trials and tribulations of rescuing! - Page 3 - YorkieTalk.com Forums

Teresa Ford · 04-21-2013, 02:47 PM

I understand your sadness. There is a Yorkie out there that is just right for you. We and several retired friends search the newspapers, CL and on line for Yorkies or Yorkie mixes we can rescue. We foster them, get them Vet care, spay or neuter and rehome. So I believe there is a forever home for every Yorkie. I hope you find each other soon.
PS Senior dogs are perfect for Seniors who need a Yorkie to love. Hugs

yorkietalkjilly · 04-21-2013, 02:57 PM

I went through what you are going through for over a year and just got so sick and tired of not finding my small dog that finally I gave up and called my last Yorkie's breeder out of sheer desperation. I went to see some Yorkie pups she'd been given to rehome but wound up coming home with a 9 mo. old Tibbe. He was almost feral as he'd been in a cage for 9 mos. and he'd come along with the pups, their mother and another female, to the breeder to find homes for. It can be so heartbreaking to try to find a little dog going the rescue route and some expect you to take whatever they suggest for you or you lose place with them. I turned down a Chinese Crested with one rescue and they never emailed or called again. But eventually I got my Yorkie baby and in time with training, he turned into a wonderful pet! The Best! Try not to lose heart and keep searching. When you do find your baby, all is good. But boy, it is sad always coming home dogless. Every single dog I signed up for at the dog shelter I was #2 - after a rescue organization! I would go up the morning of claiming with my carrier, water, leash, toy and hope and come home so sad, as the rescue lady walked out with the dog I wanted so. It gets really old. I can understand what you are going through.

ladyjane · 04-21-2013, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teresa Ford

I understand your sadness. There is a Yorkie out there that is just right for you. We and several retired friends search the newspapers, CL and on line for Yorkies or Yorkie mixes we can rescue. We foster them, get them Vet care, spay or neuter and rehome. So I believe there is a forever home for every Yorkie. I hope you find each other soon.
PS Senior dogs are perfect for Seniors who need a Yorkie to love. Hugs

Indeed!

Belle Noir · 04-25-2013, 02:22 AM

Nathan Winograd has an excellent post regarding this very thing.
Because of the attitude with so many rescues, I have decided to NOT bother, and instead of adopting, I will be shopping. I do not think that I should have to beg about hunt and peck and HOPE and PRAY that I am not only approved, but then I can actually GET the dog that caught my eye and tugged at my heart strings, or be forever blacklisted because they wanted me to buy a dog from them that I did NOT want, because they decided this dog was the dog for me and I didn't agree.
Example, I am looking at buying land. This is a done deal, the only question is where and when. I'd like a large breed that is historically known to be good with livestock. One of the breeds I was thinking of was something like a great pyrenese or anatolian or related breed, which are live stock guardian breeds. I figure when I get some goats and chickens, the dog would feel right at home.
Except... The one rescue I looked at (first on the search) there is a fenced yard requirement... Ummm.. I plan on having at least 10 acres, looking for 25, and you want me to FENCE that? I'm not going to bother continuing to look, there are plenty of LSG breeders that I can buy a puppy from with no hassle.
Even were I not interested in a dog that would be happy with 10-25 acres to run in, a LOT of rescues have a NEVER off leash policy.
Well, I am a member of a members only dog park. It's lovely, double gated, agility equipment, pools, toys.. Perfect place for a dog to get off leash and stretch it's legs. But so many say NEVER off leash when out of your home. Letting one of these dogs off leash in the double gated dog park, would be breaking those rescues rules.
That ALSO means I couldn't do things like agility or rally or earth dogging. Add to that that MOST rescues have a clause in their contract that means you do not actually own your dog, and they can repossess said dog should you be found to be in violation of their rules.
That means if I adopted a yorkie from a rescue that said no small children and I decide to have one more kid before the baby factory closes, they could TAKE my dog back for being in violation of their rules (if one of the rules was no children under X age), no matter how long I actually had the dog, because they NEVER gave up LEGAL ownership of said dog.
That means if I adopted a papillon from a rescue that had those rules and the dog was THAT good to make it to top agility trials, and someone from that rescue happened to see us on TV (it could happen), it's possible that they could (and would have a legal right to) repossess my dog.
Thank you, no. I'm not going to go through that. I am not going to jump through hoops to give someone MY money, so that we can both feel better about ourselves for rescuing.

And now for the link, which is more interesting than anything I may have to say...
Good Homes Need Not Apply : Nathan J Winograd

I also find this post interesting
The Lie at the Heart of the Killing : Nathan J Winograd

I'm not saying rescue is a bad thing. Of course not. And there are some rescuers that are saints in my books. But there are a number of people with severe control issues, and I'm just not going to do it. More power to those who do and will, and have the patience. I feel people like that are blessed with a fortitude I do not have.
I WILL foster, though, just not for a rescue that thinks that after 9 years a cat that has been in rescue since it was a kitten finally finding his forever home is a good thing. (in the first blog post somewhere, it's a long one and a good read, I think).
We had Fatty for a couple weeks. Long enough to get to know her, her quirks, temperament, level of training and housebreaking, get her prettied up, cause a matted pee stained maltese is NOT nice to look at. The first family was NOT a fit, the second family fell through, the third family was perfect. If I had had Fatty longer than a month, I would wonder why, since this was a dog with VERY few faults as a pet goes. (perfect temperament, except she wanted to be fun police when the puppies got a but wild), calm, great with older kids, (don't have any smaller kids to test her with), great with cats, great with other small dogs, except for the fun police thing, never saw her in action with a big dog, but she was so laid back, I doubt if it was going to be a problem and I was right, since her new family lives next to Rotties, and she plays with them every day...
Her only faults was HORRIBLE breath, (that's how I found out she likes tums as a treat, her breath was that bad and I gave her a mint one as a joke and she took it and begged for more), and being a bit gimpy, since her claws were so long that we could not trim them back as far as they needed to be trimmed which would take time, trimming bit by bit as the quick receded, and that she was lazy, in part from her hurting feet (now fixed) and in part cause she was just sooooo FAT (now fixed).. Plus she is an older lady (no time machine, she's just going to get older)... She has a right to be a bit lazy.
Had she been there much longer than she was, I WOULD have kept her, because after a while, the dog starts to think that they ARE home. You foster a dog for more than 2 months (not including puppies and kittens), you may as well keep the dog, because the dog has bonded to you, and it hurts the dog to be ripped away from yet another home and family. The dog can get depressed, be standoffish, and possibly not bond, because it's afraid to get close in case they lose that family too, and a dog can take years to get over it.
I often wonder if that's the reason that Sabre is as aloof as he is, that at almost 14 weeks, he had bonded to the breeders family and is afraid to get close to us.

Britster · 04-25-2013, 05:38 AM

I don't feel guilty about seeking out a breeder dog next time around because responsible breeders aren't the problem anyway. Any reputable breeder will always take back a dog if for any reason the owner no longer can keep it, so that their dogs don't end up in the shelters. It's the puppy millers and the BYB's that are the problem, IMO, so by purchasing a dog (from a reputable breeder), you are not contributing to the problem, if that makes sense.

I know with me personally, I'm at a point in my life where a lot of things will be changing soon, and my dog(s) will always be a part of that, but a rescue may not be comfortable with my lifestyle and that's fine. The possibility that I'll be renting within the next year is very high. Within the next 10 years, I am sure there will be new relationships, there could be a baby, never know! Could be an apartment, could be a house, but there's a lot of "don't really know" yet and I completely understand that a rescue may not want to risk it not working out for whatever reason. After all, there ARE a lot of folks my age (22) who would be horrible dog owner candidates, lol. I know and I'm not one of them but the few breeders I've spoken with are very open to anything, they've gotten to know me, and feel I'd be a great home for one of their dogs.

Another reason I want a dog from a GOOD breeder is because it's something we've never done before in our family. I've always wanted to have a breeder to go back to for questions, be able to see my pups family and pedigree, and have that added resource. After I got Jackson from a BYB, I e-mailed her a picture and said how thrilled I was with my little guy, and never even got a reply. Go figure. And I have very specific wants in a dog that would be hard to come by in rescue.

Anyway, I guess all I am saying is that nobody should feel guilty or feel like they HAVE to get a rescue dog. I think it's an amazing thing and I will have a rescue dog someday when the time is right.

I'm going a little off topic, but I think there's a certain 'stigma' out there now (I see it all over FB) ... 'Adopt, Don't Shop!' etc etc, and I hate that people who get dogs from breeders are often looked down upon in today's world. Even at the dog park, I notice it. "Oh, he's a rescue" and they say it sometimes snobby (not everybody, obviously, but I've seen it happen). And I've seen people give others 'looks' when they say they got their dog from a breeder.

I think if we could work together and meet somewhere in the middle that'd be great. And I'm saying generic 'we' -- not YT specifically, lol. Like the breeder I've contacted does a lot of rescue work as well as breeding. And I guess it can be kind of an oxymoron to some people, LOL, but it's entirely possible to do both.

I'm rambling... sorry! haha.

DBlain · 04-25-2013, 06:52 AM

Like the breeder I've contacted does a lot of rescue work as well as breeding. And I guess it can be kind of an oxymoron to some people, LOL, but it's entirely possible to do both. posted by Britster

I think I understand a lot of how you feel and how both sides of this can be blurred

this topic is so conflicting and troublesome to me that I almost feel like two people when I think about it. I have supported shelters and now rescue groups for a long time by doing both volunteer work and sending donations, yet I have never owned a rescue dog, so I have to admit I feel guilty. Which I guess is good because when I really feel guilty I usually send more money. But in my heart I know I will not adopt a puppy, first because it is so hard to get the right one and second because not all but many have come from puppy mill surrenders. Before Yorkie Talk and facebook I not only thought about it but I tried. But now I have read so many break your heart and pocket book stories about puppy mill dogs that I would prefer to take my chances with a breeder.

So many people feel that as a YT member it is their responsibility to educate people on how to purchase a good yorkie. So when someone buys from a pet store, most here get upset and rightfully so telling the new owner about the health risks of a dog that most likely was bred in a puppy mill. Yet when someone adopts or is thinking about adopting a puppy where no history is known or the dog is in fact a puppy mill surrender everyone applauds with no questions asked. Yet both pups most likely started life in very similar situations. In my heart I love the fact that someone adopts these pups but my mind can't help wondering if they are prepared or have even thought about all those questions we ask of the pet store buyer. This is why I feel like two different people because I feel that it's OK to warn a pet store buyer but not an adopter even though they are facing the same risks, am I the only one to feel like this, because it really tears me up inside.

I know this is not true but man I sometimes feel like ignorance is bliss

ladyjane · 04-25-2013, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Belle Noir

Nathan Winograd has an excellent post regarding this very thing.
Because of the attitude with so many rescues, I have decided to NOT bother, and instead of adopting, I will be shopping. I do not think that I should have to beg about hunt and peck and HOPE and PRAY that I am not only approved, but then I can actually GET the dog that caught my eye and tugged at my heart strings, or be forever blacklisted because they wanted me to buy a dog from them that I did NOT want, because they decided this dog was the dog for me and I didn't agree.
Example, I am looking at buying land. This is a done deal, the only question is where and when. I'd like a large breed that is historically known to be good with livestock. One of the breeds I was thinking of was something like a great pyrenese or anatolian or related breed, which are live stock guardian breeds. I figure when I get some goats and chickens, the dog would feel right at home.
Except... The one rescue I looked at (first on the search) there is a fenced yard requirement... Ummm.. I plan on having at least 10 acres, looking for 25, and you want me to FENCE that? I'm not going to bother continuing to look, there are plenty of LSG breeders that I can buy a puppy from with no hassle.
Even were I not interested in a dog that would be happy with 10-25 acres to run in, a LOT of rescues have a NEVER off leash policy.
Well, I am a member of a members only dog park. It's lovely, double gated, agility equipment, pools, toys.. Perfect place for a dog to get off leash and stretch it's legs. But so many say NEVER off leash when out of your home. Letting one of these dogs off leash in the double gated dog park, would be breaking those rescues rules.
That ALSO means I couldn't do things like agility or rally or earth dogging. Add to that that MOST rescues have a clause in their contract that means you do not actually own your dog, and they can repossess said dog should you be found to be in violation of their rules.
That means if I adopted a yorkie from a rescue that said no small children and I decide to have one more kid before the baby factory closes, they could TAKE my dog back for being in violation of their rules (if one of the rules was no children under X age), no matter how long I actually had the dog, because they NEVER gave up LEGAL ownership of said dog.
That means if I adopted a papillon from a rescue that had those rules and the dog was THAT good to make it to top agility trials, and someone from that rescue happened to see us on TV (it could happen), it's possible that they could (and would have a legal right to) repossess my dog.
Thank you, no. I'm not going to go through that. I am not going to jump through hoops to give someone MY money, so that we can both feel better about ourselves for rescuing.

And now for the link, which is more interesting than anything I may have to say...
Good Homes Need Not Apply : Nathan J Winograd

I also find this post interesting
The Lie at the Heart of the Killing : Nathan J Winograd

I'm not saying rescue is a bad thing. Of course not. And there are some rescuers that are saints in my books. But there are a number of people with severe control issues, and I'm just not going to do it. More power to those who do and will, and have the patience. I feel people like that are blessed with a fortitude I do not have.
I WILL foster, though, just not for a rescue that thinks that after 9 years a cat that has been in rescue since it was a kitten finally finding his forever home is a good thing. (in the first blog post somewhere, it's a long one and a good read, I think).
We had Fatty for a couple weeks. Long enough to get to know her, her quirks, temperament, level of training and housebreaking, get her prettied up, cause a matted pee stained maltese is NOT nice to look at. The first family was NOT a fit, the second family fell through, the third family was perfect. If I had had Fatty longer than a month, I would wonder why, since this was a dog with VERY few faults as a pet goes. (perfect temperament, except she wanted to be fun police when the puppies got a but wild), calm, great with older kids, (don't have any smaller kids to test her with), great with cats, great with other small dogs, except for the fun police thing, never saw her in action with a big dog, but she was so laid back, I doubt if it was going to be a problem and I was right, since her new family lives next to Rotties, and she plays with them every day...
Her only faults was HORRIBLE breath, (that's how I found out she likes tums as a treat, her breath was that bad and I gave her a mint one as a joke and she took it and begged for more), and being a bit gimpy, since her claws were so long that we could not trim them back as far as they needed to be trimmed which would take time, trimming bit by bit as the quick receded, and that she was lazy, in part from her hurting feet (now fixed) and in part cause she was just sooooo FAT (now fixed).. Plus she is an older lady (no time machine, she's just going to get older)... She has a right to be a bit lazy.
Had she been there much longer than she was, I WOULD have kept her, because after a while, the dog starts to think that they ARE home. You foster a dog for more than 2 months (not including puppies and kittens), you may as well keep the dog, because the dog has bonded to you, and it hurts the dog to be ripped away from yet another home and family. The dog can get depressed, be standoffish, and possibly not bond, because it's afraid to get close in case they lose that family too, and a dog can take years to get over it.
I often wonder if that's the reason that Sabre is as aloof as he is, that at almost 14 weeks, he had bonded to the breeders family and is afraid to get close to us.

I am not a fan of Nathan Winograd and his No Kill philosophies.

And as for your thoughts on rescues, perhaps you might want to start a rescue yourself and turn the dogs you save over to just anyone who will do whatever they want to them including dumping them back on the streets. As for rescues taking dogs back, I have never had to do any such thing...nor have I feared for the pups I adopt out BECAUSE I am very careful and don't do as some would like me to do...just give them to anyone. I don't apologize for that. The dogs I rescue are indeed RESCUED.

ladyjane · 04-25-2013, 09:12 AM

And BTW: I have never looked down on anyone who chooses to purchase a puppy. People do what makes them comfortable. I have actually suggested people do just that when they cannot find what they are looking for.

Adoption is not for everyone...and honestly there are many people who would not be approved.

The other thing is that IF a person wants to rescue a pup and they don't like that rescue is picky, then they can go to a shelter and adopt. Shelters don't usually take the time to do reference checks and home visits. Of course, if there are medical issues, the person is stuck with that....just like rescues are....and one has to wonder...IF they choose to pay the vetting for said dog, would they want to let just anyone have it if they didn't keep it? I think that people who bad mouth rescues are totally clueless about what a reputable rescue actually does.

capt_noonie · 04-25-2013, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ladyjane

And BTW: I have never looked down on anyone who chooses to purchase a puppy. People do what makes them comfortable. I have actually suggested people do just that when they cannot find what they are looking for.

Adoption is not for everyone...and honestly there are many people who would not be approved.

The other thing is that IF a person wants to rescue a pup and they don't like that rescue is picky, then they can go to a shelter and adopt. Shelters don't usually take the time to do reference checks and home visits. Of course, if there are medical issues, the person is stuck with that....just like rescues are....and one has to wonder...IF they choose to pay the vetting for said dog, would they want to let just anyone have it if they didn't keep it? I think that people who bad mouth rescues are totally clueless about what a reputable rescue actually does.

Teresiana · 04-25-2013, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DBlain

Like the breeder I've contacted does a lot of rescue work as well as breeding. And I guess it can be kind of an oxymoron to some people, LOL, but it's entirely possible to do both. posted by Britster

I think I understand a lot of how you feel and how both sides of this can be blurred

this topic is so conflicting and troublesome to me that I almost feel like two people when I think about it. I have supported shelters and now rescue groups for a long time by doing both volunteer work and sending donations, yet I have never owned a rescue dog, so I have to admit I feel guilty. Which I guess is good because when I really feel guilty I usually send more money. But in my heart I know I will not adopt a puppy, first because it is so hard to get the right one and second because not all but many have come from puppy mill surrenders. Before Yorkie Talk and facebook I not only thought about it but I tried. But now I have read so many break your heart and pocket book stories about puppy mill dogs that I would prefer to take my chances with a breeder.

So many people feel that as a YT member it is their responsibility to educate people on how to purchase a good yorkie. So when someone buys from a pet store, most here get upset and rightfully so telling the new owner about the health risks of a dog that most likely was bred in a puppy mill. Yet when someone adopts or is thinking about adopting a puppy where no history is known or the dog is in fact a puppy mill surrender everyone applauds with no questions asked. Yet both pups most likely started life in very similar situations. In my heart I love the fact that someone adopts these pups but my mind can't help wondering if they are prepared or have even thought about all those questions we ask of the pet store buyer. This is why I feel like two different people because I feel that it's OK to warn a pet store buyer but not an adopter even though they are facing the same risks, am I the only one to feel like this, because it really tears me up inside.

I know this is not true but man I sometimes feel like ignorance is bliss

I think there is a big difference between buying from pet store & adopting a mill puppy. When you are purchasing from a pet store, you are supporting these millers & a horrible industry by contributing to their profit. When a person shells out $2000 for a puppy, they expect a product worth $2000. Hence all the questions for the shop owner. Most people who purchase from pet stores don't know they're buying a mill puppy. It's so easy for people who are uneducated about the puppy mill industry to get suckered into the "our puppies come from small, reputable breeders who we've been working with for years" gimmick. As much as we want to believe that everyone knows that pet shop puppies come from mills, the truth is...they don't. We are dog lovers. We're not the average American. I think that the "Don't shop. Adopt." campaign is bringing more awareness to the issue. But it takes a long time to get that message across to every single person.

The type of person that adopts a dog from a rescue knows that pet shops sell mill puppies. They know that by adopting, there's a a very likely chance that the dog they'll be bringing home has an uncertain history & will have health issues. That's part of the reason why the application process is such a nightmare. Rescue/adoption organizations need to be certain that a specific dog goes to a home that will be able to care for any behavioral or health issues that dog may have. I admit the application process is grueling. But if a prospective adopter doesn't know what to expect from a rescue dog, you can be sure they'll know after the application process.

I have 3 rescues. Two are from mills & I have no clue as to the other one's history. He was an owner surrender & all I have is the paperwork the original owner filled out upon surrender. Before I brought any of them home, I was notified of their known history & health problems the rescue organization was aware of. But, since I was rescuing, I also knew that ANYTHING could happen in the future. When my youngest got horribly sick & was hospitalized twice, there was really nothing I could do except have her treated. I couldn't "blame" anyone. She's a rescue! I brought her home knowing she was born in a mill! However, if I had paid $2000 for her at a pet shop, you bet I'd be back there asking the shop for some kind of compensation for a defective product.

I chose to go with a breeder for my next pup. I'm not ashamed of that. I just knew that I wasn't up for the risk & responsibilty of rescuing this time. I'm not ashamed of that either. But that's the thing...rescuers already know the risks. I don't think we need to educate them.

DBlain · 04-25-2013, 03:50 PM

That's a good point Teresa, if those adopting are made fully aware of the risks then like you say it is their choice. It's just I have been reading some very sad and expensive problems recently I just hope that these folks are prepared.

ladyjane · 04-25-2013, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DBlain

That's a good point Teresa, if those adopting are made fully aware of the risks then like you say it is their choice. It's just I have been reading some very sad and expensive problems recently I just hope that these folks are prepared.

Most of the time you know what is up with a rescue if you adopt from a reputable group. Of course, there are always surprises, but they can come from a puppy purchased from a breeder. Let us not forget that every single rescue pup came from a breeder and I think many would be surprised to find out where they often originate from...they are not all from mills.

I personally carefully screen people and advise them of potential expenses for ANY yorkie. I also can usually tell by the vet check if a person is likely to go the extra mile for a pup. I don't ever want to adopt to someone who is either unable or unwilling to do what it takes to properly care for a pup. I would hope that most rescuers feel the same way.

Let us also not forget that more and more people are saying they "rescued" their pup...many of them bought them, found them, got them from a friend ... they just happen to call them rescues. Honestly, Donna, most reputable rescues do their level best to find out everything possible about each pup and take care of the medical issues prior to adoption.

ladyjane · 04-25-2013, 04:09 PM

Let me give you an example. I adopted a female yorkie out two years ago. She had LP in both knees. She went to the specialist and he did not feel that a repair was reasonable for her at her age; but did say that IF she happened to tear her CCL at some point, then she would need surgery. This is actually common...one of my personal pups has LP and I am aware that one day I might be having to deal with a torn CCL..but maybe not. He is not having problems with his knees at all...nor did this female I am referring to.

A couple of months ago, she did tear her CCL and she recently had surgery for it. It came as absolutely no surprise to her owner/mom. She was made aware of these knees and the possibility of a tear at the time of adoption...she also was made aware of the cost for such a repair.

Teresiana · 04-25-2013, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ladyjane

Let me give you an example. I adopted a female yorkie out two years ago. She had LP in both knees. She went to the specialist and he did not feel that a repair was reasonable for her at her age; but did say that IF she happened to tear her CCL at some point, then she would need surgery. This is actually common...one of my personal pups has LP and I am aware that one day I might be having to deal with a torn CCL..but maybe not. He is not having problems with his knees at all...nor did this female I am referring to.

A couple of months ago, she did tear her CCL and she recently had surgery for it. It came as absolutely no surprise to her owner/mom. She was made aware of these knees and the possibility of a tear at the time of adoption...she also was made aware of the cost for such a repair.

Exactly. A reputable rescue organization will let you know the risks of the pet you are bringing home. The new mom was carefully selected as someone who would be responsible enough to handle that risk & who would be willing to/had the financial means to seek medical attention if necessary. The new mom was fully aware of the risk.

crazydoglade · 04-25-2013, 06:11 PM

This past weekend was the orange pet expo. We had 3 yorkies for adoption. I do not feel we are unreasonable with our requirements. However I do feel that most people who are adopting are. As someone already stated they want a female puppy, perfect health housetrained and 3-4 pounds. They want to know the dogs "story", after all they have to impress their friends with their "rescue". Oh, they also have to be cheap, because since they are rescues we should be happy to get rid of them. Yes mill dogs and a lot of rescue dogs have health issues. And if we know about them, so do you. People get offended when we ask about their financial status but we need to be sure they will able to afford future medical care that all dogs require as they age. We adopted 1 yorkie to a wonderful home and took applications on 1 who needs futher care until his broken leg is healed. We were very clear on when the adoption could take place but today at his check found out it would be another 4-5 weeks instead of the expected 2-3 . We will be calling all who left applications. We are picky, but I don't feel we're unreasonable.

04-21-2013, 02:47 PM	#31
Teresa Ford Therapy Yorkies Work Donating Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Central, Florida Posts: 3,863	I understand your sadness. There is a Yorkie out there that is just right for you. We and several retired friends search the newspapers, CL and on line for Yorkies or Yorkie mixes we can rescue. We foster them, get them Vet care, spay or neuter and rehome. So I believe there is a forever home for every Yorkie. I hope you find each other soon. PS Senior dogs are perfect for Seniors who need a Yorkie to love. Hugs __________________ Teresa & Rubin, Gracie, Abba, Ginny Joy and Julia Rose Act like a dog, be kind, forgiving, and loyal.

04-21-2013, 02:57 PM	#32
yorkietalkjilly ♥ Love My Tibbe! ♥ Donating Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: D/FW, Texas Posts: 22,140	I went through what you are going through for over a year and just got so sick and tired of not finding my small dog that finally I gave up and called my last Yorkie's breeder out of sheer desperation. I went to see some Yorkie pups she'd been given to rehome but wound up coming home with a 9 mo. old Tibbe. He was almost feral as he'd been in a cage for 9 mos. and he'd come along with the pups, their mother and another female, to the breeder to find homes for. It can be so heartbreaking to try to find a little dog going the rescue route and some expect you to take whatever they suggest for you or you lose place with them. I turned down a Chinese Crested with one rescue and they never emailed or called again. But eventually I got my Yorkie baby and in time with training, he turned into a wonderful pet! The Best! Try not to lose heart and keep searching. When you do find your baby, all is good. But boy, it is sad always coming home dogless. Every single dog I signed up for at the dog shelter I was #2 - after a rescue organization! I would go up the morning of claiming with my carrier, water, leash, toy and hope and come home so sad, as the rescue lady walked out with the dog I wanted so. It gets really old. I can understand what you are going through. __________________ Jeanie and Tibbe One must do the best one can. You may get some marks for a very imperfect answer: you will certainly get none for leaving the question alone. C. S. Lewis

04-25-2013, 02:22 AM	#34
Belle Noir YT Addict Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Reading, PA, USA Posts: 258	Nathan Winograd has an excellent post regarding this very thing. Because of the attitude with so many rescues, I have decided to NOT bother, and instead of adopting, I will be shopping. I do not think that I should have to beg about hunt and peck and HOPE and PRAY that I am not only approved, but then I can actually GET the dog that caught my eye and tugged at my heart strings, or be forever blacklisted because they wanted me to buy a dog from them that I did NOT want, because they decided this dog was the dog for me and I didn't agree. Example, I am looking at buying land. This is a done deal, the only question is where and when. I'd like a large breed that is historically known to be good with livestock. One of the breeds I was thinking of was something like a great pyrenese or anatolian or related breed, which are live stock guardian breeds. I figure when I get some goats and chickens, the dog would feel right at home. Except... The one rescue I looked at (first on the search) there is a fenced yard requirement... Ummm.. I plan on having at least 10 acres, looking for 25, and you want me to FENCE that? I'm not going to bother continuing to look, there are plenty of LSG breeders that I can buy a puppy from with no hassle. Even were I not interested in a dog that would be happy with 10-25 acres to run in, a LOT of rescues have a NEVER off leash policy. Well, I am a member of a members only dog park. It's lovely, double gated, agility equipment, pools, toys.. Perfect place for a dog to get off leash and stretch it's legs. But so many say NEVER off leash when out of your home. Letting one of these dogs off leash in the double gated dog park, would be breaking those rescues rules. That ALSO means I couldn't do things like agility or rally or earth dogging. Add to that that MOST rescues have a clause in their contract that means you do not actually own your dog, and they can repossess said dog should you be found to be in violation of their rules. That means if I adopted a yorkie from a rescue that said no small children and I decide to have one more kid before the baby factory closes, they could TAKE my dog back for being in violation of their rules (if one of the rules was no children under X age), no matter how long I actually had the dog, because they NEVER gave up LEGAL ownership of said dog. That means if I adopted a papillon from a rescue that had those rules and the dog was THAT good to make it to top agility trials, and someone from that rescue happened to see us on TV (it could happen), it's possible that they could (and would have a legal right to) repossess my dog. Thank you, no. I'm not going to go through that. I am not going to jump through hoops to give someone MY money, so that we can both feel better about ourselves for rescuing. And now for the link, which is more interesting than anything I may have to say... Good Homes Need Not Apply : Nathan J Winograd I also find this post interesting The Lie at the Heart of the Killing : Nathan J Winograd I'm not saying rescue is a bad thing. Of course not. And there are some rescuers that are saints in my books. But there are a number of people with severe control issues, and I'm just not going to do it. More power to those who do and will, and have the patience. I feel people like that are blessed with a fortitude I do not have. I WILL foster, though, just not for a rescue that thinks that after 9 years a cat that has been in rescue since it was a kitten finally finding his forever home is a good thing. (in the first blog post somewhere, it's a long one and a good read, I think). We had Fatty for a couple weeks. Long enough to get to know her, her quirks, temperament, level of training and housebreaking, get her prettied up, cause a matted pee stained maltese is NOT nice to look at. The first family was NOT a fit, the second family fell through, the third family was perfect. If I had had Fatty longer than a month, I would wonder why, since this was a dog with VERY few faults as a pet goes. (perfect temperament, except she wanted to be fun police when the puppies got a but wild), calm, great with older kids, (don't have any smaller kids to test her with), great with cats, great with other small dogs, except for the fun police thing, never saw her in action with a big dog, but she was so laid back, I doubt if it was going to be a problem and I was right, since her new family lives next to Rotties, and she plays with them every day... Her only faults was HORRIBLE breath, (that's how I found out she likes tums as a treat, her breath was that bad and I gave her a mint one as a joke and she took it and begged for more), and being a bit gimpy, since her claws were so long that we could not trim them back as far as they needed to be trimmed which would take time, trimming bit by bit as the quick receded, and that she was lazy, in part from her hurting feet (now fixed) and in part cause she was just sooooo FAT (now fixed).. Plus she is an older lady (no time machine, she's just going to get older)... She has a right to be a bit lazy. Had she been there much longer than she was, I WOULD have kept her, because after a while, the dog starts to think that they ARE home. You foster a dog for more than 2 months (not including puppies and kittens), you may as well keep the dog, because the dog has bonded to you, and it hurts the dog to be ripped away from yet another home and family. The dog can get depressed, be standoffish, and possibly not bond, because it's afraid to get close in case they lose that family too, and a dog can take years to get over it. I often wonder if that's the reason that Sabre is as aloof as he is, that at almost 14 weeks, he had bonded to the breeders family and is afraid to get close to us. __________________ When there is no ultimate authority, we must gather as much information as possible and decide for ourself what we believe. ~Teresa Ford

04-25-2013, 05:38 AM	#35
Britster Action Jackson ♥ Donating Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Maryland Posts: 17,815	I don't feel guilty about seeking out a breeder dog next time around because responsible breeders aren't the problem anyway. Any reputable breeder will always take back a dog if for any reason the owner no longer can keep it, so that their dogs don't end up in the shelters. It's the puppy millers and the BYB's that are the problem, IMO, so by purchasing a dog (from a reputable breeder), you are not contributing to the problem, if that makes sense. I know with me personally, I'm at a point in my life where a lot of things will be changing soon, and my dog(s) will always be a part of that, but a rescue may not be comfortable with my lifestyle and that's fine. The possibility that I'll be renting within the next year is very high. Within the next 10 years, I am sure there will be new relationships, there could be a baby, never know! Could be an apartment, could be a house, but there's a lot of "don't really know" yet and I completely understand that a rescue may not want to risk it not working out for whatever reason. After all, there ARE a lot of folks my age (22) who would be horrible dog owner candidates, lol. I know and I'm not one of them but the few breeders I've spoken with are very open to anything, they've gotten to know me, and feel I'd be a great home for one of their dogs. Another reason I want a dog from a GOOD breeder is because it's something we've never done before in our family. I've always wanted to have a breeder to go back to for questions, be able to see my pups family and pedigree, and have that added resource. After I got Jackson from a BYB, I e-mailed her a picture and said how thrilled I was with my little guy, and never even got a reply. Go figure. And I have very specific wants in a dog that would be hard to come by in rescue. Anyway, I guess all I am saying is that nobody should feel guilty or feel like they HAVE to get a rescue dog. I think it's an amazing thing and I will have a rescue dog someday when the time is right. I'm going a little off topic, but I think there's a certain 'stigma' out there now (I see it all over FB) ... 'Adopt, Don't Shop!' etc etc, and I hate that people who get dogs from breeders are often looked down upon in today's world. Even at the dog park, I notice it. "Oh, he's a rescue" and they say it sometimes snobby (not everybody, obviously, but I've seen it happen). And I've seen people give others 'looks' when they say they got their dog from a breeder. I think if we could work together and meet somewhere in the middle that'd be great. And I'm saying generic 'we' -- not YT specifically, lol. Like the breeder I've contacted does a lot of rescue work as well as breeding. And I guess it can be kind of an oxymoron to some people, LOL, but it's entirely possible to do both. I'm rambling... sorry! haha. __________________ ~ Brit & Lights! Camera! Jackson! CGC ETD TKP ~ Follow Jackson on Instagram: https://instagram.com/jacksontheterrier

04-25-2013, 06:52 AM	#36
DBlain Donating YT Addict Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Oakland County MI Posts: 6,190	Like the breeder I've contacted does a lot of rescue work as well as breeding. And I guess it can be kind of an oxymoron to some people, LOL, but it's entirely possible to do both. posted by Britster I think I understand a lot of how you feel and how both sides of this can be blurred this topic is so conflicting and troublesome to me that I almost feel like two people when I think about it. I have supported shelters and now rescue groups for a long time by doing both volunteer work and sending donations, yet I have never owned a rescue dog, so I have to admit I feel guilty. Which I guess is good because when I really feel guilty I usually send more money. But in my heart I know I will not adopt a puppy, first because it is so hard to get the right one and second because not all but many have come from puppy mill surrenders. Before Yorkie Talk and facebook I not only thought about it but I tried. But now I have read so many break your heart and pocket book stories about puppy mill dogs that I would prefer to take my chances with a breeder. So many people feel that as a YT member it is their responsibility to educate people on how to purchase a good yorkie. So when someone buys from a pet store, most here get upset and rightfully so telling the new owner about the health risks of a dog that most likely was bred in a puppy mill. Yet when someone adopts or is thinking about adopting a puppy where no history is known or the dog is in fact a puppy mill surrender everyone applauds with no questions asked. Yet both pups most likely started life in very similar situations. In my heart I love the fact that someone adopts these pups but my mind can't help wondering if they are prepared or have even thought about all those questions we ask of the pet store buyer. This is why I feel like two different people because I feel that it's OK to warn a pet store buyer but not an adopter even though they are facing the same risks, am I the only one to feel like this, because it really tears me up inside. I know this is not true but man I sometimes feel like ignorance is bliss __________________ Lola my amazing little yorkie-pom Donna Last edited by DBlain; 04-25-2013 at 06:56 AM.

04-25-2013, 09:12 AM	#38
ladyjane Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 27,490	And BTW: I have never looked down on anyone who chooses to purchase a puppy. People do what makes them comfortable. I have actually suggested people do just that when they cannot find what they are looking for. Adoption is not for everyone...and honestly there are many people who would not be approved. The other thing is that IF a person wants to rescue a pup and they don't like that rescue is picky, then they can go to a shelter and adopt. Shelters don't usually take the time to do reference checks and home visits. Of course, if there are medical issues, the person is stuck with that....just like rescues are....and one has to wonder...IF they choose to pay the vetting for said dog, would they want to let just anyone have it if they didn't keep it? I think that people who bad mouth rescues are totally clueless about what a reputable rescue actually does. __________________ CLOUD NINE BEDS--YORKIE HAVEN RESCUE MY ETSY SHOP

04-25-2013, 03:50 PM	#41
DBlain Donating YT Addict Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Oakland County MI Posts: 6,190	That's a good point Teresa, if those adopting are made fully aware of the risks then like you say it is their choice. It's just I have been reading some very sad and expensive problems recently I just hope that these folks are prepared. __________________ Lola my amazing little yorkie-pom Donna

04-25-2013, 04:09 PM	#43
ladyjane Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 27,490	Let me give you an example. I adopted a female yorkie out two years ago. She had LP in both knees. She went to the specialist and he did not feel that a repair was reasonable for her at her age; but did say that IF she happened to tear her CCL at some point, then she would need surgery. This is actually common...one of my personal pups has LP and I am aware that one day I might be having to deal with a torn CCL..but maybe not. He is not having problems with his knees at all...nor did this female I am referring to. A couple of months ago, she did tear her CCL and she recently had surgery for it. It came as absolutely no surprise to her owner/mom. She was made aware of these knees and the possibility of a tear at the time of adoption...she also was made aware of the cost for such a repair. __________________ CLOUD NINE BEDS--YORKIE HAVEN RESCUE MY ETSY SHOP

04-25-2013, 06:11 PM	#45
crazydoglade YT Addict Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: california Posts: 405	This past weekend was the orange pet expo. We had 3 yorkies for adoption. I do not feel we are unreasonable with our requirements. However I do feel that most people who are adopting are. As someone already stated they want a female puppy, perfect health housetrained and 3-4 pounds. They want to know the dogs "story", after all they have to impress their friends with their "rescue". Oh, they also have to be cheap, because since they are rescues we should be happy to get rid of them. Yes mill dogs and a lot of rescue dogs have health issues. And if we know about them, so do you. People get offended when we ask about their financial status but we need to be sure they will able to afford future medical care that all dogs require as they age. We adopted 1 yorkie to a wonderful home and took applications on 1 who needs futher care until his broken leg is healed. We were very clear on when the adoption could take place but today at his check found out it would be another 4-5 weeks instead of the expected 2-3 . We will be calling all who left applications. We are picky, but I don't feel we're unreasonable.