Even altered males mark as well as some females. Both of mine do and Hefner was altered very early before i even got him at 12 weeks. My standard poodle got worse after I got Hefner. I have had to work hard to train them both and they still wear bands in the house but they usually manage to keep them dry. If they didn't, my house would be like Lisa described with little puddles everywhere.

My daughter's dog, Buddha was altered at 9 months and he is good for her but when he come to my house with the other males he marks and has to wear to a band as a result. I love them all and would never not have one because of this issue. It is just something we learn to deal with. :)

thank you. i'm glad to see some people agree with me. people, this is getting way out of hand, please just STOP :mad: :(

I wish it stop too . It is getting way out of hand .

i know its not ok, thats why its rediculous that this thread is continuing like this. and kim i understand what you were trying to explain to villette, but the chocolate thread and the vaccines really had nothing to do with this. i respect your opinion, and i hope you don't take this rudely.


oh and what the other kim has said about crystalsmom is true and it really upsets me. we became very close in the time she was here, and i'm crushed that she left because she felt upset about something she read.

Ok another article -

In the United States, there are approximately four dogs in every thousand which are diagnosed with cancer each year. The most commonly-diagnosed cancers in dogs are: in males - Connective tissue, Testis, Skin (melanoma), Mouth and throat, Lymphoma, Bone, Stomach and intestines (in desending order!)

Keep in mind, however, that these numbers are from the 1960s! There are no newer studies and the increased life expectancy of dogs since the 1960s has probably changed this order somewhat.


IV. Testicular Cancer

While in human males one type of testicular cancer predominates (seminomas), dogs get any of three types of testicular tumors (Sertoli cell tumors, seminomas, and interstitial cell tumors). Also, there is no increase in the number of cases of testicular cancer in early adulthood in dogs as there is in humans.

Dogs with undescended testicles (i.e., the testicles do not properly migrate to the scrotum but remain in the body cavity) have a markedly higher risk than other dogs to develop this type of cancer. Dogs with inguinal hernias are also at increased risk. Obviously, neutering of dogs prevents the development of this type of cancer.

More testicular cancer was also found in working dogs from the Vietnam war who were exposed to parasitic infections, various treatments for these infections (tetracycline was singled out), and herbicides.

here is the link http://members.tripod.com/RavenwoodDals/cancer.htm

Like I said on the previous page, you did not perform an autopsy on this dog so you have not way to prove your statements.

Boy oh Boy
 

I am chuckling here I just missed my forensic show because I got caught up in reading all 8 pages of this.

PMS must be going strong!! Now I'm just trying to lighten the mood. PLEASE dont' take me literally :eek:

Here's my 2 cents for what it's worth. Yorkies are a challenge to housetrain to begin with. When you have mutiple Yorkies in your home you are guaranteed to have some pecking order establised. I believe it depends on the personality of each individual Yorkie or other breed in the household. Some mesh well better than others, so to say exactly what the outcome will be is not possible.
This is what I do when I don't know the answer to something. I prepare for the worst, that way I will have planned ahead of how to deal with it. If things turn out for the best, well, who needs to prepare for that!

As for the altering of pets. I am a frim believer that all pets that are not used for breeding shoudl be altered. My vet uses a safer procedure for females to be spayed called laporoscopy (sp?). This is done by making 2 holes in the abdomen and performing the procedure while watching on a monitor. This eliminates the incision in the adomen and healing time. With technology these days there is no reason not to alter. The pros out weigh the cons.

I may as well through this in here. I feel there are more people that want to 'TRY' breeding. We are so incontrol of these innocent lives that we can turn it off an on if we want to and some do. That frustrates me that's why I do not get into the breeding aspect of these topics. Besides, the advise given is similar to what'd I'd give.

Hugs,
Irene

yet another article -
http://www.foxvalleypets.org/dogs/?details=19&page=136

Neutering eliminates the chances of developing:
• Testicular tumors and cancer. Testicular cancer is the second most frequently diagnosed cancer in older intact male dogs. There are several types of tumors, both benign and malignant, that can arise within the testicles.
Neutering greatly decreases the chances of developing:
• Prostatic disease. Over 80% of all unneutered male dogs develop prostate disease.
• Infections and disorders of the prostate glands. Prostate conditions such as prostate enlargement, cysts, and infection are all related to the presence of testosterone.
• Perianal tumors—These are tumors whose growth is stimulated by testosterone these are commonly observed in older, unaltered dogs. Perianal gland cancer is the third most frequently diagnosed cancer in older intact male dogs.
• Serious types of hernias. These are commonly observed in older, unaltered dogs and can occur on either or both sides of the anus. One of the long-term effects of testosterone causes the group of muscles near the anus to weaken or atrophy. The surgery to repair hernia complications can range from $300 to $1500, depending on the severity.
• Infections and disorders of the prepuce (the outer covering of the penis).

Hi, Irene! Yes, pm-s must be going crazy since the posting on this has slowed WAY down! :D

nevermind

I'm glad you posted this. I saw the same statistic on many sites. There is chemo and other various treatments similar to human treatments for cancer but who has the money for that when its more humane and less expensive to neuter if you're not going to breed or show.

Thanks!

Thanks for the citations Kimberly. I found the statisitics interesting and just the sort of thing I have been reading on the side which argues in favor of alteration. I found this there too.

VII. Bladder and Ureteral Cancer

Bladder cancers is dogs are more likely to occur in older dogs. Two studies found a one and one-half to threefold higher risk in females while a third study found no differences between the genders. This latter study did find that neutered dogs of both sexes seem to be at higher risk.

So, they won't get testicular cancer but maybe Bladder cancer instead??

My females are small and if you read the study it discusses how the risks of breast cancer are less for the smaller yorkies who are not obese. This was a factor in my decision not to spay.

This is a Humane Society site and all of them are prejudiced in favor of altering in order to prevent strays and over population so my comment would be consider the source.

I do not know where they get their stats as they site no studies specifically.

Also, the other study you cited admtted that their stats are from the 1960s!

Kim, what made me think twice about you was the thread that you posted openly about Villette. She wasn't a member of the site and you tried to drudge stuff up about the past...yet again. Then the way the whole vaccination debate you started and many other posts there and here that you've had. You don't just present your case and leave things alone. You keep on and keep on at people that may not share the same views as you. It gets very irritating. Instead of drawing people towards you, you push them away.

On YF...for the short time I was there...a couple of people pissed me off but you know what, I've made up with those members and don't bring it up. Why? I'm just making myself sick not them!

And then you pm me about a member here wanting to know how I could be friends with her when she was rude to you? How high schoolish is that! "Oh, don't be friends with so-and-so because I don't like them!" Give me a break!

What really bothered me was during the whole hurricane bit. After some words were said on the other site, I sent an e-mail to all of my "friends". You and one other person didn't reply to my e-mail and you were the only one that didn't reply to anything here posted about it. Not a "hope all is well" nothing. I know that no one wants to read this crap but now you know. You know why I haven't replied to your pm-s. I'm moving on.

I never asked you not to like someone because I didn't ...I knew that you knew "what that person was like" that she used nasty names and lies and I would never want someone like that for a friend. I didn't think you would either but I was wrong. You don't choose your friends the way I do. I don't want to be friends and won't be with bullying, disrespectful, rude, name calling people. Neither will my children.

I never received an email from you during the whole hurricane thing and if I did and didn't respond, you know me better than to think I was being insenstive. I get over 200 emails a day and I have responded to every one you ever sent me as far as a I know. If that is all it takes to lose your friendship and yet you will be firends with those who have so mercilessly attacked others then so be it.

I would maybe try again if I were you with the other person who also didn't respknd to the email becuase i bet she didn't get it. No sense in losing two friends over a miscommunication. How very sad............ :(