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-   General Yorkshire Terrier Discussion (https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/general-yorkshire-terrier-discussion/)
-   -   Parti and Beiwer (https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/general-yorkshire-terrier-discussion/211050-parti-beiwer.html)

miljoy 08-22-2010 01:09 AM
Parti and Beiwer
 
Just out of interest. Can anybody tell me if a Parti and a Biewer is the same thing or is there a difference between the two ? Please excuse my ignorance :)

Kelseysmom 08-22-2010 02:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by miljoy (Post 3247476)
Just out of interest. Can anybody tell me if a Parti and a Biewer is the same thing or is there a difference between the two ? Please excuse my ignorance :)
I wonder the same thing, and is a biewer a yorkie?
didn't mean to but in on your question with another question.
sorry:D

bchgirl 08-22-2010 06:45 AM
Biewers originated in Germany. The foundation pair were Fru Fru and Darling Friedheck. All biewers' pedigrees should go back to this original pair. Biewers have a specific standard and are shown confirmation in rare breed show circuits. Biewers are recognized as a breed of it's own.

Partis originated in the US and are AKC recognized.

As tail docking was banned in Germany, biewers have tails. Parti yorkies tails are docked.

JeanieK 08-22-2010 06:56 AM
Basically they are the same thing. They both came from two traditional colored yorkies who both carried the parti gene.

bchgirl explained the differences in registration.

The parti is considered a yorkie by the AKC and can be bred to other yorkies and the offspring can be registered AKC.

The Biewer was allowed to become a breed of it's own so if a Biewer is bred to a yorkie, the offspring are considered to be a mixed breed and cannot be registered AKC.

miljoy 08-22-2010 07:32 AM
Can I ask how long ago was the Foundation pair started for the Biewers, are we talking recent or centuries ago ? Thank you for your answers. :)

bchgirl 08-22-2010 07:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by miljoy (Post 3247754)
Can I ask how long ago was the Foundation pair started for the Biewers, are we talking recent or centuries ago ? Thank you for your answers. :)
The first "biewer" was born in 1984. Mr. Biewer selectively bred his dogs for several years and in 1989 the dogs were recognized by ACH German e.V as a breed of it's own.

You can read more about the biewer history here.

Breed club for biewer a la pom pon dogs

bchgirl 08-22-2010 07:39 AM
The BBCA has a South African affiliation ....

Welcome to the Biewer Breeder Club South Africa

miljoy 08-22-2010 07:51 AM
Wow thank you, I knew they were new in this country and very expensive, I wonder if this is the newest breed of dog. They sure are Stunning. :rolleyes:

GreenwoodBiewer 08-24-2010 05:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeanieK (Post 3247707)
Basically they are the same thing. They both came from two traditional colored yorkies who both carried the parti gene.

bchgirl explained the differences in registration.

The parti is considered a yorkie by the AKC and can be bred to other yorkies and the offspring can be registered AKC.

The Biewer was allowed to become a breed of it's own so if a Biewer is bred to a yorkie, the offspring are considered to be a mixed breed and cannot be registered AKC.
I'm sorry, you are mistaken .. from the start of the breed in the country of origin (Germany) and still to this day, the Biewer is bred back to the Yorkie by many breeders.. it does NOT make the breed a mixed breed as most of the German breeders consider the Biewer a Yorkie ( The name of the dog is Biewer YORKSHIRE ala Pom Pon).. so breeding back to a traditionally colored yorkie is no different than breeding to one with the recessive gene that makes some have "white" or lack of color.. they are one in the same dog.. a Yorkie..

It is true however.. they can not be registered AKC.. no Biewer at this point in time can whether you breed them to an AKC yorkie or not.. that does not matter.

Breeding a Biewer to a traditionally colored yorkie does not make it any more of a mixed breed than breeding a Parti to a traditionally colored yorkie makes that a mixed breed...

Diana :animal-pa

JeanieK 08-24-2010 05:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenwoodBiewer (Post 3249582)
I'm sorry, you are mistaken .. from the start of the breed in the country of origin (Germany) and still to this day, the Biewer is bred back to the Yorkie by many breeders.. it does NOT make the breed a mixed breed as most of the German breeders consider the Biewer a Yorkie ( The name of the dog is Biewer YORKSHIRE ala Pom Pon).. so breeding back to a traditionally colored yorkie is no different than breeding to one with the recessive gene that makes some have "white" or lack of color.. they are one in the same dog.. a Yorkie..

It is true however.. they can not be registered AKC.. no Biewer at this point in time can whether you breed them to an AKC yorkie or not.. that does not matter.

Breeding a Biewer to a traditionally colored yorkie does not make it any more of a mixed breed than breeding a Parti to a traditionally colored yorkie makes that a mixed breed...

Diana :animal-pa
Sorry NOT mistaken. If a yorkie is bred to a Biewer, the offspring cannot be registered AKC. It would be considered a mixed breed. If a parti is bred to a traditional the offspring CAN be registered AKC.

Toby'sMama 08-24-2010 06:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeanieK (Post 3249608)
Sorry NOT mistaken. If a yorkie is bred to a Biewer, the offspring cannot be registered AKC. It would be considered a mixed breed. If a parti is bred to a traditional the offspring CAN be registered AKC.
I do believe you ARE mistaken. The parents of the offspring have to be AKC in order to be registered with the AKC. Since the Biewer is not registered with the AKC, the offspring would not be able to be registered with AKC. The genetics are the same. A registry does NOT make it a different breed. How about a traditional who is registered with APRI or ACA bred with a parti... their offspring CANNOT be registered with the AKC -- would it make them a crossbreed? NO.

my2boyz 08-24-2010 07:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toby'sMama (Post 3249666)
I do believe you ARE mistaken. The parents of the offspring have to be AKC in order to be registered with the AKC. Since the Biewer is not registered with the AKC, the offspring would not be able to be registered with AKC. The genetics are the same. A registry does NOT make it a different breed. How about a traditional who is registered with APRI or ACA bred with a parti... their offspring CANNOT be registered with the AKC -- would it make them a crossbreed? NO.
:thumbup: Great point!

JeanieK 08-24-2010 07:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toby'sMama (Post 3249666)
I do believe you ARE mistaken. The parents of the offspring have to be AKC in order to be registered with the AKC. Since the Biewer is not registered with the AKC, the offspring would not be able to be registered with AKC. The genetics are the same. A registry does NOT make it a different breed. How about a traditional who is registered with APRI or ACA bred with a parti... their offspring CANNOT be registered with the AKC -- would it make them a crossbreed? NO.
The Biewers are a breed of their own. They are registered as Biewer Yorkshire Terrier a la Pom Pom. The German registries allowed them to do this. Whereas the parti is a yorkshire terrier and is registered as a yorkshire terrier. It has not been allowed to be registered as a separate breed.

if you mix any dog that is NOT a yorkshire terrier, with a yorkshire terrier it is a mixed breed. it does not matter where they are registered, or if they are not registered at all.

I was not mistaken in what I said.

There are a lot of registries that allow you to register just about anything you want. That does not change the fact that they are a mixed breed.

GreenwoodBiewer 08-24-2010 07:37 AM
Just because a specific registry allowed the Biewers to be registered as a breed of their own so they could be shown.. does not make them any further away from a Yorkshire Terrier than a Parti is from a Yorkshire terrier.. they are one in the same..

What was the criteria used to "make" the Biewer a seperate breed?? Was it purely and simply "EASIER" to make it it's own breed so it could be shown??? Is that all it takes to make a breed it's own breed??? If so, then the Partis' would also be considered their own breed.. they can not be shown as Yorkies in AKC, so, to be shown, they have to be shown in a their OWN breed "Parti" with NAKC.. they would be shown against Yorkies.. not AS a yorkie.. THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED with the Biewers.. no different.. that does not make the Parti it's own breed any more than the Biewers.. (unless of course you believe the Parti is not a Yorkie)

Toby's mom had it right.. the problem is that the Biewer is not registered with AKC, not the genetics behind them.

Diana :animal-pa

JeanieK 08-24-2010 09:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenwoodBiewer (Post 3249731)
Just because a specific registry allowed the Biewers to be registered as a breed of their own so they could be shown.. does not make them any further away from a Yorkshire Terrier than a Parti is from a Yorkshire terrier.. they are one in the same..

What was the criteria used to "make" the Biewer a seperate breed?? Was it purely and simply "EASIER" to make it it's own breed so it could be shown??? Is that all it takes to make a breed it's own breed??? If so, then the Partis' would also be considered their own breed.. they can not be shown as Yorkies in AKC, so, to be shown, they have to be shown in a their OWN breed "Parti" with NAKC.. they would be shown against Yorkies.. not AS a yorkie.. THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED with the Biewers.. no different.. that does not make the Parti it's own breed any more than the Biewers.. (unless of course you believe the Parti is not a Yorkie)

Toby's mom had it right.. the problem is that the Biewer is not registered with AKC, not the genetics behind them.

Diana :animal-pa
I did not say that they were any less of a yorke genetically, just that the offspring would be considered to be mixed because the Biewer is consiered a separate breed. Hence the Biewer Yorkshire name. The parti, is a parti colored yorkshire terrier. There is no other name. Parti is a color, Biewer is a breed. All Biewers are parti colored yorkshire terriers, but not all partis are Biewers. Sort of like all squares are rectangles but not all rectangles are not squares

There is an additional set of criteria to be a Biewer.

Lets look at it this way. if you were showing a Biewer, would it be shown against other yorkies, or only against Biewers?


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