the difference between a show dog and a pet

[JoshieBoy]

Originally Posted by Woogie Man

Yorkiepuppie, you make some good points and asked some fair questions. I'm not sure just how scientific of an answer you'll likely get, but I can give you some my reasons for not breeding for tinies. In no particular order....

1: It just isn't necessary to breed for tinies. Standard size Yorkies can and do produce occasional tinies.

2: It's dangerous for the mother. The risk of c-sections is high. Complications of any sort can be more dangerous for a smaller dog just as any illness can be.

3: Small mothers have small frames. They are delicate and I don't think it's right to put the added weight of babies on their little bodies. To me, it's just asking for joint problems.

4: Qualified homes for tinies are hard to find. For that matter, finding good homes can be a challenge for any breeder. It's just that much harder for the very small ones. Even after you become an adept breeder, finding proper homes is a constant worry and the worry factor goes up for the little ones.

5: If a health issue does come up in a very tiny dog, it is immediately more dangerous due to its small size. The little ones have so little reserve and can have more reactions to vaccines, anesthesia and even blood draws can be difficult. Plus, finding a good vet for the little ones isn't always easy. The risks from a hypoglycemic episode go up as the pups size goes down. How many new owners are prepared for this? Even short-term diarrhea will put more stress on a tiny. De-hydration can come quickly.

I'm sure there's many more that others can add. It's late and I'm probably missing obvious things. The thing about this discussion is what do you mean by tinies? To me, a tiny dog is around 3 pounds but here we've seen mention of 1 1/2 pound grown dogs. Why anyone would want something that small is beyond me. I think you've posted that you have a 3 pound dog. Can you imagine one half that size?

Well, not too scientific, but that's the way I see it...at least at 3 in the morning.

Thanks for the information. It was very informative.

[Arzel36]

Originally Posted by JoshieBoy

I agree with your comment. I just think we have to be careful how we give advice or voice our opinions. Some posts I have read seem judgmental instead of giving constructive advice or criticism, especially on the first page. People are not going to listen to our opinions if they think we are judging them. Who could blame them for not wanting to continue posting on the thread even if they started the thread. Nobody wants to be torn down by other saying they are a horrible pet owner or breeder. I think we all can learn that we do not have to agree, and the O.P does not have to take your advice. When people get their facts wrong, other people can tell them nicely without attacking them, one upping them, or being judgmental. People might actually listen to what we have to say.

:, "Drama Island", on this forum sometime's.

[JoshieBoy]

Originally Posted by Arzel36

:, "Drama Island", on this forum sometime's.

Thanks!

[Arzel36]

welcome

[oopsmyhalofello]

I had posted this question in the original thread on the breeders forum that I think spun into this one.. wondering if someone has any opinion on it.

I have thought about the size of the stud dog used for breeding in the past too. I understand the risks involved with complications in breeding a tiny female are entirely different.. but Why is it ok for breeders to use tiny tiny males? They are going to possibly produce tiny tiny puppies that are difficult to find suitable homes for as they need extra care, I never hear anything about the size of the stud though?

[nanahas3]

Originally Posted by oopsmyhalofello

I had posted this question in the original thread on the breeders forum that I think spun into this one.. wondering if someone has any opinion on it.

I have thought about the size of the stud dog used for breeding in the past too. I understand the risks involved with complications in breeding a tiny female are entirely different.. but Why is it ok for breeders to use tiny tiny males? They are going to possibly produce tiny tiny puppies that are difficult to find suitable homes for as they need extra care, I never hear anything about the size of the stud though?

I think I read on the breeder site about a tiny little stud who almost died when he was tied. Something to do with hypoglycemic attack. So I wouldnt think breeding tiny studs would be advisable either JMO since I am not a breeder.

[manolos mom]

TeresaM and I were just talking about color yesterday, Her Yogi and my Pablo are black Yorkies and are 10 months old. Yogi has more gold than Pablo but both are Black. Yogi is altered and Pablo will be altered in a couple of weeks due to his small size. Because of their color they could have never been shown. I have also heard that 5 to 7 lbs dogs show better than the 4 lbs.

[Sugar's Mom]

Originally Posted by rebeccag

I was just trying to help. I've heard and read 3-7lbs. Here is one example:
http://www.doggies.com/Yorkshire_Terrier/

I wouldn't deliberately mislead someone. I really thought it was basic knowledge but I was wrong and meant no harm. I know I've read it elsewhere as well....I've just heard it many times and thought I'd share what I thought was true....oops!

i know you didn't honey. It is a common misconception. I, too, used to think that and as nancy said, when I first came on here, i made a lot of mistakes. I didn't even have a yorkie when I joined here but was looking. When I finally found one, I didn't have any better sense than to tell people on here my good news and how his mama and daddy were two and three pounds. Imagine that one!!!!!

[Sugar's Mom]

Originally Posted by YorkieShadow

garbage dogs?

yeah, that!!!!!!!!!!! I have had a few people on here call my dogs "garbage" dogs or even worse "sh##" dogs. Of course it was all done by pm's and the two or three people that called theem that didn't know the pm's were forwarded to me!!!!

[westieboy]

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom

yeah, that!!!!!!!!!!! I have had a few people on here call my dogs "garbage" dogs or even worse "sh##" dogs. Of course it was all done by pm's and the two or three people that called theem that didn't know the pm's were forwarded to me!!!!

Garbage? Your dogs are beautiful.

[manolos mom]

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom

yeah, that!!!!!!!!!!! I have had a few people on here call my dogs "garbage" dogs or even worse "sh##" dogs. Of course it was all done by pm's and the two or three people that called theem that didn't know the pm's were forwarded to me!!!!

Im sorry that happened to you Dee. No dogs are Garbage

[Sugar's Mom]

Originally Posted by westieboy

Garbage? Your dogs are beautiful.

Thank you so much. Now back to the thread. it isn't about me

[rebeccag]

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom

i know you didn't honey. It is a common misconception. I, too, used to think that and as nancy said, when I first came on here, i made a lot of mistakes. I didn't even have a yorkie when I joined here but was looking. When I finally found one, I didn't have any better sense than to tell people on here my good news and how his mama and daddy were two and three pounds. Imagine that one!!!!!

lol! Thanks, feel a little better now

[yorkie mad]

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom

yeah, that!!!!!!!!!!! I have had a few people on here call my dogs "garbage" dogs or even worse "sh##" dogs. Of course it was all done by pm's and the two or three people that called theem that didn't know the pm's were forwarded to me!!!!

Sorry to be ignorant but what exactly does "garbage dogs " mean?

[Nancy1999]

Many of you have pointed out my rudeness, and believe I could better change the breeder's mind if I had used more tact. While I hate to hurt someone's feelings, I hate unethical breeding practices even more. Let me just say, my post was never an attempt to change the breeders mind, as it is clearly made-up. As others have pointed out, she's a" featured breeder" on Yorkietalk, this means she pays Yorkietalk for advertising privileges to be listed on the Yorkietalk featured breeders page, it does not mean Yorkietalk endorses her. I'm sure she lists here, because it helps her sell lots of dogs, so I don't think anyone is going to be changing her mind. I am livid at her post, and that was the very most I could tone it down. I also was afraid to post anything because I don't want to get into trouble with Yorkietalk. However, her post is clearly implying the propaganda of "If you want a "tiny" yorkie, don't go to a show breeder, go to a tiny breeder specialist, as she knows how to safely breed tinies". Is she the only one; are all the others on the web telling the truth too, and the mother club who pays for all those scientific studies wrong? Why does the YTCA frown on breeding tinies, is because "they don't know how to safely do it?" I truly believe if it were safe, the mother club would endorse it. If you want a tiny yorkie, you should ONLY go to a show breeder or other ethical breeder, because they won't be breeding them; they know they are ONLY suitable as pets.

Again, I repeat I hate posting on these controversial threads, and opposing the breeding practices of certain breeders. I do believe that there is a safe and unsafe way to do certain things, not just different opinions, and when it comes to breeding and living creatures, we should always error on the side of safety. I also know so many people want tinies, and posts like hers is just want they want to hear. My love for Joey has extended to whole breed, and I really want to encourage people to only support those breeders who are doing the best for the breed.