Bare Minimum Vaccines???

[Maximo]

Lepto is something I wrestled with in deciding whether or not to give my boys because we live in a heavily wooded area, next to a farm, with many critters and cattle. Our vet and I decided against it.

I thought that I had read that there are hundreds of strains of Lepto, certainly many as Cathy indicated. The 4 that the vaccine covers are not the only ones that are cause for concern.

The other thing I recall reading is that the vaccine has to be given every 6 - 8 months to be truly effective.

Lepto is scary stuff, and if I lived on the farm and had cattle die from it like another member here did, I would probably be inclined to vaccinate my dogs with what is available.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by 107barney

I suggest another convo with your vet, and perhaps ask him to contact the specialists who are actually seeing the cases. They can tell him and you what serovars are creeping up in your area so that you know if you're just vaccinating for nothing. I don't need your suggestions on how to use YT, there is a user guide for that and I've been a member since 2008 and know how to use the ignore function.

I didn't mean you had to use the ignore function I was just meaning ignore in general. My vet would be the one who saw the dogs with Lepto the closest specialist of any kind is at least 2 hours away so if someone dogs gets sick they go to the local vet that what we did with our goat as well.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by Maximo

Lepto is something I wrestled with in deciding whether or not to give my boys because we live in a heavily wooded area, next to a farm, with many critters and cattle. Our vet and I decided against it.

I thought that I had read that there are hundreds of strains of Lepto, certainly many as Cathy indicated. The 4 that the vaccine covers are not the only ones that are cause for concern.

The other thing I recall reading is that the vaccine has to be given every 6 - 8 months to be truly effective.

Lepto is scary stuff, and if I lived on the farm and had cattle die from it like another member here did, I would probably be inclined to vaccinate my dogs with what is available.

If it had to be given every 6-8 months wouldn't that go against every thing every one is saying about over vaccinating and that you can not over vaccinate with the Lepto shot? Just sorta wondering.

[JuneBugs Momma]

Wow, why do I feel like I am back in high school with all the back and forth arguing and disagreeing going on? I think it's time to close this topic.

Final words: Do what you think is right, not what others are saying. They are not the ones that have to live with your decision wether it be right or wrong, you do! Sheesh!

[Ellie May]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

If it had to be given every 6-8 months wouldn't that go against every thing every one is saying about over vaccinating and that you can not over vaccinate with the Lepto shot? Just sorta wondering.

Lepto is a bacterium, not a virus. The vaccine is not MLV. The duration of immunity is much different. The term overvaccinate is relative.

I'm not suggesting that owners should not vaccinate for lepto, One of my dogs currently gets it, but he is not a sensitive yorkie and he licks everything.

I respect your opinion about the 12 week rule. I just don't necessarily agree. The only reason I will often post to the contrary is because I feel like YT sees the 12 week thing as law and people need to knw that that is not the only way.There are many other countries that do not hold pups for 12 weeks.

And remember, these YTCA breeders that know yorkies and insist on 12 weeks are the same ones that don't generally believe in vaccinating yorkies for lepto because they feel it is too dangerous. Point is, I think we all deviate from their standards somewhat.

[Maximo]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

If it had to be given every 6-8 months wouldn't that go against every thing every one is saying about over vaccinating and that you can not over vaccinate with the Lepto shot? Just sorta wondering.

Sorry, I don't understand.

I thought I had read, when I was researching and deciding whether or not to give it to my guys, some sources say that it must be given every 6 - 8 months or it is not necessarily effective.

I would think it would be like other vaccines where there is no precise length of time that it is effective.

Over-vaccinating is relative. Effective or not, does anyone really know the impact of vaccines? If the vaccine isn't necessary, then it is over-vaccinating. Our last dog had the rabies vacc annually per the law. It didn't hurt her that we know of, but she was being over-vaccinated.

[gemy]

Originally Posted by JuneBugs Momma

Wow, why do I feel like I am back in high school with all the back and forth arguing and disagreeing going on? I think it's time to close this topic.

Final words: Do what you think is right, not what others are saying. They are not the ones that have to live with your decision wether it be right or wrong, you do! Sheesh!

Well sometimes with the back and forth we get gold nuggets of information, that can inform our own research.

And sometimes we find with repeated threads and repeated points of view, we might do something we had never done before, for the health care of our dogs.

It can be tiresome to read it all.

[107barney]

Originally Posted by Maximo

Sorry, I don't understand.

I thought I had read, when I was researching and deciding whether or not to give it to my guys, some sources say that it must be given every 6 - 8 months or it is not necessarily effective.

I would think it would be like other vaccines where there is no precise length of time that it is effective.

Over-vaccinating is relative. Effective or not, does anyone really know the impact of vaccines? If the vaccine isn't necessary, then it is over-vaccinating. Our last dog had the rabies vacc annually per the law. It didn't hurt her that we know of, but she was being over-vaccinated.

That's correct, it has to be given every 6-8 mos for efficacy.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Lepto is a bacterium, not a virus. The vaccine is not MLV. The duration of immunity is much different. The term overvaccinate is relative.

I'm not suggesting that owners should not vaccinate for lepto, One of my dogs currently gets it, but he is not a sensitive yorkie and he licks everything.

I respect your opinion about the 12 week rule. I just don't necessarily agree. The only reason I will often post to the contrary is because I feel like YT sees the 12 week thing as law and people need to knw that that is not the only way.There are many other countries that do not hold pups for 12 weeks.

And remember, these YTCA breeders that know yorkies and insist on 12 weeks are the same ones that don't generally believe in vaccinating yorkies for lepto because they feel it is too dangerous. Point is, I think we all deviate from their standards somewhat.

When Callie was a puppy I knew nothing about anything for the most part so she had the Lepto in her puppy shots but had she not and I read everything about it I probably would not have done it out of fear but then having the goat die of it will really scare the crap out of you. I don't take any vaccines lightly but I think some are pretty necessary and I go through a lot of back and forth with myself about which ones Callie needs. But if i did not get Lepto for Callie and she went out to my moms and got sick I would probably never forgive my self for not protecting her from that. There are many reasons I agree with the 12 rule and its not just because of the YTCA. I think its important when separating good breeders from bad breeders but that's just my opinion.

[107barney]

Originally Posted by JuneBugs Momma

Wow, why do I feel like I am back in high school with all the back and forth arguing and disagreeing going on? I think it's time to close this topic.

Final words: Do what you think is right, not what others are saying. They are not the ones that have to live with your decision wether it be right or wrong, you do! Sheesh!

Because it is an online forum and debate is how people can learn.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by 107barney

Because it is an online forum and debate is how people can learn.

I have learned lots of stuff from bickering with Cathy in the past so I am sure it will be the same with the future

[JuneBugs Momma]

Originally Posted by 107barney

Because it is an online forum and debate is how people can learn.

Understandable. But not when there are people that are not willing and it's like trying to get through a brick wall. Choose wisely, for someone who is suck on the 12 week rule is not going to change their mind no matter what anyone else says. Just like me with the Lyme Vaccine. I can be told by 20 vets in the area that I should get it cause we are the #3 state for lymes and I will still refuse to give it to my dog. Just saying....

[kjc]

Originally Posted by Maximo

Sorry, I don't understand.

I thought I had read, when I was researching and deciding whether or not to give it to my guys, some sources say that it must be given every 6 - 8 months or it is not necessarily effective.

I would think it would be like other vaccines where there is no precise length of time that it is effective.

Over-vaccinating is relative. Effective or not, does anyone really know the impact of vaccines? If the vaccine isn't necessary, then it is over-vaccinating. Our last dog had the rabies vacc annually per the law. It didn't hurt her that we know of, but she was being over-vaccinated.

Vaccines against bacterial disease are not as effective as vaccines against viruses. Lepto, Lymes, the 'Dental' vaccine are all bacterial in nature and the diseases/illnesses can be treated successfully with antibiotics.

The problems with overvaccination first became evident in cats, as cancer began developing at the injection site. When I was at the vets last time for vaccines, there was a little dog figure drawn in their charts and the point of vaccination was clearly marked on the diagram, so that future vaccines will be given in a different spot. They are also giving more vaccines in the leg, because if cancer does develop, the leg can be easily amputated, thereby stopping the progression of the cancer.

[gemy]

Originally Posted by kjc

Vaccines against bacterial disease are not as effective as vaccines against viruses. Lepto, Lymes, the 'Dental' vaccine are all bacterial in nature and the diseases/illnesses can be treated successfully with antibiotics.

The problems with overvaccination first became evident in cats, as cancer began developing at the injection site. When I was at the vets last time for vaccines, there was a little dog figure drawn in their charts and the point of vaccination was clearly marked on the diagram, so that future vaccines will be given in a different spot. They are also giving more vaccines in the leg, because if cancer does develop, the leg can be easily amputated, thereby stopping the progression of the cancer.

That is a truly scarey thought.

[Maximo]

Originally Posted by kjc

Vaccines against bacterial disease are not as effective as vaccines against viruses. Lepto, Lymes, the 'Dental' vaccine are all bacterial in nature and the diseases/illnesses can be treated successfully with antibiotics.

The problems with overvaccination first became evident in cats, as cancer began developing at the injection site. When I was at the vets last time for vaccines, there was a little dog figure drawn in their charts and the point of vaccination was clearly marked on the diagram, so that future vaccines will be given in a different spot. They are also giving more vaccines in the leg, because if cancer does develop, the leg can be easily amputated, thereby stopping the progression of the cancer.

The problem with Lepto is catching quickly enough to treat, I thought. A couple of days can be deadly.

The vaccination site issue scares me. The boys have been getting all of theirs between the shoulder blades. I hate the idea of giving it in the leg. Max had his last set of puppy shots in his leg (former vet). I thought the risk of cancer is worse when given in the leg. Wish I could remember what was done with our last dog.