Thank you, I didn't know I could cathart, let alone be good at it. :D

It is sad that rudeness is seen as normal on internet forums. YT did not used to be like that. And that is all I will say on that matter.

As for FB, I have never seen any rudeness among my friends on there. If I did, they would not remain on my friend list for long.

All in how you interpret things. :) I personally think those who protest often are not so kind themselves at times......but hey..it is how *I* interpret it. Perhaps they think they are the models of kindness. *shrug*

I still think it's hilarious that the ones who opine on others being rude see nothing rude about their posts on that subject.

As I said before, rude is all in the eyes of the beholder.

I know....but nothing new. Same stuff, different day as I said.

Exactly! :)

Glad to hear from the OP and that you did get responses to your thread start that answered the questions and put out the topic as food for thought...

I'm just like this in real life...not always a good thing LOL, but then again I think people also need to realize the way we write and the way we speak are different...as well the tone of a body of writing vs the one one has in their voice when speaking the same words...it's the perpetual conflict of interpretation vs meaning on the internet...but of course the reality is everyone is rude from time to time...I like to think it just out of concern and with well being in mind...

:thumbup: I agree. Haven't we been through this like 10,000 times now?

Blah Blah blah; yadda yadda yadda.

Sorry! I know that's rude!:p

:thumbup:

I completely agree with this. If you want to see a change in how responses are posted please take a stand and post the way you think the response should be posted. Lead by example.

Differing opinions create heated threads, but usually these threads are very educational.

ok-- I tried not to comment but I just have too...

I don't think being rude and being unkind are the same. I have seen some of the most polite people being absolutely cruel.
I guess if I had to choose... I would take the slightly brass person who has a kind hearth over a passive aggressive polite person. Also, after you get to know someone you can judge better. There are people on this site that are a bit .... rude:eek:,.. but I think I know them from their posts to understand they have hearts of gold and are just trying to help.. it is different for the new members.

Yes...and I think this thread makes it 10,001:rolleyes:

I shall not post again on this thread again in hopes that this thread will just drop into that big dark black abyss where all the other "rude" threads go...good bye!:animal-pa

I feel this story of Sam should be shared in schools!!!!

I have to agree with your point of view.
Are you telling me when these seasoned breeders first started out they knew absolutely everything they had to know and all went well and everything was bright and shiny.
They can be very cruel and nasty, I certainly hope their pups don't pick up on that.
I think there is a kinder way to address these situations when someone who appears ignorant of a situation asks, what may appear to be a ridiculous question to some.

I think the disagreement in this thread is that many of us don't see the cruelness and nastiness from the seasoned breeders that you do. Those are VERY strong words. What I see is people taking pot shots at the good breeders. These seasoned breeders give advice, such as "take the dog to the vet, it's life is in your hands," and people see this as cruel. I see the people who ignore this advice as cruel.

Advice or Agenda?
 

IMO I know to some posters with over thousands of posts this may be an old rehashed topic but we are discussing the treatment of new members and how answers are intended and/or perceived by them, not by the older members who know the background of those responding so they interpret when reading their responses. Processing in their head, I know that poster they are usually kind they just got overheated in their response. To the new poster they only know they came for help and are all ready in a upset state of mind because their dog is having difficulties. If they are attacked it will only put them on the defensive even more and they may be resistant to hearing the message because of how it is stated. I have noticed many people on YT have their personal beliefs and agendas that sometimes overwhelm the message they are trying to deliver. Your beliefs have come about through a lot of experiences and soul searching that you yourself have done. You can not assume that others here have come to the same conclusions or have even had the opportunity to learn these life lessons or confront the obstacles that you have in order to form your opinion. Is it not more important that a dog gets the help and advice it needs or that your agenda is voiced? I have been haunted for days by the post by the woman who watched her new dog die of hypoglycaemia. I wanted to shout at her. As I sat trying to phrase what I wanted to say, I thought she is all ready heartbroken, she was not cruel just unaware, uneducated on how fragile Yorkies are. Would my venting have made me feel better, no, the dog better, no, the poor person who was all ready suffering no. So I just said that there was a lot of knowledge to be learned here if she wanted to get another dog. Making her wrong for not knowing would not have made anything better. So I can understand that those of you who have been on here longer are haunted by all the posts you have read, the people you have reached out to help. Please just remember when you were new and just learning about Yorkies and take a long look at what you post before you submit it. Will it help the situation or just hurt. I thank all the breeders and posters who offer advice and support to us new learners.

I had to add. This is in no way referring to advice given by the seasoned breeders but more towards other agendas.

What agendas are you referring to?

really well said buster and my viewpoint was only on threads I have read, it's not pointing fingers at all breeders. It's more like buster said "I have noticed many people on YT have their personal beliefs and agendas that sometimes overwhelm the message they are trying to deliver. Your beliefs have come about through a lot of experiences and soul searching that you yourself have done. You can not assume that others here have come to the same conclusions or have even had the opportunity to learn these life lessons or confront the obstacles that you have in order to form your opinion. Is it not more important that a dog gets the help and advice it needs or that your agenda is voiced?"

2 enormous thumbs up, by the way that's a good life lesson and advice in general, thanks for the insight

Surely those of us who post here looking for help for our dog are far more interested in actually getting the advice and opinions sought to help the dog than they are their own feelings or the tone or language of a certain post? When my dog's life or health is an issue, I am solely interested in what it is going to take to get him better and/or keep him healthy. I could care less about what a poster seems to think of me - just please give me advice/opinion/information for my baby. There are no words/tone/agenda/criticism/implied criticism from any poster in this entire forum that would keep me from reading all of the post and acting on that advice if my sole intent in posting here is actual help for my dog. The last thing I am worried about when my dog's health is the issue are my feelings.

Most people responded the same way you did; if we are thinking about the same thread ~ and I believe we are.

I see no rudeness on that thread only lots of condolences.

This was not meant as an anti-breeder thread. The few that I know for sure who are breeders here, I have only seen be harsh once, and I thoroughly agreed with that at the time. It was the thread with the 13 yr old who posted about her dog being in labor. She was told in multiple replies that it was URGENT to get her dog to the vet. It just didn't seem that she was getting the URGENT part down. I personally appreciate the breeders that I have seen post with help, as I am learning a lot about other things that might not necessarily be pregnancy issues, but yorkie issues.

It's the ones that aren't breeders (that I can tell), that I have seen get really nasty. It just usually is in the breeding threads, but isn't necessarily only seen there. Sorry if I was mis-understood on that part of it.

The message I was trying to get across, Buster Brown just did it for me so much more eloquently.

Buster Brown wasn't pointing out rudeness in the thread....he was pointing out that he/she wanted to scream at her, but only typed a helpful reply instead.

My Name is Sam made me cry at work! I had to hurry up to the bathroom before people started asking questions! So sad.. :( I'm going to go home hug Buster and not let go...

I'm glad that you can see that, it's just that these same great breeders get so much flack from other breeders that they weren't kind enough. It happens so often that we have lost many of the good breeders from posting on that type of thread. I hope those other "kind" breeders are willing to step up to the plate, and even more importantly, I hope their advice is solid, too often, it isn't. What would you rather have, true, perhaps harsh advice, or supportive poor advice?

Yes that is what I meant. When I first posted on YT it was because the puppy I had purchased at a pet store was gravely ill. I received compassion and support. No one attacked me for being stupid, which I was and was all ready learning the hard lessons in regards to puppy mills. I had been informed that they were not from puppy mills and I foolishly believed them. Was I wrong, YES 100%. !! Will I warn others and counsel them to find a reputable breeder you better believe it. Would I condemn someone for having done the same thing no. I was so frightened and upset when I posted that had I been attacked for my stupidity I would have been so hurt I do not know if I would have stayed to get all the valuable advice that has helped me be a better mom and advocate for Buster. It just seems to me if someone is asking for help for a sick or injured dog it should not matter if it is 2lbs or 20lbs, yorkie or morkie, carrying the piebald gene, bought, adopted, or rescued. What is important is that the dog get the best advice or recommendations to get it helped. All other agendas can be discussed in other threads. Now if someone is asking for advice about the issues/agendas go for it because I am all for hearing opinions. I will sift through all information and make my decisions on what I feel is right for me. I am an old dog but I am always willing to learn new tricks just don't hit me on the nose when trying to teach me.

I'm sure we all wanted to ~ but we all typed a thoughtful reply instead. Perhaps we aren't all that different after all? Could it be that our similarities outweigh our differences more often than not when it really matters?

I don't know. It's just a thought and my last one on the subject.:animal-pa

That's a great last thought! :)

True & harsh advice isn't bad. Like I said though, when the posts got nasty, there was no advice involved, just nastiness, and as far as I know....they weren't breeders either. But who knows...again, the breeders I have seen post offered advice....and then stated their feelings on the matter. Totally acceptable.

In other words, I was asking the non-advice giving folks to curtail their nastiness. And really, the ones that are nasty only are nasty...usually no advice given, or following a breeder's advice, might almost verbatim repeat that advice before posting their nastiness.

Basically, if you have nothing to say that is helpful, then don't say it! Even in this thread, folks were twisting my observation into a "rude" comment, as it's the eye of the beholder, etc.

When a person goes online & asks for help, it might not be because they are trying to avoid vet bills & get free info.

Had my hubby not gone online and researched Pinesol & Phenol poisoning...(I was at the vet with the first pup), we would not have known the cause. (I wanted to kick him for not realizing the 2nd pup was having the same symptoms when I came home. I grabbed the 2nd pup & back to the vet I went.

My pup was at the vet's, & they diagnosed liver shunt....till the 2nd one came in. WE were the ones that told them that we thought it was Pine-Sol poisoning, a couple hours after they had the pups.

He was online & doing searches, & researching.....and NOT trying to avoid vet bills...he doesn't pay the vet bills anyways...lol.

He just wanted to make sure the pups were being taken care of. And trying to find out everything he could. Granted there are folks out there that don't want to go to the vet....and don't have the money to go...or just don't want to spend the money to go.

But I saw that some posters got accused of this before anyone knew what was going on...

Again, I don't think these were breeders, just folks who passionately feel the way they should. And old-timers who have probably seen it all. I was just asking that before we pre-judge, call names, insinuate that they are less than human, & start attacking the OP, that we stop & think about what we are doing....

Also, it's part of the rules here....Yorkie Talk...Rules & Regulations, section B-part 1. Please be civil and do not personally attack anyone or their opinions. If you disagree with a member's approach or method, feel free to reply respectfully. Otherwise, you may choose to ignore their post. YT is not the place for rude, snide, or disrespectful remarks towards your fellow member or YT. We do not tolerate members who take advantage of our community with stories that don't make sense or those who post outright lies. We rely on an honor code in our community; lying to our community, stealing pictures or other content is not allowed.

I was just asking for "Respectfully". It turned into a rather nice discussion..then a rather un-nice discussion, then some nice again, some nasty and now....I'm hoping for the conclusion here soon.

I've been called "rude" for just starting this thread.....lol.

A great thread all in all...some of you have seen it before, but like I said previously, I have learned a lot about individuals here since this thread. There are a lot of nice folks here!

:bravo::yorkietal

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

Yes!!!!!!!!!!
One day when studying other countries I realized that all mothers loved LOVED their children (I know... it sounds stupid but.. I was young) and then I realized we are all really the same!!!

I have cried so many times on this site, I have received so much help from members of this site. I rather have a true honest person speak from the heart and deal with a little in your face behavior (I don't think I will ever use the word rude again) than fake polite sugar people. Now, saying that, badgering and narrow sited is different. We need to listen to the passion in a person's voice.
I don't think the ladies who are the breeders are really the problem. I know I have changed my opinion a bit.. I think it is so many people saying the same thing it becomes overwhelming. Notice... it is only a problem when the new person will not EVEN listen (I didn't say agree.. )..who only want the experts of YT to agree with them.. Who said you only become defensive when someone does not do what you want... or totally agrees with you????

I still think when applied to teaching (like me in the classroom) I should temper my way of speaking with my students.. no need to put them down.
But right now... on yt.. we need to see the good !!!!!!!!