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Old 06-12-2005, 07:39 PM   #1
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Default Conformation versus temperment

We have many new members posting lately. A number are breeding for the first time and asking excellent questions.
For anyone interested in avoiding set backs and total screw-ups I would like to relay a foundation truth.
YOU CAN NOT SEPARATE CONFORMATION AND TEMPERMENT. Any breeder who has breed for any length of time knows you can not neglect either aspect. If I had to pick between the two in order to continue to breed, I would pack it in and never breed again.
I have no desire to produce a gorgeous champion potential with miserable personality, shy, backward, agressive, snappish, mean, scared hyper or any other trait that makes it impossible to live with a dog. On the other hand I have no desire to produce an outgoing, friendly pet with a roach back, bad bite, bad ears, wooly coat, bad stifles, and a buyer asking me if it is really a purebred Yorkie they have purchased?

Conformation is not just a pretty Yorkie. It is vital for good health and temperment. Some people are not able to see the connection. The two are interwoven like a braid...to concentrate on one or the other is to do a huge disservice to the breed. It is the breeders responsibility to concenrate on conformation and temeperment as one. It is a total cop-out to say.."I breed for temperment"..what the breeder is actually saying is "I am too lazy and unmotivated to learn how to do it right"..
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Old 06-12-2005, 07:41 PM   #2
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That is so well-written Pat, I really agree with every word! I am so glad there are GOOD RESPONSIBLE BREEDERS out there that know what they are talking about!
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Old 06-12-2005, 07:48 PM   #3
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Pat:

I definitely see your point.

With so many things that can go wrong in the yorkie breed, I wouldn't want to purchase a pup from someone who knew little to nothing about their dogs they are breeding.

I can remember a while back, someone posted about Legges-parthes (I'm sure I didn't spell that correctly) and how upset they were when they found out their pup had this problem. If I'm remembering correctly, the breeder didn't take any responsibility for this trait being passed on to the pup this member purchased.

In my opinion (not a scientific opinion or from talking to vets or yorkie owners), the breeder should have knowledge of whether or not any trait that can eventually lead to a reduction in the quality of the pet's life has been present in the generations that precede the sire and dam.

I admire those breeders that truly know their stock. They definitely didn't find out everything overnight and it was not an easy process to learn all of that which they know.

I really admire your posts Pat!

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Old 06-12-2005, 07:59 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YorkieRose
We have many new members posting lately. A number are breeding for the first time and asking excellent questions.
For anyone interested in avoiding set backs and total screw-ups I would like to relay a foundation truth.
YOU CAN NOT SEPARATE CONFORMATION AND TEMPERMENT. Any breeder who has breed for any length of time knows you can not neglect either aspect. If I had to pick between the two in order to continue to breed, I would pack it in and never breed again.
I have no desire to produce a gorgeous champion potential with miserable personality, shy, backward, agressive, snappish, mean, scared hyper or any other trait that makes it impossible to live with a dog. On the other hand I have no desire to produce an outgoing, friendly pet with a roach back, bad bite, bad ears, wooly coat, bad stifles, and a buyer asking me if it is really a purebred Yorkie they have purchased?

Conformation is not just a pretty Yorkie. It is vital for good health and temperment. Some people are not able to see the connection. The two are interwoven like a braid...to concentrate on one or the other is to do a huge disservice to the breed. It is the breeders responsibility to concenrate on conformation and temeperment as one. It is a total cop-out to say.."I breed for temperment"..what the breeder is actually saying is "I am too lazy and unmotivated to learn how to do it right"..
I agree as well and would appreciate your opinion as to why this is not made clear in the written "breed standard" that most "show" breeders go by as espoused by the YTCA and the AKC?
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Old 06-12-2005, 08:02 PM   #5
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Pat- Thank you for this informative post! And for taking the time to share your personal experience and information on breeding! I agree with every single word in your post! There is NO substitute for life experience!

Thank heavens there are responsible and caring breeders like you that are protecting this beautiful breed! Cheers!
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Old 06-12-2005, 08:15 PM   #6
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I wish there were more responsible breeders outhere. WHen I was doing my homework for Luig- you should have seen how many people/breeders if thats what you want to call them-didn't know what the heck they were talking about!! I have never owned a dog before this and I knew more about this breed than half the breeders did!! I wanted to pull my hair out!!!
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Old 06-12-2005, 08:52 PM   #7
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Taken from the AKC Breed page...

Body
Well proportioned and very compact. The back is rather short, the back line level, with height at shoulder the same as at the rump. back line level = confirmation

As far as tempermant? Who wants a gorgeous yorkie that's mean and bites all of the time. It's like who wants to date a beautiful woman that has an ugly attitude. I love everything that YorkieRose has to say. I think that she is a very knowledgable person that everyone can learn a great deal from. Especially if you are a new person getting into the breeding business. You ask her a question, she is straight forward to answer it.

Thank you, YorkieRose for explaining this so well to many people out there that wouldn't know the difference and might breed for confirmation or tempermant and not both. Makes a lot of sense to me!
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Old 06-12-2005, 09:16 PM   #8
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I see that it is made clear in the AKC Breed Standard.

"General Appearance- That of a long haired Toy Terrier whose blue and tan coat is parted on the face and from the base of the skull to the end of the tail, and hangs evenly and quite straight down each side of body. The body is neat, compact and well-proportioned. The dog's high head carriage and confident manner should give the appearance of vigor and self-importance."

[I]Eyes: "...dark in colorand sparkling with sharp intelligent expression..."[/I]
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Old 06-12-2005, 11:34 PM   #9
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Excellent post Yorkie Rose
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Old 06-13-2005, 03:13 AM   #10
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Default Ytca Akc

KIM...when the English wrote the standard, they did not realize they would be dealing with breeders who had no common sense.
Several members have quoted parts of the standard and these traits are impossible to achieve in poor tempermented Yorkie...not all is spelled out word for word. As a lawyer I realize you like to see it in writting LOL, but think about it..a doctor does not learn everything from a book..they quickly realize there is more to removing an appendix then what they have read, if they have common sense. Like with any profession, breeding whether hobby or show is a hands on learning experince. The standard is the start, a basic guideline.
The English started dog showing so the breeders could compare dogs, learn and improve...that is the place to learn and advance your knowledge..in the operating room.
Best wishes
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Old 06-13-2005, 03:17 AM   #11
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Thank You Pat
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Old 06-13-2005, 04:05 AM   #12
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Pat - I also would like to thank you for sharing your experience and being very frank about it - You are the kind of Breeder I wish I had found back in the days BEFORE I went looking for a yorkie - I wouldn't trade my girls for ANYTHING - they're my heart, and I love them more than I can say.....but I wish I had met someone like you before I started looking.
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Old 06-13-2005, 04:47 AM   #13
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Beautifully said Pat. And tho sadly there will always be irresponsible or unknowledgable breeders out there it is posts like these that will help the average person find a well balanced pet. Thank you.
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Old 06-13-2005, 05:30 AM   #14
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Pat that was a wonderful post. I wish that more breeders would try to follow that rule. I know that sometimes no matter how you try you always may get a puppy that isn't quite what you had in mind, but that's the kind of puppy that should be sold with a neuter/spay clause. I think that if you start out with great dogs your chances of being succesful are a lot better than if you just decide to breed without "really" looking at the parents you are breeding...
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Old 06-13-2005, 08:42 AM   #15
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I forgot to check the dates on these postings so I might need to apologize for stirring an old pot!! I read Pat's post and she and I know of a great little champion, Beau, who was a good rep of the breed standard but showed against equally excellent confirmed dogs. So what made him such a winner? He would look up at the judge when stacked on the table and look as if he understood every word the judge uttered AND had a "PICK ME!! OOH, OOH PICK ME!" temperment. That boy would have still been in the starting gate (possibly) if he had been lacking in either attribute!!
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