Even from a Vet!

[gemy]

So yesterday I took Razz for his annual check up to our general vet. We had the usual social chitchat. Nancy(the vet) admired the boy, oohed and awhed over his coat. Then she asked me if I had bred him yet. I said no, that is the breeders decision, and he will need all his health checks done first. CERF, knees, etc. Awh she said - who is your breeder? I really like Razz's temperament, and conformation and I know at 6.2 lbs he's within the standard, but I want a smaller yorkie, you know a "pocket pouch"!. I want my little girl to be able to pick him up!. I thought to myself, 6 pounds is heavy, huh how old is her child. So I asked her and she 12 years old. Awh okay because you know this breed is not recommended for homes with young children. She said yes.

Then I said what do you mean about pocket pooch? She said you know smaller than Razzle. Welll I said firstly pocket pooch is not a term fine high quality breeders use. The smaller sized yorkies often have more health challenges, which I hope you are aware of. She then asked me what they were. I referred her to a couple of sites, this being one of them for more details on health risks for Yorkies.

She then asked me why I wrapped Razzle? I said it is to protect the hair so that it will grow long.
Oh she said, well one of the reasons I like Yorkies is their long silky coat. I said you aren't going to get that without first good genetics, then a whole lot of work on your part.

I ended the conversation there and wrote down all the sites I had referred her to and my breeders name and phone number.

But I continue to be surprised by the general vet's lack of understanding about show dogs, breeding, and good grief she is a vet and thinking about a Yorkie without doing awhole lot of investigating into the breed!

I've got to find a new general vet nearby

[Nancy1999]

My vet told me that he learns breed specific knowledge through good breeders, this is one of the reasons I like him. While there may be some excellent reference books for breeders, this is not the sort of thing vets learn in school. Much of what we learn on Yorkietalk is "political correctness," and how good breeders should not use certain terms, a vet wouldn't really know much about this, unless knowledgeable people tell them. Was she good at listening to you, and did she respect your opinion? I don't think most vets give very good breeding advice, you really need to go to the experts for that, and those are the breeders who have joined breed clubs, and share their knowledge with other breeders. I actually think vets have it harder than human doctors, they have to understand so many different species, and even among species they have so many different categories, or breeds. I mean what works for one breed, doesn't always work for another. You might have an opportunity to teach her lots about the Yorkshire terrier breed, and any vet who wants a Yorkie, can't be all bad.

[orlnurse]

Its unfortunate that some vet's knowledge isn't what we expect. I knew I needed to find a new vet when she had no clue what Acana kibble or the raw food diet was. When she advised me to get Eukanuba (apologies to anyone who feeds Eukanuba) on my first visit I should have known then.... Thank goodness for yorkietalk, I've learned so much here!

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by orlnurse

Its unfortunate that some vet's knowledge isn't what we expect. I knew I needed to find a new vet when she had no clue what Acana kibble or the raw food diet was. When she advised me to get Eukanuba (apologies to anyone who feeds Eukanuba) on my first visit I should have known then.... Thank goodness for yorkietalk, I've learned so much here!

I do think vets know more about nutrition than the average person.


"Preveterinary courses should emphasize the sciences. Veterinary medical colleges typically require applicants to have taken classes in organic and inorganic chemistry, physics, biochemistry, general biology, animal biology, animal nutrition, genetics, vertebrate embryology, cellular biology, microbiology, zoology, and systemic physiology. . . http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_educa...a_veterinarian "

Now this is before even go to veterinary school. You must remember as a scientist, a vet is trained in looking for "proof" not opinions. All the papers you read on the net about nutrition are available to vets, but there isn't much science to back them up. Vets are not interested in giving you the "best" diet; they are interested in giving you a good diet that has shown to be safe. When people can understand this, they will understand why vets do not recommend certain diets, not enough information is known yet on the safety. A doctor's motto is, "First do no harm."

[topknot]

Yep! Most vets do not know breed specifics (standard for each breed). There are just too many breeds for them (vets) to know. I would not be able to tell you about poodles, since I have not researched/studied them. Same for vets. I use to work for a vet as a tech and know first hand of this. They do know health, but that is it - unless they are interested in a particular breed and study up on that breed you really do not know. This is what gets me when someone asks their vets if it is okay to breed their dog. Health is one thing and most vets will not recommend the various test for breeding unless the owner asked about them. So these people that have asked for the okay to breed - most have not had the testing done or know the standard. It is just a quick once over health check to see if it looks okay health wise from the vet that the bitch would do okay whelping. That is all it is. Not whether it is to breed standard or had thorough health screenings done. I have had to educate my vet. He is really good with health stuff, but I have had to educate him. When I was first asking and doing screenings - I was the only one having them done out of all his patients. Now there are more, I think do to more people being educated. But it is slow. We just have to keep educating our vets on our breed as well as getting information out their to others - reg. lay person.

[BellaBlue82]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

I do think vets know more about nutrition than the average person.


"Preveterinary courses should emphasize the sciences. Veterinary medical colleges typically require applicants to have taken classes in organic and inorganic chemistry, physics, biochemistry, general biology, animal biology, animal nutrition, genetics, vertebrate embryology, cellular biology, microbiology, zoology, and systemic physiology. . . WikiAnswers - What education or training do you need to become a veterinarian "

Now this is before even go to veterinary school. You must remember as a scientist, a vet is trained in looking for "proof" not opinions. All the papers you read on the net about nutrition are available to vets, but there isn't much science to back them up. Vets are not interested in giving you the "best" diet; they are interested in giving you a good diet that has shown to be safe. When people can understand this, they will understand why vets do not recommend certain diets, not enough information is known yet on the safety. A doctor's motto is, "First do no harm."

I think the OP's vet was just trying to understand the workings of that particular breed from someone who owns a yorkie first hand. IMO, vets don't need to know every little detail about every single breed, that would be asking too much. As long as they have a great love for animals and will be there if our babies get sick, that's all that matters. To the OP, I'm glad that you were able to give her some good general information on our lovely little breed! I do have to interject that I have three kids (ages 7, 5, and 15 months) and they love their Sasha to death (and she loves them, tounge baths and all!), so I think yorkies can do great in homes with small children, as long as the children are supervised and know how to handle the small pup. In the end though, hopefully she'll do plenty of research on the breed before committing to buy, which I'm sure she will as she's obviously an animal lover to make it her profession.

[gemy]

Originally Posted by topknot

Yep! Most vets do not know breed specifics (standard for each breed). There are just too many breeds for them (vets) to know. I would not be able to tell you about poodles, since I have not researched/studied them. Same for vets. I use to work for a vet as a tech and know first hand of this. They do know health, but that is it - unless they are interested in a particular breed and study up on that breed you really do not know. This is what gets me when someone asks their vets if it is okay to breed their dog. Health is one thing and most vets will not recommend the various test for breeding unless the owner asked about them. So these people that have asked for the okay to breed - most have not had the testing done or know the standard. It is just a quick once over health check to see if it looks okay health wise from the vet that the bitch would do okay whelping. That is all it is. Not whether it is to breed standard or had thorough health screenings done. I have had to educate my vet. He is really good with health stuff, but I have had to educate him. When I was first asking and doing screenings - I was the only one having them done out of all his patients. Now there are more, I think do to more people being educated. But it is slow. We just have to keep educating our vets on our breed as well as getting information out their to others - reg. lay person.

I agree that the general practitioner of veterinary medicine, is unlikely to know all 270 or so breed standards. But I would expect a general vet to brush up on all the likely health problems for the top 5-10 dog breeds in the nation. As it is very likely that there will be a whole lot of those breeds entering their clinics. I contrast this with my specialist vet, who when I booked an appointment with him for one of my other dogs , which is a rare breed, had prior to my appointment researched this breed and knew the standard. It was our first appointment and he immediately bonded with my big boy, and spoke with me about the health problems that he knew from his research was prevalent to this breed. His physical exam was very through, including pulse points at different places in the canine anatomy. He understood in general and some specific ways about show dogs and breeding. Unfortunately for me this vet is 2hour drive away, and I do want someone closer in case of emergencies and for regular run of the mill vaccinations.

I too am in the health care arena, and I believe it is my responsibility to understand as much as I can about a condition, to be able to help and advise my client as best as I can, even if that means to refer out to another practioner who is more skilled or able in the arena of their medical condition.

Jmo

[Mardelin]

I do know that my vet in Texas is very knowledgable about he Yorkie Breed as most exhibitor/breeders use him. He also owns one of my breeder/mentor's yorkies. He also sits on the Vet Board with Dr. Center......

But, he also told me that a good vet always keeps breed specific breeder's numbers in their rolodex files and use them readily, as they are the experts.

[topknot]

We live in a very, very small town. So knowing breed specifics comes as they are introduced to them case by case, such as when I educated my vet on the yorkie breed. He is so much better now. I would have to say though as a general rule - my vets clients are mostly just pet owners and so many of them do not know the breed specifics. If they ask - he will advice them. I have known my vet for some 14 years. He has come a long way with knowing about yorkies now. Did he know so much when I first started going to him - I would say no. He did know about the petellas and then learned about the liver. He now does specific tests at his clinic. He is a great vet, but is not a specialist. The vet I worked for was back in the 80s and many of the clients just did not ask for specific information or asked for specific tests unless it was an emergency/illness.

My vet has never asked about a pocket pooch nor called them so. He does know about that - not correct, but then I think I may informed him of this in the past. He will however ask me about breed standard questions, which I am very pleased about. Mary - I guess I am his (yorkies) breeders informant in his Rolodex. He owns 2 large mixed breed dogs.
Unfortunely most of the yorkies he sees is not to standard and he has stated so. Also in my area and at my local breed club - I am the only one with a yorkie. I keep hoping that someone with yorkies would join.