I can understand her motivation...My sister and I have had this conversation many times. My sister has told me that they really don't have puppy mills in Canada. It sounds like they may out east, by some of the posts here, but he tells me it's not like that in Alberta. May or may not be true, but, There is definitely the major issues with puppy mills being so plentiful around here.

She also told me that it's very difficult to even get a dog from the local shelter...they just don't have many animals in there. My brother ended up finding a pit/Dane mix (who had already been re homed twice) and he adopted her. The shelter didn't even spay before releasing her! I could not believe it! Especially being a pit. There are already a huge number of them.

petland canada - sourcing of puppies
 

I have read all the posts and would like to make some comments

1. In Canada, it is not the Federal government who regulates breeding of puppies in particular - it is a Provincial area of responsiblilty.

2. The Federal government has regulations in place for any puppies being brought into Canada and in the case of any petstore, they must have a permit and all puppies are subject to Federal regulation and are inspected by Agriculture Canada veterinarians before being allowed into Canada.

PIJAC ( the pet industry national organization ) was a major participant in the push to get cross border federal regulation of puppies coming into Canada.

3. A few Provinces recently have changed thier Animal Care Acts to provide for breeding rules, regulation and inspection of breeding kennels. It has been the pet stores in particular through PIJAC and the Canadian Veterinary Medical Association who have been major participants with those Provincial governments who have changed their Animal Care Acts.

4. The Canadian Kennel Club does not enforce how puppies are bred by their members and in fact have not actively, to the best of my knowledge, been in the forefront in attempts to regulate, by law, breeding of puppies

5. By recent survey, about 15% of all puppies sold in pet stores are bred by CKC breeders. Pet stores are one of the smallest sources of puppies in Canada.

6. The vast majority of puppies, especiall puppy mill style of breeding, are actually sold through internet sites, newspapers and through yard signs. Even the vast majority of properly bred puppies and puppies bred by Club members, are sold via magazines, newspaper and internet - and most of those puppies are sold without the potential owners ever seeing the breeder - lets face it, Canada is a large geograpical area and makes it very difficult for new puppy parents to actually visit the breeder. Often puppies bred by Club members, etc are sold prior to the pups even being born.

7. As for Petland Canada stores, I know for a fact that who they purchase puppies from is very important and they do not knowingly support puppy mill breeding. Inspections are done on a regular basis and the breeders are known to Petland and must meet Petlands breeding guidelines since there is not any Government regulation. Should a puppy mill breeder be found, all Petland stores across Canada are advised of that breeder.

8. Animal care in all Petland stores is highly regulated and all stores are regularly inspected and of course are highly visible to the public and to organizations such as SPCA's ,etc - same cannot be said about breeders unfortunately.

9. Petland Canada and PIJAC ( Pet Industry Joint Advisory Council of Canada) are at the forefront with other groups, such as Veterinarians, in trying to work with each Province , one by one, to implement the licencing, regulating and inspection of dog breeders.

10. The word purebreed is a regulated word which refers to puppies whose parents are Club registered and the puppies have been registered.

Many breeders with Club registered parents do not wish to register litters with Clubs or are not Club members themselves and therefore the unregistered puppies are referred as "Yorkshire Terrier type" even though the parents are registered. It is done this way to avoid conflict with Federal law usuage of the word "purebreed".

IF YOU WANT TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT PUPPY MILLS - PLEASE WRITE YOUR PROVINCIAL MLA'S AND DEMAND THAT YOUR PROVINCE CHANGE THEIR ANIMAL CARE REGULATION TO BRING IN LICENCING, REGULATION AND INSPECTION OF DOG BREEDERS.

By doing this , we can all , the public and stores, have more reliance on the sourcing of puppies.

Thanks for that SHOUT OUT. And that is not the only way to SHUT down puppy mills through the licensing,regulation and inspection of "dog breeders".
For example one can make it Illegal to mass produce puppies. Large scale commercial dog breeding enterprises are banned outright.

You have missed an important point made throughout these responses; that is the fact reputable breeders do NOT place their puppies in stores to sell to the public. Puppies do not belong in stores for sale. Period

Petland Breeding Guidelines: Just where are they posted? Went to Petland.ca and could not find them online. Are these breeding guidelines in line with what each Breed's National club requires of their breeder members? Are genetic pre breeding screening and health testing, delineated and specified by breed? If not why not?

Just what "CLUB" are you referring to? If it is the Canadian Kennel Club, then use CKC, it will clarify who you are speaking about.
Many breeders with CKC registered parents don't want to register the litter? Really, that type of person, doesn't give you pause for concern? I wonder why they would not want to register the litter? Problem with parentage perhaps? Problem with the legality of the litter they just bred?

Do you not understand that reputable breeders will register their litters with CKC and or AKC?

Where is this recent survey that purports that 15% of all puppies sold are by CKC breeders? Where is this survey? What independent agency performed the survey?

What is Petland's responsibility for reporting this egregious breach of ethics to the CKC?
CKC Breeder Code of Practice
No breeder shall sell or donate dogs for the purpose of their being auctioned, raffled, or to pet stores.

Oh yes and welcome to Yorkie Talk. What an amazing first post.

:bravo: Well said Gemy.

[QUOTE=fraservalley;3519232]I have read all the posts and would like to make some comments

4. The Canadian Kennel Club does not enforce how puppies are bred by their members and in fact have not actively, to the best of my knowledge, been in the forefront in attempts to regulate, by law, breeding of puppies


9. Petland Canada and PIJAC ( Pet Industry Joint Advisory Council of Canada) are at the forefront with other groups, such as Veterinarians, in trying to work with each Province , one by one, to implement the licencing, regulating and inspection of dog breeders.

10. The word purebreed is a regulated word which refers to puppies whose parents are Club registered and the puppies have been registered.


Really? Actually they do enforce to the best of their ability (under the current law) and what they are under this current law able to do; the breeding of puppies. CKC as you should know is regulated and incorporated under the Department of Agriculture, as a purebreed registry.
In fact it is the pre-eminent pure breed registry in Canada.

In terms of Number 9 The CEO of CKC was at and spoke at the last meeting April 13 2011 of PIJAC and the Summit. So I wonder why the CKC was there if not to be a leading part in this "idea" of PIJAC or URban Summit or associates to try to impose legislation on the breeders of dogs.

In terms of No 10 well thank god the word is regulated, the CKC did right by that. At least there is some protection by law, for anyone petstore or backyard breeder to not willy nilly use the term pure bred.

As I pointed out earlier, it is against CKC rules to let CKC breeders sell pups to the petstore industry, PETLAND included. And believe you me, they would need a bylaw change to change that code. Which needs to be voted on by the membership.

But again welcome to YT, I'm so sure we will have lots of informative and helpful posts from you. BTW why not post a pic of your Yorkie for us to admire?







.

Gemy - thanks for your post - I have a feeling though we may come from different sides of the question of proper breeding, our eventual aims are very similar - proper breeding and it does not matter who does the breeding.

Yes I am aware of the Summit meeting and yes CKC representatives were there. PIJAC spoke at the meeting as well as the President of Petland Canada who spoke by invitation. Many good things came out of the Summit, perhaps the greatest being a better understanding of what all parties are doing instead of inuendo which unfortuantely very much prevails - lets not also forget some individual people and some groups, have personal agendas right up to elimination of private ownership of any pet - just let anyone try to take my two dogs from me, they are very much a full member of my family, in fact , sometimes I wish I was treated so well lol and I believe the majority of pet owners are the same as myself and yourself.

But the world is not perfect - just look at how much child abuse we have, even abuse between adults or children against children. All we can do collectively is to make sure we know real situations and try to put in place a system which can hopefully address the source of the problem.

Your comment about CKC - you alluded to and is a fact, that CKC does not have the resources to actually monitor how thier members breed or who they sell to - the fact is that CKC members do sell to the public directly and through good petstores - I do think that CKC members are probably careful as to which stores they have dealings with. It is not that long ago the CKC allowed petstores to be members of CKC and accepted registrations through them. I remember reading at one time in their handbook that it is not legal for them to be able to say who can sell to who. I know they have changed thier practice but I am not sure if a court challenge were launched that CKC could continue the practice of saying who thier members can sell to or through. I am not a lawyer but I do know under fair trade practices, do not think I would want to argue that CKC has the power to restrict unfairly - but that is not the issue we are talking about - the issue is improper breeding - period.

It is also unfair, and you did not say this, to paint all pet stores as being bad. The majority who do have puppies, have at the forefront the welfare of the puppies in their care. Stores are highly visible to the public and government agencies - more so than any other source of puppies. Stores are not the problem of improper breeding. You must get to the source, the breeders themselves and good breeders I am sure would welcome being able to have a method of "certification" that their breeding practices are proper. It would be fantastic for the public and stores to be able to have that same assurance that the breeder had agreed to adhere to proper inspection and breeding practices.

I do know as an example one Petland store in my area, who received two puppies from a very reputable breeder, I believe a Club member but not absolutely sure, the two puppies were found to be in need of liver shunts - a very expensive procedure. The breeder was contacted and the store was honestly told that the breeder just could not afford such an operation and if the pups were returned, she would have no choice but to put them to rest. Petland sent the pups to the University of Saskatchewan in Saskatoon to have the operations performed, the cost , in excess of $7000 dollars - both those pups are now in separate fantastic homes in the White Rock area, both doing very well.

I guess the gyst of my comments are that all sides must work together for a common good without pointing fingers - there is good and there is bad in all directions, breeders, the Clubs, animal welfare groups, stores and even SPCA s - I can only say again, lets put pressure where something can be done, at our Provincial governments - they have the road to a better solution.

And let all of us watch for proper animal care, after all, our pets only ask to be cared for properly, in return they give unconditional love without us even asking for it.

You suggested I post a picture of my Yorkshire Terrier - unfortunately she has just recently passed away. I had her for many years and she latched onto me the moment we saw each other. She was from a CKC member, a show breeder who was also a Veterinarian - she was absolutely terrified of people, need I say more. I had heard about her through another breeder. The dog had been bred once and the birthing had been very difficult. I bought the mother, had her spayed and she was a wonderful companion for many years even though she would not look at me if I was holding another dog, especially if a puppy lol - she would actually walk in front of me and turn her head away while passing me - it was so funny................

The main problem I have with pet stores is that they pretty much have to sell to anyone who has the cash. They aren't going to discern if the buyer would make a suitable puppy owner of a particular breed. The same is true of many breeders, and any breeder who would sell to a pet store is a poor breeder, it doesn't matter if their affiliations are with AKC or CKC as there are poor breeders in both organizations. To imply that because someone is affiliated with the CKC, they must be good, is rather naïve. We see it all the time on Yorkietalk, people buying Yorkies without having a clue on what type of commitment it will take, and rescues are loaded with dogs whose owners made uniformed impulse decisions. One of the marks of being a good breeder is thoroughly checking out the family who wishes to own a pet. If you're running a business, you'll take shortcuts with this vital step. Yay rah for them for them to pay for the dog's liver shunt surgery.

a PS to my previous post

1. I do not support improper breeding done by anyone, including CKC members , nor the selling of puppies by anyone knowingly bred improperly.

2. there are many Clubs other than CKC, they are just not recognized under Federal legislation - but they are breeder Clubs, usually for a specific breed only..

3. I have done my best on this subject to listen to and investigate all angles to the problem of improper breeding and am aware of most of the agendas which exist in the public realm - and I know many of the misconceptions which apply to the question of improper breeding, I was a member of the Federal government process which brought in new regulations for puppies entering Canada. I am aware of the work the then Justice Minister, Kim Campbell did regarding breeding in Canada but nothing could be done within Canada on a Federal basis, it is strictly a Provincial area of responsibility - that is why I urge everyone to press their Provincial governments to change their Animal Care Acts.

As for reporting abuses to the CKC, the source of my dog which has just passed away, that breeder was reported many times to CKC and in fact the breeder was taken to Court many times, and always won and to this day I think, do not know for sure, is still a member of CKC - the proper legal rules are just not in place to deal with improper breeding and breeders.

I also urge people to have an open mind and really learn about puppy mills, what they are, what defines a puppy mill and to also learn about the many groups involved, some doing good, others just preying on the public for funds - I know of one organization in the USA, who collects approximately 100 million dollars a year but only spends about 500,000 dollars on direct animal care - isn;t that wonderful - in my humble opinion, that is outrageous !

BUT again, not speaking for any group, I know the only possible solution is Provincial action in their animal care acts - and the proper regulation of the source of puppies, the breeding source. Is it the full answer, nope - but it is the most logical.......... I do not understand why all breeders would not support this option ...

Fraservalley, I'm a little confused. Did you join YT to help you with your grief over the recent loss of your little one? This is the 1st thread I've seen where you've posted, so I was not sure.

I have found the people here at YT so helpful in getting over the grief of my little Cricket, who suffered all her life from health issues from poor breeding practices.

Petland Canada, Petland USA, the pups they sell are from Puppy Mills, plain and simple. To believe anything else is totally stupid. They do no checks, they pay a small amount to a mill, and then try to sell at a high price, and they actually get away with it. Warranty's are a joke. So they have Doctor Pain check them over, sign a guarantee, and send you home.

Why does someone work there? It is called a paycheck. Now some actually love working with animals, and most do not even know the bad things about mills.

NEVER buy from a store selling pups to just everyone. Buy from a reputable breeder, preferably one from the YTCA.ORG, or someone you really know and trust, with referals. That's my story, and I am sticking to it!

No I did not join Yorkie Talk for grief purposes - I was looking online for Yorkie organizations since I love Yorkies - and will get another one soon.

I started to read posts and came across this thread and it is an area which I have a certain passion and experience - improper breeding.

The one point I just do not understand is why go after the pet stores - when the problem is breeding - the most common thing I hear is money - and do not all breeders sell for money - some breeds are sold by breeders at huge sums. I do not know many who breed and just give away their pups - so the question is money and I do not fault them , the breeders or stores or the newspapers or anyone else who recieves money for their puppies - even shelters, SPCAs charge for the animals in their care - I have no fault with this.

I for one do not put breeders, whether CKC or other Club members, on any pedestal - nor anyone else involved with animals from owners of pets, organizations through to the source, the breeders. I believe most do the best they can and have the best motivations.

BUT I do have fault with the breeders who breed improperly - they are the problem, lets go after them AND in the process lets level the playing field, all breeders come under the same rules - and for me, who may wish to purchase a puppy, I do not expect to get it for nothing, it costs money to breed properly, ---- I would like to know that there is in place a set of guidelines which are monitored by someone who does not have a direct possible conflict of interest, whether they be stores, CKC or other clubs, or shelters.... and that the breeding rules are enforceable and that only, unfortuantely, comes by law ....

my last ps lol lol

I am sure you are getting already tired of reading my posts ...

but just to let you know, I am not just positng - I have contacted my MLA in BC who happens to be a Cabinet Minister and he is in agreement with me, and has agreed to assist with the MInister of Agriculture - who knows in time I hope BC has a new Animal Care Act ................but have already been surprised by individuals and organizations who should be in the know, who are opposed or seem to have their heads in the sand about puppy mills and who they are............. am just amazed - guess who are the greatest supporters of guidelines - the pet stores and veterinarians , wow !

So far, you have made 4 posts, and all are off base. You want to reduce Puppy Millers? Close every pet store that sells any type of canine. Now take a step back. Petland, and any other store that sells pups are nothing more than the food for the mills. The mills breed specifically for them, and also for running ads in various magazine under a spiffy name that will sell to anyone with a buck. They actually try to charge more than legit show breeders and hobby breeders. I see what your agenda is here, and it sticks.

[QUOTE=fraservalley;3519940]my last ps lol lol

I am sure you are getting already tired of reading my posts ...


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