Oh i know you arent upset just saying this topic tends to get people all "riled" up...as far as bows and clothes brett likes bentley to be a mans man and kelly likes him to look cute

My husband was the same way. I'd put bows in Chester's hair and my husband said that I was trying to turn him into an unmanly man(not exact words of course). But my babies are my babies. They follow me everywhere and I spend time loving on each one of them all of the time. You can tell that they are loved too. They will look me in the eye and the love that I see in them will stop my heart. They trust me completely.

You go to a mass producer. Do their dogs look lovingly into their breeder's eyes? No, chances are, they hang their heads down. It's really sad to see.

But you are right. Each person's definition of a mill is different. This topic tends to get people riled up and it will get closed...you mark my words!

haha - I just saw this - I think it's great you're both discussing this - hope the couch is comfy ! :D
and Angie - I truly hope it doesn't get closed - it's a good topic and this is how we learn....I know it's sensitive but it's out of compassion that we discuss it - I for one don't like how they turn into debates and this is a great start to a healthy discussion I think.....if ONE person gets interested in learning more about the Puppy Mills in this country then we did a great thread !

it's all good :D

On a more personal note hehehe its has been brought to my attention that this posts looks like i am bashing my breeder please do not take it as such. all i am saying is i am guilty of not doing enough research we tend to follow our hearts and not our gut instincts.

me too with my cocker Tessa AND my yorkie Chanel. Her breeder had LOTS of yorkies and I now consider HER a small mill - When I got Chanel she was INSIDE the house in a playpen - with other yorkies - but after we paid for her - we were shown the place she kept the breeding females. NOT NICE. They were kept in a seperate facility that was in the back - dirt floors - I asked about Air Conditioning - she said yes - I didn't believe her.

By that time I had held Chanel for an hour and was NOT giving her back - her breeder is one I warn people about - There was no WAY those yorkies in the back were getting what they needed - I could tell by her attitude once she had the money in her hand. I never got any help from her when Chanel came home with coccidia - she played dumb and stopped answering my calls after the 1st call.

THAT is a bad breeder to me and I have no problem bashing her. I LOVE my Chanel but feel that breeder doesn't care what she sells or if her puppies are sick - a friend has a yorkie from the SAME breeder purchased 6 years ago,

Her yorkie had such severe LP she had 2 operations before she was a year old. NO help from the breeder for her either - Her yorkie also weighs 14 pounds....and has severe allergies and other problems. I'm VERY lucky Chanel has no health issues.

I'm with Villette on this one. I personally don't dress my dogs for fun, theirs or mine, because it's mostly pointless, the other kids undress the dressed ones as fast as I can put the stuff on! though I will admit to the occasional funny hat. We do have sweatshirts for chilly outings, but that's about it.
My view on the mill thing is this...mass production of dogs is wrong, they ought not be viewed as a commodity, because they quality of what is produced in that manner is poor. Go look at the sick/training threads for examples of what bad breeding practices result in. Dogs need to be nurtured in a household environment to become good household pets. Even healthy dogs, screened and vetted and fed and kept clean and not over bred that are raised in a mass production environment lack important behavior/socialization skills that are essential to a good dog. Brokers that perpetuate this situation are abhorrent. Backyard breeders are equally as bad when producing puppies without the knowledge of the genetic health background of the dogs bred, especially in a breed with as many potential problems as the yorks can carry without showing in the breeding pair. The ignorance is inexcusable. Anyone promoting the breeding of dogs without this essential background information is just doing a great disservice to the breed. Just because someone has two intact dogs with 'papers' (or without) does not mean they should have pups. Unfortunately they are told the dogs are 'cute' and healthy enough and it's their right to do what they want.
I don't think you can place a number on the amount of dogs a good breeder should have. It is a case by case situation regarding the amount of help each one has in caring for the animals and the space they have in the home. Common sense should rule here. It is obvious to me that I alone could not possibly love and care for 30 dogs properly by myself. There are just not enough hours in the day.
To address one other comment made...buying the mill pups to get them out of the situation only fosters the problem by providing continuing income to the producers. It is tragic to walk away from the sad pups, and I admire all the work done by Bichon rescue in buying auction dogs to rescue, but I don't know if that is a real solution. I believe the only hope for real change is education for the general public to eliminate the market for the mass produced dogs. It's a long shot, but worth trying for.

Oh yes..this topic was a hot one last night in our house. Brett does know that there are infact mills..b/c i pull them up and about cry and make him come look at the pictures.. we just have different opinions on what we consider mills, which is why he made this thread.

I think all the responses we've had are GREAT! And Villette is right... if one new person read this thread and was exposed to what a puppymill is and how horrible they are .. i think we've accomplished something. Honestly i wish there was a way to inform every person in the world about them!!

As far as brett's dog... He's Spoiled and brett knows it! He just thinks that i don't have to dress him up all the time..But i swear i would not do it if Bentley hated that and Brett knows that. I think Brett is slowly starting to get use to the fact that i'm going to dress bentley up. This is a direct quote from him " You can dress up the girl when we get her..But then will you please stop making him look so girly" Haha i told him i'd quit asking to put bows in his hair..but the clothes STAY..and he Finally agreed!

I think it's GREAT that he posted - it shows he's interested and up for suggestions - that or he wanted confirmation that he didn't have to sleep on the couch - sorry Brett ! :D oh...and there are REALLY CUTE sports clothes - what's his favorite team ? lol - bows too !

I agree. I actually would like to breed my baby in the FAR future.. That's why in search of a female. Bentley hasn't had any health problems which i am VERY thankful for. However, If i get a female that has any kind of problem, i will not breed her. I would just really like to be a breeder. In a few years we will be financially stable to where that's what i can devote my time to. My dogs!! That's why i think this site is also great. There's so much you can learn or so many people you can ask if you ever need/want to know anything!

haha no..he got to stay in the bed! He is actually really intrested in others opinions thats why he was like "i think i'm gonna post on YT. " I was unsure at first about him posting it b/c i didnt want to start a huge controvesry. But i think everyones opinions are great now that i'm reading them!!

he knows about sports clothes... he wants an OU shirt for bentley. but shhhhhh dont tell him i told!

haha - I'm sure the couch was very happy too :D

That's great you're learning before breeding - I totally agreed with Sylvans post too - and see ? We didn't get hot or have this thread turn into a debate - YAY ! everyone added helpful information and opinions here.

THIS is the kind of information that can only help someone new to breeding or getting a puppy - or who really doesn't know the difference in breeders ....or know about Brokers and Puppy Mills... that they DO exist and are NOT good...or don't know to STAY AWAY from Pet Stores.

There are good breeders out there - we just have to find them and pass them along to our friends.

I agree 100% . I honestly didnt know ANYTHING about mills before i joined this site. I just got online before brett was about to go and got some advice from a website.
It was like what to look for when buying a puppy. Which help a little too. I'm very greatful we actually got a good breeder. The only bad thing now is that i want to go and bust everyone and give them a piece of my mind while i'm doing it!

ME TOO ! You. GO. GIRL.

That's the best thing I've heard all day and exactly why these threads are great for information....they stir our emotions into wanting to do something.
And we can each help in our own way. Good for you and Brett - I enjoyed this thread - thanks ! wish I could get my hubby this interested.

I just want to say that I have truly enjoted reading this thread!!!! Really!!! Great info and great opinions!!! And how cool that-Kelly- your hubby has taken interest!!!! That is why we are here-- to learn, ask questions, offer advise and talk yorkies!!!! I love how great this thread has come out so far!

Thanks all of you!!!!!
I really have enyoyed this one--I learned a few things myself!!!!!

--Mandy--

I would like to add one more interesting experience to this post..before I got my little guy, I deceided to find the most reputable breeders in the immediate driveable area. I went to 4 or 5. Three were breeders who actually show at the "big" shows- have a long time kennel name which is known in the area , etc. One thing that bothered me about two of them..even with all the ribbons ( from show winnings)- championships etc, there were still over 30 dogs. The were in an air conditioned room.. but most of them were in crates.. and I do not believe very socialized.Also, they did not look very groomed. I just felt funny about the whole thing. It was not a mill..but "something" was missing. No real one on one time. I walked away..It is hard to think that having more than a few-- maybe 5 or so(?), can these furbabies really get care and enough love that they deserve. We are having trouble with just three dogs.. and thats spending all our time with them. Our home life revolves around these guys..
But all in all ,..this is a hard thing to really judge..and I am just expressing my own experiences.