When a dog has one of theses recessive genes and breeds a dog with no recessive chocolate (or parti) gene, the pups will look like your standard colored yorkie. But if a dog with the recessive gene breeds another dog with that same recessive gene, you'll get "colorful" pups.

I'm not trying to battle over this, I'm just trying to get people to open their minds and really think about things ...

This breed began by breeding terrier type dogs of unknown heritage, bloodlines and pedigrees together. To say our yorkies have NO possibility of ever having a parti or chocolate or golden colored descendant in the early beginnings of this breed, seems a little unrealistic.

You say that off standard colored dogs (parti, chocolate, golden) should be neutered and spayed, as well as their traditional colored sire and dam who both carry the recessive gene? What about their non colorful offspring? Approximately 50% of their traditional colored pups will be carriers of this gene. Should we neuter the entire litter and all previous litters from either of these parents (to be safe?) How many generations back should you cull, and neuter and spay? If the parents were carriers, one of their parents (on both the dam and sire side) were carriers and the generation before, and before and so on and so on, all had to have a parent pass on the recessive gene.

Even though Blue and Tan has always been the color standard, Black and gold, Black and tan and Blue and Gold yorkies were allowed into the show ring and many won their champion status but with the new color rule that went into effect, these dogs are now officially considered "off color" and will not be allowed into the show ring ... should we also neuter/spay theses colors too?

It's the genes from our dogs early ancestors, that are still showing up in our dogs today. Double doses of these recessive genes (one gene from mom and one from dad), will produce off colored, "colorful" pups or the lack of a gene will produce off colored, non colorful pups (no grey gene will make a dogs coat be black and not blue).

This is a breed registry and not a color registry. There is a standard for type, color and size that is set as a goal to achieve in the show ring. But if your purebred yorkshire terrier has a black coat, or a floppy ear, or is a 1/2 lb over the standard, should they automatically be neutered and given away to a loving home?

So where do we draw the line? If the pup is the product of 2 AKC registered yorkshire terriers, why should they be considered any less purebred because their color is different from their blue and tan full siblings color?

Parti, golden and chocolate are not genetic freaks of nature and they are not any more prone to disease or complications than traditional colored yorkies. If they meet the balance of the standards (quality, type, size ...) why should their color force them to be given away or neutered? AKC recognizes and registers these colors, they just can't be shown in classes that strictly adhere to the set breed standards.

You might be the exception to the rule. From what I understand, show breeders set their prices according to how many champions there are in the pedigree. The more champions, the higher the price.

Not so....I know several well known breeders, as well as myself that have unbroken champion lines going back as far as 10 generations or more....their prices are not set according to how many champions in their line. It has amazed me the prices of some breeders have set that have a minimal of champions way back in the pedigree. And yes, I'm amazed at the price of Biewers and Parti Yorkies, some much more than I or other exhibitor breeders would sell a show dog for.


Just because a dog is not of show quality, does not mean that it has health issues. In fact from what I understand many champion lines develop health issues just because of the selective breeding. Which is not to say that all show dogs have health issues.

Selective breeding minimizes health issues. I would hope any breeder show or otherwise would conduct selective breeding.

On this forum, the term reputable, responsible breeder is used synonomously with show breeder. Not all show breeders are reputable and honest, and not all non show breeders are disreputable and irresponsible.

You are right, not all exhibitor/breeders are responsible. As not all breeders are on YT are responsible either. And their should be no deliniation between the hobby breeder and the show breeder, we do it for different reasons, but the process and the outcome should be the same for the good of the breed