What Is The Breeders Section Here For????

[TammyJM]

Bakers Dozen~

I probably have you confused with someone else...but didn't you use to breed, just not Yorkies?? Or do I have this totally wrong? This is quite possible since I seem to be having an extra blonde day.

Anyway, I always enjoy reading your posts...you seem to have a knack of writing in such a pleasant tone.

Tammy

[BakersDozen]

Originally Posted by TammyJM

Bakers Dozen~

I probably have you confused with someone else...but didn't you use to breed, just not Yorkies?? Or do I have this totally wrong? This is quite possible since I seem to be having an extra blonde day.

Anyway, I always enjoy reading your posts...you seem to have a knack of writing in such a pleasant tone.

Tammy

Thank you so much I think you have me confused with someone else. I am wondering if maybe there is someone with a username similar? I have some experience with breeding and whelping because my parents breed Yorkies. I plan to do so myself, but am not yet in a position to.

[feminvstr]

Originally Posted by BakersDozen

I hope so. I really did not intend to inspire such hatred.

I have no time or energy for hatred it simply isnt in my vocabulary so once again you are assuming!

[Sunnie]

Originally Posted by TeddyandTiffy

You should post what you've been through with Breeding Yorkies good and bad, this is how other people can learn. From what others go through.

You have a good point there...It's true. Hope u have a great weekend. Lee

Thank you Lee. I try to be an INFORMATIVE positive poster. We can usually tell by the tone of the OP asking the questions whether they have an idea of what breeding entails. Sadly, many of them don't. But we cannot ASSUME they don't either. All we really can do is TRY to help guide them to what is the best thing to do in thier situation. And it CAN be done in a pleasant informative manner. If we get thier defenses up right away, they are NEVER going to listen to good advice. I do believe that a BIG MAJORITY of "potential" first time breeders, really are looking for good honest information. Why can we not answer questions honestly without telling everyone who asks that it is not a good idea to breed. I can't count the times I have seen people say to someone who asks about breeding thier "teacup", You are going to kill your baby! You can't breed a yorkie that small!Have they been tested?? How big is the mom and dad? Have you studied the genetics? have you this? Have you that? All asked by someone who has NEVER whelped a litter at all. Or has no book-smarts (book-smarts is good too!) about it either. These are the questions that should be tactfully asked by one of the experienced breeders in my opinion... not by someone who has never been thru it or by someone who has not studied it, like a vet tech, etc. If I hadn't been thru it, I would be saying, well, you know.. I am glad you are here to ask questions and in my opinion I think maybe your baby might be too small to breed, but please stick around and allow someone with experience to help you. Can you imagine the hard feelings that would never happen if that was the response. The OP would be more receptive to listen to an experienced breeder. I realize everyone isn't ME.. and we all have our own way of talking.. but we are doing a dis-service to our breed if we cannot educate without causing hard feelings.. I have seen so many "new to breeding" ""breeders"" go away mad and still uneducated and still determined to breed because they have lost the big picture and are now in defense "I will show you" mode.

[Sugar's Mom]

Originally Posted by myjordash

But what I am understanding is that the EXPERIENCED breeders have left, and are no longer posting in this section BECAUSE of the inexperienced breeders coming here, asking questions without doing the proper research. So if the EXPERIENCED breeders are going to stop posting all together, I am just saying, why not just post to the one's that you feel you can help, and not to the naive "what if" questions. If you are not going to be able to prevent someone from breeding "their cute pup" or "mix breed" why waste your time convincing them not to, which usually goes to a deaf ear, and then the person who really needs your help, will not get it because the "experienced breeders" got too frustrated and stopped posting.

P.S. I am going to stop posting, because my intent was NOT to offend you further.

You have totally misunderstood. The experienced and I mean experienced breeders have not stopped posting here because of the new breeders or inexperienced breeders. It is because when we do post, we are undermined by those that have never bred a litter and have no intention of doing so. I spoke to a new girl on here last night that lost almost an entire litter and a lot of it was because of bad advice she was given on here before any of us could get to her.

[BakersDozen]

Originally Posted by feminvstr

I have no time or energy for hatred it simply isnt in my vocabulary so once again you are assuming!

<sigh> I would love to resolve this to your satisfaction. Is that possible? If so, what do you need from me? Please pm me, as this seems to be personal and doesn't seem appropriate for the board. I sincerely would like you to tell me what you need from me to resolve these hard feelings.

[BakersDozen]

Originally Posted by Sunnie

Thank you Lee. I try to be an INFORMATIVE positive poster. We can usually tell by the tone of the OP asking the questions whether they have an idea of what breeding entails. Sadly, many of them don't. But we cannot ASSUME they don't either. All we really can do is TRY to help guide them to what is the best thing to do in thier situation. And it CAN be done in a pleasant informative manner. If we get thier defenses up right away, they are NEVER going to listen to good advice. I do believe that a BIG MAJORITY of "potential" first time breeders, really are looking for good honest information. Why can we not answer questions honestly without telling everyone who asks that it is not a good idea to breed. I can't count the times I have seen people say to someone who asks about breeding thier "teacup", You are going to kill your baby! You can't breed a yorkie that small!Have they been tested?? How big is the mom and dad? Have you studied the genetics? have you this? Have you that? All asked by someone who has NEVER whelped a litter at all. Or has no book-smarts (book-smarts is good too!) about it either. These are the questions that should be tactfully asked by one of the experienced breeders in my opinion... not by someone who has never been thru it or by someone who has not studied it, like a vet tech, etc. If I hadn't been thru it, I would be saying, well, you know.. I am glad you are here to ask questions and in my opinion I think maybe your baby might be too small to breed, but please stick around and allow someone with experience to help you. Can you imagine the hard feelings that would never happen if that was the response. The OP would be more receptive to listen to an experienced breeder. I realize everyone isn't ME.. and we all have our own way of talking.. but we are doing a dis-service to our breed if we cannot educate without causing hard feelings.. I have seen so many "new to breeding" ""breeders"" go away mad and still uneducated and still determined to breed because they have lost the big picture and are now in defense "I will show you" mode.

You make some very good points, and good suggestions also. Thank you

[BakersDozen]

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom

You have totally misunderstood. The experienced and I mean experienced breeders have not stopped posting here because of the new breeders or inexperienced breeders. It is because when we do post, we are undermined by those that have never bred a litter and have no intention of doing so. I spoke to a new girl on here last night that lost almost an entire litter and a lot of it was because of bad advice she was given on here before any of us could get to her.

This is also a good point. Wasn't it you who a while back suggested a separate board for experienced breeders to answer breeding/whelping questions? I can see some logistical problems with this, and it wouldn't be perfect, but I can also see some huge benefits.

[Sunnie]

Originally Posted by ranant12

I am new here. I am also new to breeding yorkshire terriers. However, my mother breed champion Cocker spaniels most of my life and I've had tons of experience with those dogs whelping, have spent uncountable hours bottle feeding puppies round the clock, and feel like I am pretty knowledgable about potential problems in breeding.

I came here to learn as much as possible about the ins and outs of breeding yorkshire terriers. I actually read many, many posts here as a guest before I joined and before I breed my Diva. I have read books, spent hours talking over whether or not I should do it with Diva's breeder and drove my vet crazy in the last year asking him questions.

I did not go into breeding uneducated, and uniformed. This being said, after reading here for a while, I got the feeling that anyone that was not an "experienced breeder", that was not "showing" their dogs, etc., was automatically labeled a backyard breeder. It took me a lot of time to realize the reason behind the way some of the more experienced breeders were coming across. I now understand after reading some of the posts from the "new" people who come here with absolutely no prior breeding knowledge, most of whom did not even know enough about a heat cycle to know when to breed their dog, why the experienced breeders get so upset.

If you've committed your life and heart to breeding these precious dogs and have researched countless hours the ins and outs of breeding, I can see how posts like Olive's would rub your nerves wrong.

I Posted for the first time on here expecting the worst and prepared to be told when I am doing something wrong. I came here to further my education, not be petted and pampered. I have taught school for 14 years and have no problem correcting students for doing things that are dangerous and irresponsible. I understand when an experienced breeder feels the need to tell me when I'm doing something dangerous and irresponsible.

Different people have different ways of telling you things. Some people have really nice ways and others are blunt and to the point.

I don't know how to solve the issues here, but I for one am so glad to be able to come here and get "honest", to the point, advice. To all, I say thank you. To the nicest ones, I say thanks for being kind. To the blunt people, I say, I understand where you are coming from.

absolutely wonderful post!

[sheilajom]

I think there should be a special indicator/icon or something that is next to your name that indicates that you are a breeder. That way people will know who are breeders and who are not. Maybe YT can arrange something like this, something similar to having it state that you are a donating member or not.

[BakersDozen]

Originally Posted by sheilajom

I think there should be a special indicator/icon or something that is next to your name that indicates that you are a breeder. That way people will know who are breeders and who are not. Maybe YT can arrange something like this, something similar to having it state that you are a donating member or not.

That would be helpful. I wonder if we would then run into those logistical problems...like, what exactly is a breeder? Is it a person who has whelped one litter?

[sheilajom]

Originally Posted by BakersDozen

That would be helpful. I wonder if we would then run into those logistical problems...like, what exactly is a breeder? Is it a person who has whelped one litter?

I'm not a breeder, so they could probably answer that better. I just felt the need to offer a possible solution to all the contraversy. IMO it would be someone who is actively breeding, someone who has experience (not a first litter), someone who has dogs specifically for that purpose (not someone who has one dog and they happen to get preggy), someone who is AKC or ARBA registered. I'm sure there could be other requirements, but that would be what I consider to be a breeder. Again, this is just my opinion.

[BakersDozen]

Originally Posted by sheilajom

I'm not a breeder, so they could probably answer that better. I just felt the need to offer a possible solution to all the contraversy. IMO it would be someone who is actively breeding, someone who has experience (not a first litter), someone who has dogs specifically for that purpose (not someone who has one dog and they happen to get preggy), someone who is AKC or ARBA registered. I'm sure there could be other requirements, but that would be what I consider to be a breeder. Again, this is just my opinion.

I think it's a good idea. I know that as an aspiring breeder, I appreciate having a place to discuss, learn, throw around ideas, etc. And I do think that anyone should be free to state their opinion on a given subject, in a tactful way. But as far as specific whelping/breeding advice it would be nice for that to be restricted to breeders only....or at least have the identification you're talking about so that the OP can give the advice the appropriate consideration.

[sheilajom]

I just don't think all this "discussion" has any purpose if they people complaining are not offering a reasonable solution to the problem. You can't forbid people from posting, nor should you try to, but having a way to identify your credentials would be a viable solution to everyone's concern. Everyone would still get to voice opinions, but the "real" breeders would be readily identifiable by all. That way they still get the respect that they deserve and newbies still get to learn.

[BakersDozen]

Originally Posted by sheilajom

I just don't think all this "discussion" has any purpose if they people complaining are not offering a reasonable solution to the problem. You can't forbid people from posting, nor should you try to, but having a way to identify your credentials would be a viable solution to everyone's concern. Everyone would still get to voice opinions, but the "real" breeders would be readily identifiable by all. That way they still get the respect that they deserve and newbies still get to learn.

Yep. Similar solutions have been suggested before, but in some ways it creates a whole new "debate" over who is eligible to be identified as a breeder. I personally am just going to try my best to be empathetic to both the breeders and new posters, try to be careful how I word things so as not to cause offense, (obviously I could do better at that ) and on the rare occasions that I give any specific breeding/whelping information remember to state that I am not a breeder yet.