Teddy is finally going on anxiety meds..
 

I'd hoped it wouldn't come to this but I've known since he was four months old that he had separation anxiety and it's escalated to the point that he's inappropriately pooping/peeing when I'm away.

So, the vet has suggested Clomicalm which I can see has been suggested by other vets for members here but there doesn't seem to be any posts about the long term success.

He'll be seeing a behaviorist, too.

Aw, Teddy. :animal-pa

Oh my gosh, I was just doing a search on YorkieTalk to look into calming meds. Rescue Remedy doesn't work so I am talking to the vet tomorrow to see if he can recommend something for one of mine. I am going to ask him about Clomicalm.

Bless his little heart.....I hope you can help this precious baby conquer his fears/anxieties/demons.....it breaks my heart......they try so hard to be the very best they can be, and sometimes they just need a little help......good for you tending to this baby's needs! Please keep us updated on his progress!

See hope this helps him!
This is a human drug called clomipramine or anafranil which is a very effective OCD medication. Let us know how it works.

Is Clomicalm only for separation anxiety? Does it take a while before it starts to work? My little guy has horrible storm anxiety. I hate medicating him for it but the anxiety is so bad it causes him to vomit. He has IBD and the anxiety is a huge trigger for his IBD. Our vet never mentioned Clomicalm. Our little guy is on Xanax for the storm anxiety. It's only 'as needed' though. If there was something milder that would work, I would gladly switch.

Diana

I am not a vet, so I only know about the humans - but clomipramine works fairly quickly, maybe not as fast as Xanax. With comipramine in humans we always have to watch for weight gain, diabetes, and drowsiness. Xanax is not known to cause the weight gain and drowsiness, however, Xanax is a benzodiazepine and therefore addictive and cannot be stopped quickly if they have have been on it a long time (however, not got to stop anything someone has been on a long time). Most of these issues have a lot to do with dosage and such.

When Cali was attacked by the hawk several years ago she was quite anxious - kept looking for something to come at her from above - I used low dose Xanax for about a year and a half while we worked through it, and weaned her off slowly and we did just great! Liquid Xanax is very fast acting and easy to give, but expensive, the pill is much cheaper but Cali liked the bubblegum flavor with the liquid :D. Some pet folks keep it around for 4th of July and New Years Eve scare for their dogs - and storms. Seems I hear most use Acepromazine for storms, but that may be vet preference.

Xanax can be used intermittently better than clomipramine in my opinion but many folks do use it intermittently successfully.

Good luck! We so hate to see our pups miserable.

Thanks for the info Yorkiemini. This little guy was a shelter rescue so we don't have background for him, but he not only has storm anxiety but raindrop anxiety. Even a gentle spring shower will send him into the corner cowering and shaking and trembling. Good thing we live in Phoenix where it rarely ever rains. He is a big boy at 15 pounds, and 1/2 mg of Xanax is usually enough to calm him down. I don't know if that is considered a low dose or not, as dogs metabolize it so differently than humans. I know it is addictive, but he doesn't take it often enough to worry about that. It rarely rains two days in a row here except during our summer monsoon season, and otherwise we can go months at a time with no rain at all. I guess Xanax is the best option for him.

Diana

Hey, nothing wrong *at all* with using meds...that's what they're there for after all. And for many dogs, meds are little miracles for them bc they do have something awry chemically, and the meds help mitigate that situation. It can be amazing for them, and for you too.

I hope he does just awesome on them!!! :love:

At the height of Cali's anxiety we were giving it 3 times a day. It worked wonders and we had no problems with it. I am so thankful for it because she could not eat or sleep and felt she had to watch for Hawks all the time and protect me and her from them.

I would not hesitate to use it again if needed! We were so lucky!

Ha ha ha - and when I got the citation and court date for allegedly killing a protected species I though I was going to have to start taking it, too :D:D:D

Thanks all for your support. I have to admit that I was upset that Teddy's condition is something which requires med assistance. Despite my science background, I still feel like I could be unwittingly contributing to the problem or just too ignorant to find the solution. I don't know if that makes sense or not but I decided that, no matter what I feel, it's Teddy that has the anxiety and needs the help so I got over feeling sorry for us pretty quickly.

As far as I'm aware, Clomicalm is different from other SSRI's in that it inhibits the reuptake of serotonin i.e. his brain doesn't allow for the 'feel good chemicals' to circulate to the right places or for long enough before being swallowed back up. So, unlike other SSRI's which inhibit the release of certain chemicals and, thus, cause drowsiness, Clomicalm just promotes good feelings. I guess this is also the reason why it isn't as addicting and doesn't have the withdrawal effects seen with other meds.

There are no guarantees that it will work but I'm hoping with behaviorist assistance + meds - we're on the right track to help him stop suffering.

Meant to add that the vet recommended that we try these meds out for 2 weeks to see if he suffers the most common side effects which are vomiting and diarrhea. If he doesn't, then we'll just maintain the meds whilst we get the behaviorist scheduled in and talk to her about her training suggestions + meds etc. I'm going to be working closely with this team to ensure everything is done correctly and consistently.

I'll keep you all updated. Again, thanks for the support. This is a trying time for me which makes me feel silly since neuroscience/psychology is what I know! It seems harder to deal with it firsthand, though... this is why I like the research and not the counselling....I NEED THE COUNSEL.

<hugs to you all> x

Misty,
You are correct clomipramine is a pretty potent seratonin reuptake inhibitor. And the active metabolite is a potent norepinephrine/noradrenaline reuptake inhibitor. Like all tricyclic antidepressants they are frequently associated with weight gain so frequent weight checks during treatment are important.

Dry mouth and constipation are not uncommon, and can go along with the increased appetite. Sedation, fatigue and drowsiness are notable side effects however after taking it for a while that can improve.

Hope it works well for you folks. There is nothing worse than watching our babies suffer. While I was working with Cali's anxiety I was using exposure and increased exercise. While this was going on it increased her confidence which was a major boost for us. As her confidence grew she got better a dealing with the anxious moments -- of course that night have backfired since she now thinks she can handle anything :D. The bigger the better! :eek:

I'm sure you've read this information about clomicalm on drugs.com:

Clomicalm - FDA prescribing information, side effects and uses

Clomicalm is a tricyclic antidepressant. It has some side effects, which are listed in the article, along with the percentage of dogs that experienced those side effects compared with placebo. At least there is a picture of a Yorkie on their 5 mg. tablet bottle :).

IMHO, the side effects are relatively mild, so it may be worth giving it a try, but watch Teddy carefully for side effects.

Awh Misty I am just reading this now. been absent for a bit. I think you are doing the right thing in exploring meds and also coupling this with a behaviourist. You know that sometimes as dog owners and trainers we contribute to the problem in ways that we never recognize or see. I sure know I have done that with my group. I know that because I work with a great trainer - who sees things I would never see on my own.

Misty you are for sure doing what you can do and I do so hope that it will be successfull.

That's a story I missed. :D

https://www.aspca.org/pet-care/dog-c...ration-anxiety

So, we're 2 days in and there is already a marked difference in Teddy's personality. He's just so chill. I don't mean like stoned, or not with it, he's just so NOT reactive. I had to call the vet and have her reassure me that the dosing is correct cuz, whilst I know that some are more receptive to chemicals i.e. anti-depressants than others, which means that some experience changes faster etc., I didn't expect to see a change in 2 days. I was assured all was fine as he is not throwing up, going to the bathroom more, acting weird (or weirder than normal) etc.

Then, sadly, I was told that the behaviorist wants me to travel with Teddy to see her, instead of the other way around, and I don't want to pay $700 for long distance therapy. I really need someone with a hands on and dedicated approach so I don't think she's the one for me, which is annoying, because she has so many qualifications but obviously is adverse to demonstrating their worth!

Anyway, thought I'd update since Clomicalm is often mentioned but no one seems to come back to talk about the experience and the outcome. So, hopefully, this will help someone as well as being cathartic for me.

Good luck! Jax doesn't have SA but he does anxiety regarding storms, gun shots, etc. For some reason on our trip to FL last year he was AWFUL in the RV... I think because it's louder than a car, lots of clanking around, bumps etc, I mean he was making me anxious. I am not kidding when I say he NEVER calmed down during the entire 15+ hour trip except for potty breaks when we stopped. He paced, panted, wouldn't stay in one place or if I tried to keep him in one place, he freaked even more. He is not like this in the car (or he may show some anxiety for first 15-30 mins, but no more). I called his vet who called us in an RX for xanax -- I thought it would help but it did nothing. So next long trip I'll be getting something stronger and will need suggestions.

You actually did kill a hawk? When I called the zoo about this huge hawk that would sit on my fence, waiting for a yorkie to come outside, those people went NUTS warning me continuously about jail time and huge fines for injuring/killing one of those predators!!! I could tell they were really serious about criminal charges for my injuring one of those birds......I seemed to be the only one concerned about my precious yorkies......I wonder if they had surveillance on the property, to see if I actually did kill one....how did they find out you killed one??? I KNOW you didnt call and tell them!!!!! Yes, they are deadly serious about those damn birds......almost as serious as I am about protecting my DOGS!!!!!

What in the world did they do to you?????

2 words:

'Not working'. :thumbdown

So sorry :(
Have you tried acepromazine?

No I did not kill the hawk, but the authorities would not believe that Cali, who is under 4 pounds, was capable of having killed the hawk, when actually she broke its neck shaking it. So they claimed I killed it -- I won the case because when I took the bird and Cali to the vet, they kept the bird in their freezer and they did a necroscopy and found it had not been beaten and indeed its neck was broken, and that Cali had gotten by the neck, just under the beak and shaken it back and forth and broke its neck.

I had a rake laying in the yard and they jumped to the conclusion I had killed the hawk with it.

What did they put him on and what dose?

Try not get discouraged - there are SO many meds you can try till you find the right one...anti-anxiety meds, tranquilizers, anti-depressants...

Hiya, clomicalm 2.5mg twice daily. He's been on it around six weeks now.

Thanks - it's so hard because the person I hold responsible for his regression is the person who is now advising me on how to correct it and this issue is frustrating enough without it going backward which is, I know, part of the issue anyway.

Also, the meds have gone up and doubled in price. Whilst I'm happy to pay whatever is required, I'd like to see some progress. A bit naïve of me, I guess, to hope for a magic pill when I know there isn't one! I'm a sucker for good news stories, though, I guess!

What about melatonin for dogs? Melatonin is a natural substance the body produces (dogs and humans) that make us fall asleep at night, so I think it'd be for short term use only - such as during thunderstorms. People also use it for jet-lagged purposes.

Has anyone tried it before? I felt guilty when I was crate training Scottie (felt like I shouldn't be drugging my dog up), but I gave him some melatonin during the second month of him screaming throughout the night (throwing tantrums from 1am all the way until 5am, as if he was being physically tortured) in his crate and I was going crazy. It seemed to really calm him down though, after giving it to him for a couple nights, and I was finally able to get some rest.

Teddy is going back to the vet today. The meds didn't work so we're bringing him and a three hour video showing him howling, barking, biting the baby gate and pacing for three straight hours

So stressful.

Oh my how challenging for all of you. My hope is for direction and solution. Will be thinking of you.

Oh my. That sounds exactly like our little guy during a thunderstorm. He also has horrible anxiety during car rides. I've been trying to desensitize him by taking him on short rides around the block or just hanging out in the car eating treats. Long brisk walks to tire him out also helps. But Xanax has changed his life. Just .5 mg half an hour before I put him in the car and he will happily sit in his carseat looking out the window without a care in the world for a 3 hour drive. I don't think I will ever be able to desensitize him to the storms though. He senses them before the clouds even come.

I hope your vet is able to advise you and prescribes something that will help.

Diana

Thanks all - Prozac has been given in drop form..

really wanted to avoid all of this but here we go.:(