This is Not Working and Only Getting Worse
 

Just a little background for those who have not read the other threads: Logan is 9 months old. We've had him for 6 months. We were crate training him, but he kept waking me up in the middle of the night, at least once or twice, to go outside. I was not getting any sleep. We thought about rehoming him (for several reasons) but changed our minds last weekend. We decided to put him in our tiny laundry room with a pee pad at night. For three nights, the floor AND pee pad stayed dry. He slept through the night. I thought we were home free.

Then the past two nights he started peeing on the floor several times at night (he did not have any water in the room) instead of the pee pad AND he has started barking in the middle of the night. Last night, he was up barking at 1 a.m. and again around 5 a.m. Both times I went to check on him, he had peed on the floor. There is not enough room in the laundry room to put down another pee pad without blocking the entrance to the laundry room, which would make it impossible for someone to step into the laundry room without walking on the pee pad.

So now Logan is not only peeing on the floor but he's barking constantly when he's in the room and now in the middle of the night. I have tried ignoring him as the advice said to do. I tried putting some of his urine on the pee pad, but he still peed on the floor.

I am going out of town in two days and taking him with me. I cannot put other families through this each night! I don't know what to do. I'm about to call the breeder to see if he wants Logan back. In the meantime, Logan is on medication for possible liver shunt, including an antibiotic. This is just too overwhelming for us right now, especially with all that is going on in our lives (helping my aging in-laws with a move, two kids in college, etc.).

I am having issues with getting up in the middle ot the night with Baxter also. He sleeps with me and wakes me up about 3:00, it was 4:00. He is 4 1/2 months old. I am hoping he will grow out of this. Good luck.

I put Logan back in his crate and, ironically, he seems happier and is NOT barking in there. Seems like he doesn't like more freedom in his "own room" and would prefer to be in his crate. Is that odd??

No, that is not odd. When we first moved, 11 years ago, when Sydney was just a year old, she felt more 'secure' in her crate until she adjusted to our new home.

Sheila

[F]It does not seem odd to me.:animal36
His crate is his "den". He feels safe and secure in there. It is a small area...comfy and cozy. Does he pee in his crate?
Having a puppy right now (12 weeks old today) he loves his crate.
At night he is in our room in a large cage type crate with his portable airline type crate in it. I put a towel down on the floor of the cage crate and some of his favorite toys. He sleeps in his more solid crate with the door off. [/FONT]

Did your breeder guarantee against liver shunt?

I wish you lived closer, I'd take care of Logan while you are away. Hubby & I are retired, and I don't sleep all night anyway.

I feel bad for you, you've got such a lot on your plate right now.

Sheila

have you talked to the vet about this?? I read in this book called "The Loved Dog" that if dogs keep peeing everywhere that they may have something wrong with them... so I would take him to the vet and ask about it...?? Im soooooo sorry this is happening to you... good luck...

He has no idea what the pad is for, seriously. You've been taking him outside and then all of the sudden you want him to go on a pad. It's not like a littler box - they don't take to the pads. My dogs go outside and if I put a pad down in front of it they would probably either shred it or sleep on it but they sure wouldn't pee on it! :D If he needs to go out in the middle of the night, then he needs to go out! Yes, it sucks. No, you don't get any sleep. It's part of having a puppy (yes he is still a puppy) This may go on for quite a while. I don't get this - if he needs to go out LET HIM OUT. Loki used to have accidents in his crate (not his fault, he has medical issues he is now on medication for) and we would have to SET AN ALARM and wake up and take him out or he would pee in his crate at night. You do what you have to do! I don't want to come off as harsh, but I believe I've already given this advice to you. It's JUST like having a baby that needs to eat every few hours.

Have you contacted a trainer who will help you? You need a positive reinforcement trainer who will teach you to communicate with him. He's probably very smart and trying to tell you something. If he's barking all night (after he's relieved himself and therefore not barking to go out) he is probably BORED and not tired. Take him to doggy daycare for one day and I promise you he will sleep through the night. If he's barking during the day, then yes ignoring him is the right approach but there is a way to do it that a trainer can teach you. You ignore him until he stops and THEN you go acknowledge him. It also helps to teach him commands so he learns to listen to you. He is just barking because he doesn't want to be in there and he is bored. Sammy barks in her crate when she doesn't want to be in there, but when she is tired she will just sleep in it. We try to only put her in there when she is tired. You can also give him Kongs and other frozen stuffed toys to keep him busy while he is in there.

This is good advise. He could have a UTI, which is painful and causes them to pee all over. A trip to the vet is in order.

He has used a pee pad before. When we have traveled and stayed at a hotel, we have put Logan in a play pen with a pee pad, and he has used the pee pad faithfully during those times. For some reason, the pee pad seems foreign to him when it's in a tiny room.

When we had our Maltese, I took him outside in the middle of the night while he was a puppy, but that lasted only for a couple of months or perhaps even one month. I don't recall, but I know it was not long. Logan is now 9 months old, and my understanding is that he should not still have to go potty in the middle of the night, especially every 2-3 hours. He doesn't go out that often during the day.

I know it seems like no big deal to you to have to take a dog out to potty in the middle of the night. Temporarily, it isn't a big deal. But six months - and still counting - is a long time to lose sleep. I'm not 20-something anymore with a human baby. I'm 48 years old, so not getting a good, solid night's sleep is difficult and hard on me. How old does Logan have to be before he SHOULD sleep through the night? And why does he sometimes sleep through the night and sometimes he doesn't? Everything about this is inconsistent.

Logan gets plenty of exercise during the day. We take one or two long walks, and he acts worn out when we return. He plays a lot of night and doesn't go to bed until about 11 p.m. when we do. I don't see how he couldn't be tired by the end of the day. Yes, when he stops barking, I reward him. And often when he's quiet, I will reward him and tell him "good quiet."

I put him in his crate today instead of giving him room to roam in the laundry room, and he's been happier and quieter that way. So, obviously, he prefers his crate over the laundry room. I have not contacted a trainer other than the PetSmart trainer who did our training class. I talked to her about housetraining and have read books, articles, and Internet info on housetraining. I seem to be doing everything suggested. And I have successfully housetrained a dog before in a short period of time.

You may be interested to know....dogs with liver shunts are also prone to bladder control problems. That may be the reason Logan has to go so often.

I didn't know that. I talked to the breeder (who is a vet) today about Logan. He told me he doesn't believe Logan has a liver shunt (It was another vet who ran the blood work.). We'll find out soon enough.

Unfortunately he wouldn't be the first breeder to deny LS.

It's not "no big deal" to me. Waking up sucks. But the alternative is a big puddle on the floor (and I mean big!). Loki has a condition that causes him to have to pee like 4 times as much as the average dog. Medication has him to where he can sleep most nights, but if he drinks too much or we go to bed early he's whining to go out. It's not his fault. Every dog is different. All I'm saying is that IF Logan needs to go out, you have to let him out. It's only fair. If you think there is another problem then you need to talk to the vet about that. If you used pee pads in a different location he will still not know to use them. Dogs learn that it's OK to potty in a certain spot. Crating him is fine if it's working. We crated Loki until he learned how to wake us up to let him out rather than peeing in his crate. Then as he only needed to go out one time and knew to go outside, we let him sleep with us and he would jump off the bed and scratch at the bedroom door. That worked well with Sammy when we got her too (we have a bell upstairs and downstairs). Now we don't have to sleep with the door closed because they just run downstairs and ring their bell. I know you said you don't want him to sleep with you, but we went from 2 trips outside to 1 once we let Loki start sleeping with us. He also slept a little longer in the morning.

Also, 2 walks and playtime is not the same as daycare. Seriously the first time my dogs went to daycare they slept for 3 days straight. Loki couldn't be bothered to do more than eat and pee for a week. Just once a week will make a difference.

No, he did not guarantee against liver shunt. I didn't get any kind of guarantee other than a verbal one: if something happens to the puppy or is wrong with him, he would replace him with another puppy. He told me the other day that he is willing to do this if it turns out Logan has a liver shunt. But I don't really want to "replace" him like I would a damaged pair of pants!

I do take him out when he wakes up in the middle of the night to go out. He woke me up at 4:15 this morning to go out, but then didn't get up again until 9:15. That's better. He was also quiet. So, he obviously prefers his crate over a little more freedom in his "own" room.

A reputable breeder guarantees against genetic diseases such as liver shunt. I understand what you are saying that you wouldn't exchange him 'like a damaged pair of pants', but, when a a breeder gives this guarantee it tells you, they breed responsibly. (in most cases) And in the case of liver shunt, very often, a breeder will help you with the expenses, etc. Reputable breeders are not quick to deny liver shunt; they want to know what is in their lines.

I wasn't suggesting you give him up.

Sheila

I have seen sellers refund the price of the puppy or exchange the pup for another but never any that will incur any of the expenses.

When I bought my tiny Kia, from Susan Harasim, of Stardust Yorkies, 9 years ago, as we went over her health guarantee, I made the comment I could never give her back, and Susan told me, that if anything developed, and I wanted to keep my puppy, she'd work things out with medical and help me.

I don't know how she handles things today, but that was how it was 9 years ago.

I also have a friend In FL that breeds Maltese and shows, and she has told me that she would also cover medical expenses. So, there are some excellent breeders out there...even if only few and far between.

Sheila

You need to make a decision on what you are going to do with the puppy.

If you are going to rehome..then rehome.
If you are going to keep him, then keep him with all his faults and love him and work with him to make him a valuable member of the family. If you keep looking at him as a pain in the butt, then that is how you are going to feel about him in general. That isn't fair to him.

If you find out he does have a liver shunt, are you going to get rid of him because he has a problem?

If having him makes your life stressful...then you are also making his life stressful, even if you don't mean to.

I hope you find a solution for both of you.

im so sorry you are having problems with him. i found that with my yorkie Teddy, we cut off the waterbowl about 2 hours before bedtime. my hubby then takes him out one last time before he comes to bed (i go to bed earlier than he does). i dont know if you have tried that. also, maybe take him to the vet and see what he advises to do to help him sleep through the night (so you can sleep) he may prescribe a light sleeping pill to use for a few weeks until he falls into the habit to sleep.. i dont know what to tell you besides that. just my 2 cents-others have given you really great advice here-im new.

I had the same problems with Carter. I'm still trying to crate train him, and I set my alarm for four hours after we go to bed so I can take him to his potty pad.

What if you tried the crate in the laundry room and leave it open so he could get to the potty pad if he needed to? I have no idea if that would work, I'm a new yorkie owner as well. Just a thought, though.

I feel your pain. After a week of having him I was exhausted and wanted to give him back. I decided I was too enamored and would miss him too much, but he is still frustrating a lot of the time. I'm hoping he's just being a puppy and will grow out of a lot of the frustrations, and hopefully he'll potty train.

I do plan on taking him to a trainer when he finishes his shots, and the trainer I contacted said she would help in housebreaking as well. Maybe this is an option for you too?

Here is my advice for sleeping through the night. Take away his water at like 10pm (if you go to bed at 11pm) wait about a half hour, then take him out to pee. Make sure he goes. Once you bring him in, put him in his crate for the night. Dogs generally do not pee in their crate (unless he truely does have a health problem). Put his crate next to your bed, put a softly ticking clock in there and an old sweater/sweatshirt of yours as bedding. Then lay a blanket over the crate. I bet you he sleeps like a baby all night long! :) :) Unless hes got an underlying problem, he is definately old enough to sleep through the night now.

I am going to have to echo Erin's comments. I know from personal experience what it's like to lose sleep because your yorkie has to get up to go pee, every single night of the week!

Millie has always gone in the middle of the night. In the beginning she did it 2 x a night and now she is down to 1 x a night. She is 3 years old! I know she will have to go in the middle of the night for the rest of her life. I am ok with that. It first started out as whining from her crate, then when she was reliably housebroken, we let her sleep with us and now she climbs on my back and chirps in my ears and will keep at it until I wake up. (sometimes, it takes a while for it to sink in thru my heavy sleep daze :D) So for her to get me up in the middle of the night only reinforces to me that she is housebroken! She will not do it in the house. So I rejoice at this!!:bravo::bravo::bravo:

So be thankful that your yorkie whines to get you up to let him out. I think this is splendid and should be looked at like a "positive". (I have just acquired a rescue that will not let me know she (Jazzy) has to go. She does hold it most nights throughout the night, but every now and then she will just do it in her pen and move to the side to avoid it. She will do it on her pillow where she sleeps if there is no other room to go). So you need to reward your little one for whining, because he cares enough to let you know he has to go out.

Oh by the way, I am 52 years old and I work starting at 7:30am five days a week. Having Millie 100% housebroken is worth maybe 5-10minutes of loss of sleep every night.

I too have noticed that Millie will sleep the entire night, only when we have had a very very eventful day and she gets very little sleep during the day. These would be week-end days. Because even though she gets a good 30 minute walk every day and she is active as soon as we get home from work, this is not enough to keep her from waking up a least the 1x a night.

I hope you find the right solution for both you and Logan.

Of course, the breeder said that it's probably not a liver shunt...Vet or not, many, many breeders will do whatever it takes to deny liver shunt in their lines...

I want to add that dogs with liver problems have bladder problems secondary to the liver disease. Because the liver is not functioning properly, it causes problems with stones/crystals...I tell you this because when my yorkie was feeling sick, he would pee off the pad and pee somewhere to get attention. It was his way of telling me that he was not feeling well. He does have liver problems and we have finally gotten the bladder problems under control. My advice to you is to have a urinalysis and urine culture done. Have them check for crystals in Logan's urine and have them check his pH.
Does he eat dry food or canned food and what kind?

I agree...A reputable breeder will never make you give the dog back for a refund or to exchange for another unless that is what you choose. I know of several reputable breeders who will help with medical expenses.

It's important to find out if the dog has liver problems. Water should not be withheld for liver compromised dogs ever. They need access to water at all times and should have access to pee whenever they get the urge because of the fact that many liver compromised dogs do have bladder problems.

Maybe Logan feels isolated in the laundry room or he sees it a a punishment. He obviously like his crate. Can you bring his crate to your room or just outside of your room? I don't know if the laundry room is a place that Logan spends anytime other than sleep in but I would think that environment has something to do with behaviour. We have Hot Rod's pen in the family room where we spend all our evenings. We've never really had any issues with him pottying. I had a baby monitor so I could hear him before he started barking. Maybe he just feels insecure and needs to be closer to normal surroundings. Some also suggested that it might be a uti, could he have kidney stones?

Puppies have lots of energy. What may be tiring to you may not necessarily be tiring to them. I know that we play with Hot Rod a lot in the evenings and we try to walk with him several times a day. We probably walk total of about 1- 1 1/2 miles a day. He's only 3 lbs so that is a lot for him, I think but he seems to tired out at the end of the day. We play fetch with him for quite awhile at night so he can run off his energy.

Just some suggestions. I wish you the best with Logan.

This is what we were doing. I left the crate door off and put the pee pad next to his crate so that he would have to walk by it on the way to the entrance to the room. He peed everywhere besides the pee pad and didn't like being in the laundry room. He seems to like being closed in his crate and placed next to our bed.

We took him to PetSmart for pet training, and I asked the trainer about housebreaking. She didn't have anything new to offer other than what we were already doing.